Sergio Marchionne details why a Ferrari vintage buyer has been ignored | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Sergio Marchionne details why a Ferrari vintage buyer has been ignored

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by TeamF1Jr, Aug 16, 2017.

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  1. Brian L

    Brian L Formula 3

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    Right. Odd to say this after the flat out lie that PF era input was no longer needed because of the advanced aero needing to be done in house, along with design/

    He's 100% contradicting himself with this new statement.

    A man for all people ! Tell them what they want to hear.
     
  2. KKSBA

    KKSBA F1 World Champ
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    +1 on that. Boy was the modern Testarossa something when it came out!
     
  3. of2worlds

    of2worlds F1 World Champ
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    Ferrari as a small manufacturer ( under 10,000 cars per year ) get a break from the government on some regulations like CAFE standards. Last year the production was less than 8,700 cars. They won't go over the 10,000 cars production number.
     
  4. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!


    There always the rest of the world. Plus if they have to pay more to the US government, they will just raise the price.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  5. intrepidcva11

    intrepidcva11 F1 Rookie
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    Steve, that reads like the direct antithesis of what the Sweater is saying
     
  6. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    Eventually they will go well over 10k - Why ? Because billions in market cap are at stake
     
  7. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    Only if they make serious headway with their fleet combined MPG numbers...
     
  8. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    I believe they can buy credits from other manufacturers like Tesla
     
  9. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    In the USa they can also pay the fine per car which is relatively speaking only a few thousand per car. Yes they cam also buy credits.

    basicaly its a euro only issue.
     
  10. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    There's a PR issue as well. It's not that simple IMO, especially if we're talikg brand value. Who's to say their market cap won't take a hit if they begin to produce in much higher (Porsche) numbers? Or if they throw out the V12? Or if they have to depend on Tesla credits to keep building them? I can imagine the headlines...

    Easier for them to stay conservative, raise prices and keep producing in lower volumes. As long as governments give them that sub 10k break...which won't last long, I think.
     
  11. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
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    Porsche sold 237,778 vehicles in 2016. Ferrari sold something like 8,200 cars in 2016. Ferrari would have to double their sales 5 times over before they hit Porsche volumes. I don't think thats a realistic. I also don't think they will ever lose the V12. I think Ferrari is very attuned to this.
     
  12. -K1-

    -K1- Formula Junior

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    Sergio already said he was going to exceed 10,000 a few earnings calls ago. Amazing that no one listens to these, gives you direct from the horse's mouth information. Thats why they are going hybrid.
     
  13. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Going past 10k units is not a big deal. Personaly brand exclusivity is way down on my list of desireable features in car. Even if ferrari doubled sales it would still be "exclusive" after all that schlocky merchandise 10k units more wont harm the brand

    What people here may not realize is ferrari is struggling to hit 10k units and thats with China and Russsia two markets that didnt exist 10 and 20 years ago. Yes some "new gotta have it" models are in manufactured short supply, as are some specials but most are not. The question then is how do they get to 10k units and then say 20k units while maintaining demmand/tension and concurrent high profit margins.

    From porches playbook More variations of a car they are already making(gt3 GT4) or a new harder core car they can easily make from bits on hand is one way. Hence the raw car for some of us. But that will net maybe another 2-3k units.

    Basicaly after that they can go the dino route, but that wont be as hugely profitable, there are not then other sprotscar niches for them, well maybe a sport classic line as ducati did.

    So the big fish has got to be transforming the Ff into a suv. As the FF/Lusso is really bespoke platform it will be a real ferrari as opposed tot he levante which is like badge enginered nissan.

    i have no problem with a suv as long as we then get some "real" hard core sportscars, somehting hard to find at ferrari dealer since, well maybe the 355.
     
  14. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    How many 991s and caymans did they make.
     
  15. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
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    They don't exactly say. But I believe about 50% of their deliveries are SUVs in one form or another. They do say 32,409 for the 911 and 95,642 for Macan, which they say makes it the best selling Porsche. (roughly 1 of every 2.5 cars! not to mention the Cayenne nor Panamera!).

    https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/company/porsche-deliveries-2016-sales-record-13310.html

    So if Ferrari did a SUV, do you think it would end up representing roughly ⅓ to ½ of their sales? I think no way. Yet, I'd prefer if they didn't make a SUV. That can be for Porsche as they are now a SUV company.
     
