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  #21  
Old 05-18-2017, 06:38 PM
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I think part of the problem with the F type was the transmission. It's an 8 speed and seemed sometimes to get "confused" when trying to decide what gear to select. Shows you how little I know about the Jag - I just assumed it was a turbo. Surprisingly the salesperson didn't correct me. Kind of scary that she didn't know the difference either.

It was a nice car, reasonably priced as well, but it just didn't seem to be "the one".

When I passed on the 2015 Porsche 911 my reasons were two: I just was beginning retirement and didn't want to draw out so much cash. Now I realize my problem isn't how big my asset base is, it's how much time is left on the clock! Or as my son puts it: "Dad, you may not want to invest in LED lights that last 20 years!" He's got a point.

The second reason was that Porsche just introduced a turbo as part of the base 911 package, and I wanted to see if that made a significant difference in the car. Most reviewers since then have been very positive on the turbo engine, suggesting that it fills in the lower end torque and power - something that I admit was a bit lacking during my test drive. On the other hand, I don't know that the difference for my needs is exceptionally significant.

To replace the 2015 with a 2017 similarly equipped will be $30K more expensive. That hurts, but I don't think the car will ever fall to zero, so there will be some residual value, even if it's less than expected. It's going to largely be my children's problem - I'd likely never sell it. Same thing if I get another Ferrari - this time it's got to be exactly what I want since I don't want to go through this again.

The suggestion to consider a manual Aston Martin that's a few years old is a good idea as well. The newer cars aren't that significantly different, the larger engine is nice, but again I'm not looking for top speed, I'm more interested in a finely crafted machine, and I'll adapt to whatever performance level it provides.

So far - Ferrari, Porsche, Aston Martin are in the "cars to consider" pile. I'm mixed on the GT350, but frankly that needs to be there as well. No reason to eliminate possible solutions until I get further into the decision process.

Again, my thanks to all.
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  #22  
Old 05-18-2017, 06:52 PM
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In retrospect, I wish I had given more thought to the Aston Martin or the Porsche. Both would have been ideal.
You can get Vantages all day long under $70k (even under $45k), and Aston apparently offers some aggressive warranties for their older models. If you want a newer manual that is something to consider. They're quick but not blazing fast, handling is nicely weighted, and you can wring it out a bit for some loud noise without going to jail.

I haven't driven a DB9 manual, but they're out there. "JimShadow" loves his. If your knees hurt, some of the comments on the manual DB9 is that the clutch is light to push.
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  #23  
Old 05-18-2017, 06:55 PM
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I would find the nicest, low mileage X50 996 Turbo and snap it up.

I will be buying one as a nice 10-15 year hold soon. Balls fun, HP to the heavens, and I'll bet the appreciation curve is going to be pretty nice.
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  #24  
Old 05-18-2017, 07:00 PM
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I would find the nicest, low mileage X50 996 Turbo and snap it up.

I will be buying one as a nice 10-15 year hold soon. Balls fun, HP to the heavens, and I'll bet the appreciation curve is going to be pretty nice.
One of my favorite commercials ever
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  #25  
Old 05-18-2017, 07:08 PM
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One of my favorite commercials ever
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MCkF19QF7c
Bro. That was epic!

Awesome! Pumped me up lol

The stapler lol 😭😭😭
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  #26  
Old 05-18-2017, 07:10 PM
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The stapler lol 😭😭😭
That's my wife, BTW. She likes practical gifts like appliances. My second son too. A few Christmases ago he wanted an electric pencil sharpener.

I like toys.
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  #27  
Old 05-19-2017, 03:00 AM
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Before twisting yourself in knots over three pedals, consider the better paddles.

The early F1 boxes were like a bear on a bicycle: it's not how well he rides, it's that he does it at all.

But the newer twin clutch boxes are pretty good.

I had serious qualms about giving up the third pedal, but rheumatoid arthritis had me wanting to hedge my bets.
In my case, it's the right knee, but my ankle can still heel & toe the 328.
But for my DD, having the option to left foot brake buffered against the future.
So, with huge trepidation, I got an EVO X MR with the Getrag twin clutch --- the baby brother of the box in a Cali or 456.
This was my first "two pedal" car since '73.

But I'm not finding the twin clutch to be a "disappointment". I still do my own shifting. There are just fewer steps involved.

