When is it too much horsepower? What will they do next?

My understanding that manufacturers are already deep into the development of the hover car.

 

I've been thinking the same thing lately. Cars today are available with 5-600 horsepower and you can't really use it on the street.

 

"What will they do when horsepower is maxed? "

Have torque wars!!!

 

It is hard to extrapolate more than a few years out based on history. Think back to what the world was like in 1955, and then today 60 years later. Someone from that time would only be speculating what 2014 would be like. Likewise, we can only guess how those in 2075 will live like or what technology they will have available.

In the shorter time frame, I think you will see an increase in electric power aiding an IC engine, but more to improve fuel economy than increase perfromance. But that system will inevitably add weight. So you will have more powerful and heavier cars as manufacturers paint themselves into a corner.

The horsepower of sports cars of fifteen years from now may very well make the same power as today or probably less, but it will be a different car and more entertaining. Probably higher-revving, cleaner-burning, considerably greater mpg, and likely lighter as materials improve. Ultimately power can become a political issue, it can be reduced directly by law (unlikely) or by slowly strangling the manufacturers with tighter emissions or fuel economy standards.

IMO, there is still much that can be achieved with materials and design. Almost everything could be lighter than it is today, and as more exotic materials become affordable, you will see their use increase. As long as the car passes safety tests, the only limit to how light the car can be over an F1 car today is the budget and what minimal equipment the customer requires.

Basically to summarize, we might get slightly more powerful and heavier, before going less powerful and much lighter. A 500 hp, 1000kg car would probably be more fun anyway than a 1000 hp, 2000 kg car.

 

Next step is to start lightening them. We've already seen this on the porkier cars lately such as the new Mercedes SL, Range Rover and Mustang.

 

its a personal choice as to where you draw the line in the sand.

For me performance beyond what we had in the late 90s is superfluous. I dont need a car faster than my Gen II Viper or my Dinan M Roadster. Both were as fast as I ever need to go.

 

Yes, personal choice, and one's choice is going to be driven by equipment and ability to both control it and make effective use of it. When I went looking for the answer to this question on the C6 corvette platform, I decided my limit based on advice from Lingenfelter that they get significantly harder to control past about 650hp. So I settled for 600hp and loved it, enjoyed it here and there but never pushed the car anywhere near it's full potential. Someone who really knows how to drive would say it was enough at stock.

 

Only when you can leave two black lines leaving an apex to the breaking point of the next corner - will you have too much horsepower.
And that would mean we would need better tires and then we could start over again!

 

In 1987 with the F40 we thought that the limits are reached, in 2004, the F430 was released with 490 hp.
In 2002 an Enzo Ferrari came out with 660 hp, in 2016, the 458 successor will be launched at this performance level.
Today a LaFerrari shows us that more than 900 hp are possible. I would say the next 15 years with an increase in horsepower are secured.

I fear the limiting size will not be the horsepower, rather the model designations.

 

This is why I am looking at the Alfa 4c. My old 246 Dino gt had 185 HP and was a blast to drive on city streets without the cops taking my license away every five minutes or me constantly looking over my shoulder.

In my 458, you can break every speed limit in 1st at the red line. I actually had a cop stop me once for accelerating "too fast". Not breaking the speed limit -- just accelerating too quickly. He gave me a tongue lashing. Where is it a law against accelerating "too quickly"? Reckless driving? That's WAY more points than speeding.

If you can't use the power to have fun on the streets where you spend 99.9% of the time behind the wheel, what's the point? I think this will be the deciding factor. People will just say "I don't need it because I'll never use it" and car makers will all settle down around the 3-4 second 0-60 range.

Cruising down the boulevard at 30 MPH in a 1000 HP machine is the height of posing.

 

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/special-projects-concept-cars/401864-scg-003-scg-003c-formerly-known-p-33-a.html

This is next.

 

I thought the same and then I found out it is against the law in Massachusetts. Years ago I got a ticket in my GTO for just that offense (I forget the exact terminology). I fought it in court and lost.

 

I think we have long passed the point when anymore HP has any benefit on the road. In fact, I would argue that today's HP has lead to weight increases and a lot more electronic nannies so that the power can be put down. There are very, very few drivers who can fully extract the benefits of 400HP in a 3K pound car. I'm not one of them even though I have quite a bit of track experience.

I'm old enough to remember the 1st HP war of the 60s and early 70s. Govt. regs and insurance companies killed that one. It could happen again.

Dave

 

Personal jet packs.

 

HP - sells magazines and gives you bragging rights - Torque is what you feel... that press back in the seat - the banchee wail & noise is nice- but torque ... that is what "feels" so good.

frankly in a straight line - 55 MPH and 150 MPH dont really feel that different - the experience of speed is relative to how close you are to objects ... if you were able to do the experiment on a highway - out in the open fields / desert etc... the speeds dont really feel much different... but the way you get (accelerate to those speeds ) that is what makes a car special.

a cars ability to corner is also the defining characteristic.. and its ability to accelerate out of a corner and declerate into a corner is what is so awe inspiring... HP is kind of meaning less other than bragging rights.

Driving a momentum car fast can be just as thrilling as driving a high HP car ... they both can deliver huge eye watering sensations...

 

My cousin got a similar ticket in his 930. IIRC, it was called "undue exhibition of speed".

 

Cars actually get heavier every year as the Govts demand more & more stuff & people want GPS, traction control, cruise control, cupholders etc

US Govt lobbyists are now considering speed limiters at 70 mph for ALL cars so big hp may b pointless soon

 

Cayenne Turbo S !!!! Three tons of creature comforts accelerating under 530fp of torque. It's AWESOME!

 

Who can honestly tame a 730hp F12? not many of us is a Michael Schumacher.
With our high visibility exotics comes a responsability.
Just take a few hotheads and the medias will have a field trip such as the crash & death of the Fast & Furious actor.
High performance cars could easily not be "politically correct" and banned period.
Look to what happened to the Hummer H1/H2 and in France they limit to 100hp motorcycle engines, we could easilly subbish similar fate.

 

what happened to H1 & H2

What if you mod your bike in France, will they dyno it ?

 

I think they'll work on making them lighter and safer and more fuel efficient. For the performance oriented guys I think "muscle" cars will have small efficient power plants (for normal driving) with some sort of KERS system to provide a huge performance boost when desired. Otherwise, the excess power would simply be held in reserve. The concept is similar to what you get with a small turbocharged engine but more extreme and most likely using technology other than turbocharging.

 

As many have said above, the next step is reducing carbom emissions with more hybrid power systems. Also mentioned above is the weight bloat due to regulations and the increase in HP without the "feeling" of going faster.

I like to imagine for a millisecond that manufacturers are going to make their cars more "balanced" and satisfying to drive. A 600HP in a 2000 lb body makes a car that is difficult to control and keep the bodywork undented. Right now computers are driving the cars as a nanny to simulate "balance" and improve drivability *cough GTR*. Like the FRS and BRZ are showing, less HP can be a very rewarding experience with less CO2 emissions. We'll see what the next generations will pay for in car.

Good thought Tim!

 

Anything faster than 0-60 in 4.0 seconds is superfolous on the street, some might say 0-60 in 5.0 seconds.

I would rather drive a 2000 pound car with 300 HP than a 3000 pound car with 450 HP.

 

My vette was 0-60 in maybe 3.5 and was very fun for brief moments. More is always more fun right up until it becomes too difficult to control.