  16. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Read in one of the Car mags that a new Dino is def a go. Apparently being built on a shortened version of the next 488 replacement, 2.9 ttv6 600hp.
     
  17. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    I believe it will happen because everyone at Ferrari denies it.

    Take the Alfa 4c CF chassis, stick in the Maserati turbo V6, add a fancy suspension with magnaride, and put on a new plastic body.

    It's not easy but they have most of the elements to go after the Mac 570s and Porsche 911
     
  18. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
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    I read the same thing. I think its in Automobile. Who knows. It could be fun!
     
  19. Smiles

    Smiles F1 World Champ
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    It isn't to most people, but it is to me.

    My 330 2+2 was s/n 9453. Meaning fewer Ferraris had been made up until that point -- in the 30-year history of Ferrari -- than were made in 2016 alone.

    Ferraris really were special in the Enzo era. Beautiful and a bit mysterious, with their two distributors and two oil filters. And a very authentic (and comparatively deep) sound.

    Limited numbers meant that there was something almost gnostic about Ferrari ownership: you needed to know a lot in order to own one, and even more to work on one. You had to be on the inside of that almost mystic knowledge.

    And that gnostic approach really clashed with Classiche when modern Ferrari declared itself to be more expert than the real keepers of the tradition.

    Vintage Ferraris have almost nothing in common with the commercial vision Sergio Marchionne has in mind.

    Matt
     
  20. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Yes but your gnostic ferrari completly dissapeared with the 360 if not the 355. Once they lost the tube frame and went to a unibody, etc they became a car, a little different car to others with great sounding motor and swoopy styling, but really just a car. To drive by then, they were really just car. Since then they have become more powerful but with at, ps and nannies. IMO the feel and the magic got lost somewhere in Lucas time. Even Mclaren have a more interesting tub.

    But then legislation and production costs meant ferraris would inevitably became more mainstream in terms of how they were produced. None of which means every car they make hast to feel so mainstream to drive, or be so simple to drive or look so well pick your word...

    So I hope even if only for marketing brand cred reasons Sergio brings back a he man car with the raw viceral feel from the bygone era, gnostic to drive, even if that car is not gnostic under the skin.

    As for numbers built, once they became so easy to drive with the 360 and even more so latterly, they really just became new cars, and used cars, all the so called rarity collectability of the new ones, thats clever marketing.

    Point is the bespoke special ship sailed 20 or more years ago. Such is the way of things. Still even some of the new cars should look great and drive superb, instead of being an asthetic pastiche and bland to drive.

    We come from different branches of the tree though. Your car is a 2+2 a gt in the grand tradition, A fast comfortable car from an era when there were some fast cars and some comfortable cars, but only ferrari and maybe maserati built cars that did both. Today, well a 488, maserati, even an Alfa not to mention the plethroa of german and even american cars that cover fast and comfortable, in fact faster than can be used.

    Myself I come from the fast charging sunday drive, who cares little about comfort school, its how it goes thats everythign. Ferrari no longer builds such a car, or even a car that covers the viceral feedback specialness that you feel though the seat, pedals, shifter steering wheel, the feedback that seprates a sportscar from a fast sedan.

    Amazingly when it comes to viceral sportscars, porche and even corvette do a bettr job than ferrari now. Heres hoping some of the magic returns in one or two models for both of us..

    the gnostic car today is at Lotus, and they are grerat machines with a great comunity, no one buys a lotus for the "status" . Yet everyone seems to want the horsey badge.
     
  21. RallyeChris

    RallyeChris Formula Junior

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    This.
     
  22. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    The rags say the new Dino starting in low to mid 200's and the 488 sucessor over 300 start. Nothing about a stick or it being anything other than another ferrari Gt.
     
  23. ferrarip4

    ferrarip4 Formula 3

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    And bring back the small 3 liter V12's in a super lightweight chassis!!!!
     
  24. INTMD8

    INTMD8 F1 Veteran
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    True they weren't ordered, it's been said however that the dealers made it nearly impossible to do so at the time.
     
  25. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Hmm...This coming from the guy who wants to increase production, add an SUV...Not buying it :)
     

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