Not all TCs are programmed equal. The same Getrag from the 456 is used in a Merc -- but tuned less on edge.
(I saw an article online, a while back, exploring why the same box in a Merc seemed "worse".)

That said, you might want to consider a Ferrari California spider. Twin clutch, tiny rear seat, and a Ferrari badge.

If you don't need the folding top and want a cheaper option, there's the Alfa Giulia QF. But that may be just a better M3.
The Alfa has a paddle operated slush box, rather than a twin clutch, but it's reportedly a very good paddle box, and *may* be more reliable.
(There's been a mad rush to TC boxes, resulting in some newer ones with "teething" issues.)

As for the low seats, I do find that a folding cane can be handy for climbing out of the 328.
But then, with the top on, getting out of the 328 was always a bit like rolling out onto the ground and then doing push-ups.

Last edited by DGS; 05-19-2017 at 03:06 AM.
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  #28  
Old 05-19-2017, 10:06 AM
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Get a Maserati GranTurismo. Italian, sounds great, looks great, real back seats you can sit in unlike 911 or AM, soft or hard top, good prices on late models.
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  #29  
Old 05-19-2017, 10:58 AM
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996 Turbo, or Cayman GT4 if you can manage 2 seats.
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  #30  
Old 05-19-2017, 03:34 PM
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Ferrari Mondial T - Valeo
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  #31  
Old 05-19-2017, 04:13 PM
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One of my favorite commercials ever
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MCkF19QF7c
... this from the company founded by the man commissioned by Hitler to make the beetle?
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  #32  
Old 05-19-2017, 04:36 PM
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612, E39 M5, F355

My perspective on these three comes from ownership/ personal experience.

The E39 M5 is probably my favorite of all the cars I've owned. Pretty fast, sounds phenomenal with mild exhaust modification and you can toss it around with traction control off like a sports car. Also vault-like and plenty of room for 4-5 people. You can pick up a nice one for around $25-30k. Repairs expensive but an order of magnitude lower than ferrari running cost.

F355 is a mid-engine screamer, probably a little more analog than your 360, but I've never driven a 360. Nice spiders can be had in the 60k range. Some people like the F1s but the sticks are readily available. I have had mine in for a major for the past few months and I seriously miss the top-down driving with associated sounds and i really miss the shifting, which brings me to the......

612. I've had this beast since october and it's great. I have four young kids and use the back seats all the time. Two average sized adults can sit one behind the other in comfort. The car is almost too fast in a straight line and remarkably nimble. Also, it sounds awesome (mine is 2009 OTO, earlier non-HGTC models were very quiet), and the interior is really rich and smells like a tannery. This car is pretty refined but it likes to play when asked. Sticks are prohibitively expensive so u shoiuld probably stick with '05/'06 if u want to spend $80-$90k or 2009-10 OTO, if you want more features, faster shifting and a bit more power. These are in the $135-$165 range.

Good luck hunting!!

Vic
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  #33  
Old 05-19-2017, 05:05 PM
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lencap, life is too short. Don't compromise one bit unless you quite frankly can't afford it.

I went to a funeral last weekend for my nurses sister. She was 33 and died of a stroke!

You know what you want. You know where you want to be and it sounds like you want it be a Ferrari or you wouldn't be here. There's a stick 360 that's got a ton of miles with an ask of $45k on fleabay. That could be your final option if you want. Buy it and drive it forever.
Don't do the Aston. They british POS. Every idiot I know are buying them for $3x,xxx. They're going to depreciate to $2x,xxx like the DB7. They're essentially Jags. Lead anchors. You're going to see a Ferrari on the road and wonder why you didn't buy it. Test the 612, test drive the 430.. and make the call.

Life is too short to compromise my friend.
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  #34  
Old 05-19-2017, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by greybeast View Post
Sticks are prohibitively expensive so u shoiuld probably stick with '05/'06 if u want to spend $80-$90k or 2009-10 OTO, if you want more features, faster shifting and a bit more power. These are in the $135-$165 range.
Vic
Don't think there is any difference in power. Mine is an 07 HGTC - cruising on freeway I actually wouldn't mind being able to close the exhaust valves... open at 3000 RPM....
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  #35  
Old 05-19-2017, 09:03 PM
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Jes,

Thats funny...I actually do not have the HGT2 exhaust, so i pulled and plugged the vacuum line hoses so that I could hear it while cruising and during downshifts. Its a bit tamer than the sport exhaust.

