Aston Martin question

What I recall reading a while back is AMG will be supplying engines and "technology" to Aston Martin for future vehicles.

For a company as small as AM it probably makes more sense to buy some of these components versus develop in house, especially when you are talking about electronics.

 

See here:

Aston Martin and Daimler sign technical partnership agreements

 

MBZ gets 5 percent of the company for supplying a drivetrain for the next gen AM's; the DB9 is in progress now for the 2017 model year. AM's traditionally have the V12, so it would probably be similar to the V12 in the CL65, which has a 565hp turbo engine. AM should also benefit from being able to scarp its old (tech-wise) single clutch paddle shifts for the AMG version. AMG also has a smaller V8 with 500+ hp they could use as a foundation for the next-gen Vantage

 

In other companies I would say yes this is an issue. I don't think AM is known for their engines as much as they are for their style. I don't think this would have worked out for a company like Ferrari or Lambo, but I doubt this will be an issue for AM. Just think Lotus has been using Toyota engines in their cars for a while.

I just hope AM starts to mix up the styling of their cars a little bit. It is time for something new...

 

The last true Aston engine was the V-8, first introduced in the DBS in 1971 (IIRC)
The DB 7 had a Jaguar AJ16-derived inline 6, and was built on a shortened XJ-S floorpan.
The V-12 was essentially 2 Ford Ecotech V-6's cobbled together. Nicely done, great engine, but not really an Aston Martin engine.

The AMG engines are great powerplants, but there is no more of the romanticism of old.

And where will this collaboration stop? Are we going to see Astons built on MB-platforms, not unlike Crossfires and 300 Chryslers? I hope not, as Aston Martin will end up a badge on a Merc in drag.

Best,

Jack.

 

The V-12 was essentially 2 Ford Ecotech V-6's cobbled together. Nicely done, great engine, but not really an Aston Martin engine.


THIS is still wrong...

 

Why?

 

Key data is based on the mass volume Duratec V6, but they did NOT just put two Duratecs together - it's an exclusively made engine by Cosworth and it's not used for an other car than Aston Martin. That's why it is an Aston Martin engine.

 

Vanquish80 is correct.The basic architecture is that of the Duratec V-6. However, the Aston V-12 is a totally unique engine with little or no interchangeability of components.

 

I met the Foreman of the Windsor Engine Plant, while on vacation, and he said he made it in record time when they were coming out with the DB 9. For a prototype, they physically took two engines and made them into one. Of course, it was only for show.

Joe

 

MB V-12's have worked for Pagani.

 

Agreed, the 2 Duratec engines have become 1 proprietary Aston V-12, with great result and for a good reason too: Short of buying a V-12 from a supplier, Ford chose an in-house path, and constructed a cost-effective exotic engine for its' exotic cars.

That was not my point though: Where will it stop? Is Aston destined to become a Merc in drag? Am I seeing it too dark? I quite like the counter-argument of Pagani, it did indeed work well for them. Keep an open mind when I bring on the Cignet There the coveted badge didn't have enough for it to work.

Where is the cut-off?

Best,

Jack.

 

The basic design architecture may be similar to the v6 but that's where it ends. It all started with three prototype engines arriving from ford USA which were put into db7's with revised chassis legs for a feasability study. Once Ford signed off the project, the engine was developed by Aston, cosworth, ford and a little help from jaguar. All the parts inside are unique to that engine. It uses crack-rods, a steel crank, bespoke cams and pistons and utilises a modine cooler. None of these items are found in fords v6. As far as I can remember, i believe only the PCV valves and oil pressure switch are carried over from the V6..

 

Well, I think as long as AM doesn't sell a CDI car, I'm fine with Mercedes engines.

But tbh - the next Astons will be completely different, inside and outside. This is what I'm kind of scared about.
On the other hand, it's good for the value of my 06 Vanquish.

 

+1. Well said Sir!

Its a common misconception that the Aston Martin V12 is 2 Ford V6's.......

 

Scary proposition there Jack. Good point.

 

Well he was mistaken. He could have just taken one straight out of a DB7 Vantage where they first appeared in 1999, years before DB9.

IMHO the problems are :
My 2013 V12 Vantage Roadster produces 510 BHP and does about 15mpg.
My 2012 C63 AMG Produces 487BHP and does 24mpg.

Both are big lazy torque filled engines, but when an end of line 6.2litre V8 is 50% more fuel efficient, you can see that the V12 is coming towards its end.

Secondly the Aston Gearboxes have been horrors since the Vanquish. Manuals are fine but all the autos and semi-autos have been pretty dreadful. The V12S is brilliant going fast, then you kangaroo around in traffic. Fortunately mine is one of the 101 manuals in the world.

 

"Secondly the Aston Gearboxes have been horrors since the Vanquish. "

Why?

 

Fine changing up, but...very...slow...erm... changing.. no, not yet... down.

New 8 speed vanquish box is apparently much better but I haven't driven one so hearsay on my part.

Semi auto in V12S is not subtle. Need to lift on upshifts and it is rubbish in traffic.

I am biased, mine has a proper gear lever allowing me to exercise my inalienable right to drive in the wrong gear.

reviews of (my) V12 Roadster and V12S on my (non-commercial ,no ads) blog: Cars: We All Fall in Love With Our Models

 

Have you ever tried one ?
The gearbox in the Vanquish works perfectly fine...

 

The vanquish has a temperamental gearbox. i think I understand what the controversy is about , after talking to a few people owning them.

1. Some said its great and they dont get what issues others talk about.

2. some car needs the upgrade to the S sensor. I have seen clutch merely destroyed by an owner complaining aboout his shifting but not going to the shop to fix it until its too late

3. some cars are badly in need of clutch retraining

4. Some cars , like mine, had a manufacturing issue with the flywheel preventing full contact and promoting premature wear of the clutch. My clutch felt sloppy despite only 6000 miles.

conclusion: the vanquish is a a "hand made" car with all its quirks but when properly attended to should be great and crips no matter what year it is.

As my car is getting the treatment by an extremely competent tech on these cars, I'll let you know how a looked after clutch feels next spring