Singapore may not renew contract

not going to miss it.
The only reasons I liked this GP was
- because it broke Mercedes dominance
- it was at a decent time

 

Hold off; weren't we told that because of the hybrid engines it's a good thing, and going back to exciting things will drive them away? Surely with the hybrid engines manufacturers want to keep playing at F1 so they can develop their Hybrid stuff?

And surely cities/countries will want to keep playing many millions to keep hosting races? Especially with fewer people turning up, meaning it won't be so busy at the airport/public transport etc.

This is completely baffling to me. I will not stand for this. We must keep with the current Power Unit set up at many millions per year. No one really likes them but it's the reality, and even though the big manufacturers may even leave now, we'll just somehow force the small teams to keep spending huge amount of money they don't have for these engines.

Wait...

 

well, lets be honest. SIngapore only got the attention because it was the world's first ever night race. The cars looked good under the lights. Other than that, the track is really really horrible and boring. In fact, Formula One as a hold is boring. It's a dying sport, and i think countries are not interested to invest and host anymore races as there is no new fans..heck, they can't even retain the current ones.

It's not a new thing and i think as long as Bernie and the current management of the FIA is in power, things will continue to go south.

 

Looks like Bernie is already angling to buy back Liberty's share for half price.

 

Bernie isn't the problem. He was against the current rules but the FIA set about these engines anyhow, with support from Mercedes and Renault.

 

The momentum for the series cannot be good with the 'new' Monaco giving up. I guess Bernie could try a new power phrase - Making F1 great again LOL

Liberty is going to regret this purchase?????? F1 is fast becoming a series in denial about its future or survivability. Oh wait Baku will be the new Monaco LOL!

Time will tell as always.

 

Bernie does much his negotiating via sometimes bizarre media comments. If you've been following him long enough, you realize he shows his cards early and often, whether as offers, threats, bluffs, or even terms.

If most cases, he gets other parties to react, if not respond. For Singapore, my God that weekend is one of the jewels of the "new/latest" Singapore, to a degree much bigger than Montreal it gets the entire nation-state behind it enthusiastically, and draws people from far and wide. I'd be surprised if the promoters/government would let the GP go, even if it's being run at a slight economic loss.

 

To be honest it's not a great venue to see the race. It's still freaking hot and humid at 10 pm and the support races are worse.

You can't see much of the track from any but the best seats.

I would get rid of it in favor of another race in Europe for sure. It's served its purpose

 

the formula needs more exciting cars and more competion on the track.

That would solve everything.

 

I won't miss Singapore it it's off the calendar in future; I never liked that track.

 

I agree with all that....BTW Monaco is the same but worse, but with better weather. As with most F1 tracks, the best "seats" are the ones where you can see the big screen

My point was the "prestige factor" for Singapore is still quite high, and the economic impact to the state is huge. Singapore is also a much, much better "corporate hospitality" destination for the week prior and after, much much more so than Shanghai (track is miles from town), Fuji, Suzuka, et al....every time I've done Singapore, it's been a 2 week ordeal with business on either end, interrupted with an F1 event in the middle.

As for racing, I agree....meh. If and when F1 becomes about the actual racing again, well, then I"d say Singapore is interesting but not relevant.

 

I hear on the grapevine that Malaysia may be ditching its F1 race too.

Sepang should still see plenty of action, from trackdays alone.

F1 is a sinking ship in this uncertain economic climate. Nothing wrong with countries wanting to play it safe.

 

It is the most boring race of the year when you watch it on the tv.

 

Ding Ding - winner!!! Bernie being Bernie again. I think this is to show Liberty that they need him more than he needs Liberty....

 

Screw them all..i hope f.1 implodes....maybe then when all the voltures leave someone who cares about the sport will bring it back to life.

 

Seen in CAR magazine.

Apart from Singapore, the Canadian, Brazilian and German GPs are under threats after 2017.

