NEW DINO

I don't think it's smaller, if you line the wheels up they look to be the same proportions, looks more like an SP.

 

Looks to me like the mule that did the rounds two years ago - probably even one of the same photos.....

 

I understood for some while that the Dino concept has been canned. In fact SM confirmed the other day that they would never sell a 'cheap' Ferrari.

It's not happening unless they adopt the badge for a V6 version of the Cali.

 

That doesn't look cheap to me.

 

Mmm, No, because it's effectively a 488/458 you're looking at.

 

To me it's a V6 twin turbo mule. But who knows?

 

And the talk is a new SUV? But they wont make a Dino? They had Dino race cars back in the day of F1 or F2 or whatever that was with big Ferrari decals on the front fenders for Gods sake!

 

Without wishing to go over old ground, Ferrrai have clearly stated they won't do a cheap Ferrari. A Dino would have to sit below the Cali in price terms and thus be in direct competition in the most hotly contested segment of the sports car market at what, for Ferrari, would be a cheap price, in contradiction to what SM has stated. Mind you he also once said never an SUV. . They would also have to build another factory somewhere to handle it so it's hardly a compelling business case at thin margins, not what Ferrari are used to. All I am saying is it's not happening soon, it simply cannot, they have their hands full.

 

Makes sense.

Leads to another question though...they are trading at nearly 40 PE, so growth ahead is expected. Sure, they can milk more profit per car with more tailor-made ego slathering, but at some point they are going to have to ramp up the numbers. And they are going to have cut emissions and fuel consumption.

One solution to that puzzle (growth, lots of units to offset higher consumption/emission cars, lower fuel usage/emissions itself) would be to come up with a new "starter ferrari" that is smaller, lighter and less powerful than the V8 GT. I'm not clear on what other options they have for meeting the ever-tightening fuel/emission numbers as a small high-end manufacturer with heady growth goals. I also don't think a smaller intro level car would "dilute" the brand. That fear existed with the Cali, and it seems to have worked out okay. Besides, if the brand didn't jump the shark with amusement parks, its likely pretty safe

 

They will soon have two models of California which in turn could spawn a VS to add to,the existing numbers.

They will surely have their FUV in the near future.

Those two together, with all the other models will get them well over 10,000 and as for emissions, all these cars will be hybrid as we already know.

 

I wonder if a Ferrari SUV will compete too directly with the Lusso?

 

Yeah, true. (I've never seen "FUV", is that sorta like an SUV?).

Still...when they get to 10,000 (I actually think the V8 GT coupe and SUV get them there and beyond), how do they get to 20,000? Make 3x the 488? I dunno...seems like they need more models (like Maser had to do, albeit with higher numbers). I realize going from low teens to 20k is a problem for another day, but given their absolute capital numbers, their ability to pay for another platform more than once a decade is unclear. So I suspect they best have a plan for that formulating now...

 

How many times do I have to say it. A Dino is NOT a Ferrari!

 

I suppose Ferrari will launch New "Dino" (whatever they call it in the future) model next year Geneva motor show! Cuz it's a such big event they must launch a brand-new model like they always did in the past years.

 

They already have a completely new model this Fall (the California successor, if not replacement), and the 488 may begin to feel the competition pressure - so my guess would be for the 488 Speciale or GTO or whatever it will be called to be unveiled at Geneva.

 

Well, the Cali was unveiled at Frankfurt motor show 2008, just few months later they launched 458 at Geneva 2009, so it does make sense if they launch another new model next year Geneva

 

Internet tells me the California was Paris 2008 and the 458 Frankfurt 2009, so that's one full year between them.
(Paris and Frankfurt are every 2 years, they do not happen the same year; there was no Frankfurt show in 2008).

 

I thought it was well established, Cali this year and 488VS next? Forget the imminent arrival of a Dino, not happening.

 

makes sense

 

If I was in charge I would launch the dino as a sub brand hybrid with a view to going all electric when regulations need. Still charge circa 150k usd base
Would sell lots, less controversial than the 4x4 and give them somewhere to experiment with new tech.
On top of that I would make the first version a 2.4 v6 hybrid manual that is more pretty than aerodynamically efficient. I'm sure they could sell 5k globally easily if they get it right

 

They could easily get 550hp from a mild turbo 6 - The car would make a serious alternate
to the R8, NSX and 911 turbo crowd. Also wouldn't take away from Ferrari's other cars IMO

 

I think the issue for Fiat is : do they want to start another brand.

Right now they support Fiat (albeit minimally), Alfa, Maserati and Ferrari. Do they really need another brand or should they put the resources into what they have.

What would be really cool is if they added a new low cost X 1/9 to the Fiat line and a replacement to the 4c in Alfa that goes up against the Mac 570s. Fiat is despairate for something new. A tweaking of the 500 is not the answer.

But they won't.

My feeling is they believe the market is full of $150+k 2 seat sports cars with the 570s, the 911, Audi R8, the NSX, and the new Corvette mid engine. They would rather stay above as these groups cannot sell a car over $300k.

 

Cross posting this from the thread in the 458/488 section where this topic is also being discussed:

I agree, another brand makes no sense.

That said, I believe most posters (edit: not all, as indicated above) do not mean "another brand" when they say "dino". They think of it as another ferrari model. I know technically Dino was a brand and not a ferrari model...but the perception by most is the opposite.

So...the question is more accurately stated as: "is adding a car below the current ferrari offerings a good idea in terms of growing sales and profits?"

My personal guess, is that given their high PE and implied growth expectations, more models are going to come...slowly but surely. An SUV type offering? Yup. A lower cost entry level to slot below the V8 GT? Perhaps (in 10 years or so). Even a four door or sedan 2+2 would not surprise me eventually. Being a stand-alone, publicly traded company with a heavily watched stock is going to have impacts in ways that history would not support.

(wrt Ferrari's views on the "$150k" sports car market, I doubt they will sell a car at that price point. The 488 is now routinely $300k MSRP. The Cali is routinely $250k MSRP. Given that another car is 7+ years away most likely, the price point for an entry level car would be well into the $200s is my guess ($200k today + inflation). I also don't think Ferrari has religion about price point per se. I think they are going to have to find growth, and growth beyond simply selling more options on their current cars and certainly not solely via selling more of their current line-up.)

 

I agree the price point for entry level will be 200k base when it ends up arriving in a few years time.
That's still high enough to easily badge it as a Ferrari. Sergio is all about growth and will push boundaries