The power rating is the same for both generations, 540 hp, but some have suggested that the later F133H models may have a bit more power. No clue if it is true.

Love your scag by the way. Probably my favorite spec...silverstone over cuoio.

Vic
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  #36  
Old 05-19-2017, 10:53 PM
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Too funny... Though, the 612 OTO definitely preferred over the 2005-2007. Mid/late 2007 preferred over the 2005-early 2007 due to upgraded Nav/entertainment. The valves are done smarter on the 430 Scuderia (and probably later models) as they open as a function of throttle position and not just RPM...
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  #37  
Old 05-20-2017, 07:24 PM
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I very much appreciate these replies - very useful information and suggestions.

On the way back from a meeting today I just happened to stop at the Ferrari dealer 15 minutes before closing time. They had a very well priced and serviced 2005 F430 F1, under 20K miles, nicely equipped. I read the ad on their site, and was surprised that the car was MUCH nicer than I expected, especially at the price (under $110K). Red/tan as well.

I decided, as has been suggested, that at this stage of my life time is more important than money, and I was ready to buy the F430 from the dealer, only to find that it had sold 90 minutes earlier. I was pretty disappointed, and then I realized - if I was disappointed by NOT having a Ferrari, then maybe HAVING a Ferrari would be the answer to "What's Next?".

So reading more of your posts the suggestions to consider a 612/F430/California seems very reasonable. The problem is comparing them since they're not easily found, and taking Ferraris for test rides isn't all that easy. But, at least that seems like a good place to start.

In terms of pricing I thought that a dealer serviced reasonable mileage 2005 F430 under $110K was a good deal, especially red/tan nicely equipped. Is it hard to find similar cars at that price? FML has the API closer to $135K or so.

On a relative basis, if the F430 is $120K or so, what should I expect for a similar condition 612 or California in today's market? I'd prefer to buy from an authorized dealer, or high quality independent. I'd consider a private sale, but I'm not sure how complete the PPI would be if the independent didn't have access to a Ferrari computer to measure clutch wear, etc.

I also appreciate everyone's help in getting my priority clear and avoiding a rather high probability of severe "buyers remorse" if I brought home a "Pony" car that was the wrong Pony, or buying into a car that had Lucas electronics in it's family tree (it feels good to have my old Ferrari Mojo back).

I'd welcome your thoughts about future depreciation/upkeep costs among these cars. I'm not too concerned about either, but I'd like to know the nuances between 2005-6 F430 versus 2008-9 in terms of upkeep and problems, as well as the same info for the 612 and California. Personal experience is much appreciated, as is the info you've already provided.

I remember years ago when a FCA member graciously gave me a "hot lap" in his car at VIR. I expected the heavy 12 cylinder to be a bit of a "dog" on the track - how wrong I was. It clearly didn't handle like a mid engine V8, but the torque had me laughing out loud. I'd imagine the 612 is similar, but I have no direct experience with that car or the California. The internet is filled with opinions on these cars, but there is nothing more valuable to me than direct owner experience, as well as that from those of you with other first hand knowledge.

Thanks in advance, and I look forward to more constructive ideas/feedback/suggestions.

PS: I'm struggling with the choice of smaller/nimble/sport focused (F430) versus GT (612), or something in-between (California). Any comparisons and/or observations are welcome. I also appreciate the fine comments about F1 versus manual, especially the newer F1 versions.
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  #38  
Old 05-20-2017, 08:59 PM
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Note that most good independents do have the Ferrari computer and can do the exact same thing the dealer can in terms of reading wear of clutch (on F1 cars) etc.
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  #39  
Old 05-20-2017, 11:11 PM
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Lencap, the thread title begins "I miss my 360 3-pedal....". I think the first point in your decision tree might be whether or not it need be replaced with a 3 pedal car. The ferrari options significantly narrow if the answer is yes. Or is the priority that it must be from maranello? That would be A possible way to focus your search quickly.

I find it so much fun hunting for cars that even a complete stranger's pursuit brings me joy. I wish you luck!!
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