All these tracks and organisers are losing money because of the declining audience.

Montreal and Interlagos haven't upgraded their facilities as Ecclestone wanted and are threatened to get dropped from the calendar. There is a tug of war between the organisers and Ecclestone. Let's see who blinks first ! Can he really lose 2 GPs on the American continent?

Hockenheim can only afford to host a GP every 2 years, but the Nurburgring refuses to alternate with them. The future of the German GP is at stake.

Also, the Malaysian authorities would like to review their contract because of poor sale; only 40,000 tickets sold this year for 120.000 seats available. The government has been backing the organisers since the begining, but now thinks it should stop.

The F1 calendar could shrink dramatically in future years.

 

F1 including Bernie have driven this themselves. Take a long look in the mirror Bernie and FIA. You 'own' this mess. Period. NO product no sale, no show and no series. Frankly no loss either.

Life has cycles and the life cycle of F1 appears to be in transition to fade out/burn out. One can hope renewal is on the cards next year. I doubt it but we can hope. If it fails we all have lives with other options. I wont shed a single tear.

 

The irony is that the more participants pour money into it (Mercedes, Honda, Renault), the more F1 is in trouble.

F1 is certainly burning itself out now, and after years of increased audience and interest across the world, the business is hitting a bump.

Many countries were interested in hosting a GP, which was a novelty for them, but the public interest couldn't be maintained in places with no motor racing tradition. Once a country is on the map, once a town has its share of tourism, it doesn't want to keep paying exorbitant sums of money to stay on the F1 calendar. That's the bottom line.

Less GPs, will mean surely less revenues from TV rights, so less money to distribute to the teams too. Less exposure may give cold feet to some team sponsors or even manufacturers.

So F1 may have to cut his cloth according to its means, adopting rules for less expensive cars, cheaper power units, etc... Dare I say that becoming a specs series is staring F1 right in the face. Years ago Indy went that way to stay in existence; Europe laughed at it then ...

 

Mate the mess is all thanks to the green mongering of the FIA and Mercedes/Renault making a fuss. Mercedes will leave in a few years (as a team), Renault you'll never know and they'll go with the flow anyhow. It's cheaper for them to be an engine supplier.

Bernie was against the engines, but in the end he's powerless, he can't rule with an iron fist on some matters as teams/FIA all get votes.

They'll realize at some point, hopefully very soon, that this engine formula simply doesn't work. The FIA only cares about their green agenda, they own a 1% stake in FOM so for them hundred million more or fewer viewers doesn't matter that much, it doesn't affect their $$ that much.

GP2 engines (4 liter V8 at 10K RPM) cost 150K per engine and have a life of 4500km. Lob a few cilinders on it, increase RPM to 12-13K, unit cap at 200K. Time for a change. And quick.

Tag, Mecachrome, Cosworth, Ferrari, Honda, Judd...they can all develop an engine quickly and cost effectively. Williams can sell a KERS unit (for teams that use customer engines) cheaply as they have one developed already. Who cares what Mercedes does, a team many believe will leave end of 2018. And who cares about Renault for that fact, and do they care? They bought Lotus for the grand total of **** all, they can either leave or go with a much cheaper engine, which reduces cost for them. They're already in Formula E anyhow that's where they'll develop their greenpeace engines.

All that's left to do after is fix the front and rear wings to simply units (free of design just no elements. Whatever shape they want with a gurney flap for adjustment, that's it).

Yes we'll lose a team or two (IF they go through with it...those teams are Renault and Mercedes), but we'll gain a number of things:

*Viewers
*Exciting racing
*fantastic noise
*Even more viewers
*More teams (not necessarily manufacturers)
*Sponsors
*An exciting product that owners of exciting race tracks want, because they can make money of it

It's very simple. Hybrid engines, no noise, not being allowed to overtake, dumb rules and stupidly expensive/complicated wings do not make good racing. That's why everyone is running away. Fix that and you have a product that people want to see, and pay money for, and thus sponsors want to be associated with it.

