Countach, the ultimate supercar

That's the first time I've seen you admit this plainly, if you'd done so earlier we could have saved a lot of discussion, so, all is good

Allan, if only you had a Downdraft, boy would you be singing a different tune, oh man!!

Now I'm utterly confused, I'm speaking of QVs and you're speaking of 25ths, meanwhile are you suggesting a conclusion based on an implication, itself based on the hope that the parts book is correct?

I enjoyed that trip down memory lane, especially Victor chiming in with this image!
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

It would not be.

Correct on both counts, and noteworthy that the factory chose the Carburatori car for FIA Group B Homologation, over the Fuelie. The reason for carbs and not fuel-injection was explained to me in some detail and I'll publish this at some point soon. For now, let's just say it speaks for itself.

Like many people who purchased a Fuelie, you bought that variant simply because it was a good deal at the time - nothing wrong with that. The fact that you got a CGT later on instead of another Countach (Downdraft) offers nothing to prove you do not want a Downdraft, badly, especially now that the attributes of the Downdraft are being higlighted throughout the world. In fact, you've admitted you'd like a Downdraft yourself, and I'm 100% confident that when you purchased your Fuelie, if there was a Downdraft available at the same time for the same price you would absolutely have chosen the Downdraft, no question about that! Why am I so certain? The way you carry on here at FChat in a futile attempt to negate the Downdraft's proven performance superiority over the Fuelie. If you were cool about it, one might think differently.

You are "extremely well versed with all variants of the Countach" ?? Name how many variants of the Countach you have personally owned, operated & maintained? AFAIK, you have owned 2 USA Fuelie Countachs, and not a single carbureted Countach from LP400 to Anniversario, so how exactly can you be extremely well-versed with all variants of the Countach. Experience comes from more than magazine articles and reading things on the internet. Clearly you have little regard for those who have real experience, but just because you come here and pretend to know something doesn't mean its going to be accepted. I think you know a bit about a USA Fuelie Countach, but have never had the occasion to experience the performance of a well-tuned Downdraft extensively. If you wish to speak about Countach experience, I purchased my first one in 1987, an LP500S. Then in 1988 I purchased a Downdraft. After that, I owned every Countach variant that Lamborghini built from LP400 to 25th Anniversario (Fuelies) in multiples of each variant, perhaps 11 or 12 different Countachs spread over almost 30 years. Along the way, I realized that the ultimate Countach driving experience, the single car I missed the most, was that first Downdraft from the late 80s. So I ended up back with a Downdraft, and totally restored it. That's experience of all the variants for you.

Now why on earth would a guy like me take a car that is pretty much the way it came from the factory and compare it with a heavily-modded car like yours? If I have dynoed my car, what meaning would there be in a comparison with a car that has been "experimented with ... everything from headers, exhaust and cam specs, to replacing everything with EFI and distributor-less ignition"? If I want to compare my car, or indeed another standard Downdraft with a Fuelie, it would be with a standard Fuelie, and rest assured, it will happen, all in good time, stay tuned, watch the Downdraft thread closely - I know you will.

The only Kool Aid being served around here Allan, is by you, and some Fuelie owners who are grasping at straws desperate to create the illusion that the variant they have is the same as the Downdraft. Insulting a fellow Countach owner is one thing, but, rmolke85 has owned his Downdraft since before they were a twinkle in your eye, 20 years, to be precise, long long before I discovered that the factory FIA Homologated that variant as they considered it to be the height of Countach performance. The discovery was simply an unexpected reward. I'll repeat what I said previously, if only you had a Downdraft, boy would you be singing a different tune!

Imagine how fast a Downdraft would be if the production cars were all tuned to the same 490 bhp which the Countach Evoluzione was tuned to? I know the answer to that one - they would be timed @ Nardo @ 200 mph. Dreaming and imagining is one thing, the reality of the cars as they were produced is another.

And what a pair those two are!

 

If anyone prefers to carry on this fascinating Downdraft vs Fuelie topic in the Downdraft thread http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/lamborghinichat-com-sponsored-cats-exotics/503457-countach-downdraft.html so that it's in the right venue, please be my guest, I feel sure we have much more to discuss! Otherwise, here is good too.

 

Sorry Raymond, I agree with 99% of everything you post based on your first-hand experience, and we will always be friends but you are 100% wrong.

We have to stop this culture of being Doubting Thomases in the Lamborghini community, especially when one has no personal first hand information.

Have you personally spoken to Messrs Masini, Pagani, Marmiroli, Balboni et al on a first-hand basis and received relevant data & materials from them? You realize that the men behind these machines are all available if one bothers to seek them out?

The Countach Evoluzione was made by the ECO department (Experience Composites) led by Attilio Masini, the car was designed by Horacio Pagani, Luigi Marmiroli oversaw an engine rated at 490 bhp, which, pushing only 980 kg (dry) actually accomplished 328 kph. That translates to 203.81 mph. 60 mph arrived in a scant in 4.1 seconds.

I draw your attention to the fact that besides the Countach Evoluzione's light weight and 490 bhp engine, the car's shape & ground effects were different! You cannot compare it to a standard Countach, and if nothing else, the Evoluzione proves that the Downdraft would actually be faster at the top end than it has been recorded to be.

This will all be in a magazine article and a book upcoming.

So much disrespectful behavior towards the men behind the machines, quite sad. That said, there are some of us who will not let the accomplishments of those men be diminished, in fact, we are here to extol the virtues of their success.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Ask yourself the basic simple question, why would Nuova Automobili Lamborghini SpA itself choose to FIA Homologate the Downdraft and not the Fuelie?

I realize you are are a Countach enthusiast, all respect to that, but you do spout off a lot of meaningless nonsense backed up by absolutely nothing on these threads, I mean, do you make this stuff up as you go along? If you want anyone to take you seriously and learn along the way, perhaps be more open to receiving the wisdom of those who have dedicated their lives to the subject matter.

That's better, if you expect to be treated respectfully, treat others respectfully, especially people who might know more than yourself, from whom you might learn something.

If Marmiroli has your absolute outmost respect, why do you choose to continue disparage his name by not believing the information he has shared supported by material which has in fact been independently corroborated?

This whole Fuelie vs Downdraft thing was started by Fuelie owners trying to disparage the performance superiority of the Downdraft simply because the Downdraft was being revisited upon the discovery of the FIA Homologation papers.

Let’s be clear, I love all Countachs and have no issue with people who accept intelligently received & presented wisdom about the Downdraft for what it is.

But those who disparage the Downdraft’s status simply because they chose the wrong car or donlt have one or whatever, deserve no less than a, shall we say, a perspective review, to put it politely, a reminder of the facts personally culled from the original creative source, as proven by a host of independent entities.

Let’s not confuse factual and useful information with internet knowledge, I know-it-to-be-so, or seat-of-the-pants making stuff up as you go along.

I think Fuelie owners would get due respect for their cars if they behaved respectfully, its a simple two-way street.