 

I have no problem adding the teams to this mess. None at all. They all own a large piece.

 

It's news to me that Mercedes could leave F1 at the end on the 2018 season.

I don't know about Ferrari, but I believe that Mercedes, Renault and Honda have a contract with FOM 'til 2020 at least (maybe 2020, I don't remember exactly).

That's how Mercedes is in the Strategy Group. When Renault bought Lotus and asked to be in the Strategy group, it had to sign an undertaking to stay in F1 for a number of years before being accepted. When Honda came back to F1 just a few years after closing its team, FOM also insisted in having a contract.

Also, engine suppliers must give notice if they withdraw from F1. F1 has suffered in the past from car manufacturers leaving at will with not much notice, and now FOM closed that facility for them.

So, unless there is an earthquake in F1, 3 of the engine manufacturers are committed to F1 for some time, as far as I know.

 

Oh yes. Not sure who voted what exactly, but discussing the aero matters it came down to more of it and more complicated. It's as if they enjoy all this.

I do not blame Red Bull completely, their aero department is of course the strongest, why would they vote against it?

This is why F1 needs a guy such as Ross Brawn, a highly respected technical man who has the ear (and respect) of both the teams and the FIA, and make a case for it. Allowing all these teams to vote for new rules is just stupid, they vote by how they're told to vote. Toro Rosso obviously would vote whatever Red Bull tells them to. Sauber does as they're told by uncle Ferrari. Manor, Force India, Williams do what they're told by ze germans and so on.

In the end, what's good for the sport is good for the teams as well. More exciting racing and cars means more sponsors and money from FOM, and reduced cost works in their way massively as well, except for the top teams with stupid money (Mercedes, Red Bull and to 95% as much, Ferrari). Doesn't work against them either, but what does Mercedes care about 100 million more or less?

It's believed by well known F1 figures that Mercedes wants to offload their factory team by that time. All their major contracts end by then, and the way the team is structured definitely allows them ''to leave''. Look at Aud/VW in Le Mans/Rally. They've won everything, and now leave (the scandal of course works in their favour). Now that others are winning again, why would they continue to poor hundreds of millions into Le Mans? Only to be told and reminded every year for 24 hours how they're not leading? They leave Rallying on a high, as winners. Don't even have to risk losing now.

It's the same for Mercedes. Next year Red Bull will be even closer and perhaps can even beat them. The year after, who knows? Perhaps Ferrari finally has their act together and Mclaren as well, it's best to leave as winners before everyone starts talking about how bad it's going. Mercedes was never in it for the long term (as a manufacturing team, engine is an entirely different story). They bought the WDC in 2009, put in Schumacher and hired all the best people they could. They knew their engine/car would be the best for 2014, that's how they convinced Hamilton to join them.

 

I don't think the ACO (the WEC promoter), and the WRC have ever imposed bidding contracts on their participants. So VW/Audi can leave as it suits them. People come and go in endurance and in rallying; that has never been a problem. The entry list is always over-subscribed.

In the case of F1, the promoter is FOM with Bernie Ecclestone at the head. Bernie has seen enough constructor teams leaving at short notice (Honda, Toyota, Renault, BMW) and the devastating effects they leave behind. Becoming wiser, Bernie started to impose contracts committing the new constructors to stay for a certain minimum duration.

For Mercedes, and Renault, it was the condition which allowed them to be members of the Strategy Group, with Ferrari, McLaren and Williams. Why would Mercedes want to be part of the inner sanctum of F1 if it doesn't intend to stay? The Strategy Group deliberates the technical rules for the next formula. Why being part of it if you don't want to be part of the next formula?

Honda is also known to have signed a duration contract with FOM which should make them supply another team next year - after 3 years grace. Dennis objected to that, wanting to keep exclusivity, but I could be interesting to see who will want a Honda engine soon.