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Old 10-25-2015, 12:06 AM
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Post Countach Downdraft

For some time I have wished to start another thread dedicated to a single variant - the Countachs built @ Sant Agata with the 6 Weber (44 DCNF) vertical twin-barrel carburettors, the 'Carburatori' version of the now-legendary 'Motore Tipo L 507 V4', affectionately known these days to enthusiasts the world over simply as the 'Countach Downdraft'.

Those who love the Countach Downdraft possibly do so because they view it as Ingegnere Guilio Alfieri's stroke-of-genius return to the original Lamborghini V12 Downdraft concept - think Miura. Or simply because it is the most powerful production variant of the Countach ever built by the Lamborghini factory.

The intent of this thread is to provide a resource for the QV DD, to the benefit of the car-community at large with useful information. I will do what I can in my spare time, and I invite all to participate with historical & technical information. We are all here to learn!

This thread has nothing to do with market values, is not being created to boost values, or sell cars. Its simply an enthusiast's resource, nothing more, nothing less. Besides, there are dedicated auction & values threads elsewhere.

I especially thought it essential for me to start a thread on these cars, because recently I have come upon some material that has never been published or shared anywhere, courtesy of some of the men behind the machine in Italy, all of whom have generously supported the effort to uncover the exclusive material.

I humbly propose this thread as a small resource for the Countach Downdraft.

Please enjoy.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg img092.jpg (63.1 KB, 4269 views)
File Type: jpg 6014533376_717e433e53_b.jpg (86.6 KB, 4256 views)
File Type: jpg 86-Lambo-Countach-5000_DV-14-RMA_05.jpg (114.3 KB, 4305 views)
File Type: jpg 20051834362_392f860ba1_k.jpg (48.1 KB, 4189 views)
File Type: jpg 52718_002.jpg (107.1 KB, 4268 views)
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  #2  
Old 10-25-2015, 12:12 AM
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Some of these images below have not been published before. They were given to me by Aaron Kiley who took them in late 1985, after I tracked him down.

The featured car is a 1985 Countach Downdraft, and the test took place at the Ford Motor Company Proving Ground (MPG) @ Romeo, Michigan.

Its a treat to regard a nearly-new car unmodified and by all manner of DOT appendages. In that regard, these images serve as a reference.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Countach_DED-exterior detail_14_Lo9.jpg (114.7 KB, 4284 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_A-OVH CCA-04_Lo9.jpg (141.0 KB, 4269 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_A-OVH CCA_23_Lo9.jpg (115.0 KB, 4318 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_A-testing_05_Lo9.jpg (145.6 KB, 4226 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_A-testing_06_Lo9.jpg (111.4 KB, 4268 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_APA_Pans-08_Lo9.jpg (107.0 KB, 4193 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_APA_Pans-09_Lo9.jpg (126.7 KB, 4249 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_D-Instrument panel_16_Lo9.jpg (128.7 KB, 4146 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_D-interior_15_Lo9.jpg (133.4 KB, 4221 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_D-interior_18_Lo9.jpg (133.4 KB, 4126 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_D-Radio-pub231_Lo9.jpg (90.2 KB, 4115 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_DED-exterior detail12_Lo9.jpg (168.0 KB, 4120 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_DED-exterior detail_13_Lo9.jpg (157.4 KB, 4192 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_S-rear-21_Lo9.jpg (111.8 KB, 4027 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_S-Static Rear_20_Lo9.jpg (116.2 KB, 4088 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:15 AM
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Frankie's goes to school, in a Countach, changing his life forever!
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File Type: jpg Countach_T-School_10_Lo9.jpg (168.7 KB, 4007 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:16 AM
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All open salon shot at the Proving Ground
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File Type: jpg Countach_S1-Static doors open07_Lo9.jpg (157.4 KB, 4016 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:17 AM
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The many uses of duct tape.

"Tape Please!"
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File Type: jpg P_CarDriver Sherman Idzikowski Csere Griffin_Lo9.jpg (130.2 KB, 3951 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:19 AM
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A few more of Aaron Kiley's images
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File Type: jpg Countach__A-OVH CCA_pub230_Lo9.jpg (127.1 KB, 4011 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_D-shifter_17_Lo9.jpg (88.4 KB, 3842 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:20 AM
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Last two images, a staged scene for fun.
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File Type: jpg Countach_S-umbrellas_pub28_Lo9.jpg (149.1 KB, 3940 views)
File Type: jpg Countach_S-umbrellas_22_Lo9.jpg (159.4 KB, 3857 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:22 AM
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These are the illustrations defining the car's final road-going engineering specification, as submitted to the Italian Transportation Authority (& other entities worldwide) for type-approval.

I received these documents personally from none other than the Countach Downdraft engine patriarch, Ingegnere Luigi Marmiroli himself.

Marmiroli joined Lamborghini with a background of the Alfa Romeo F1 team, so his approach to the existing platform was that of durability & performance. He was generous enough to empty his treasure-trove of illustrations & diagrams pertaining to the QV DD, some of which I'll post here.

He also clarified the truth behind engine performance output, the QV DD's FIA Homologation, the Countach Evoluzione, and the ill-fated Countach QVX racecar.

Thank you Igegnere.
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File Type: jpg Marmiroli2.jpg (48.4 KB, 3804 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:25 AM
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From the Marmiroli folder
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File Type: jpg Marmiroli1.jpg (84.6 KB, 3717 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli6.jpg (60.8 KB, 3708 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli4.jpg (46.9 KB, 3629 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli7.jpg (74.4 KB, 3676 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli5.jpg (49.4 KB, 3544 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli3.jpg (51.1 KB, 3597 views)
File Type: jpg Marmiroli8.jpg (47.8 KB, 3515 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:28 AM
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Marmiroli interview

I recently interviewed Luigi Marmirolli the resident engineer at Sant Agata during much of the Countach Downdraft's production, by e-mail. Here is how it went:


1. (JS) Stefano Pasini writes in the book he authored on the Countach QV in 1987 that even though the standard output was 455 BHP, many engines saw @ 470 BHP on the test bench even without much tuning. Is this accurate?

(LM) Yes, it's true. Also because there was a team of assemblers whose engines always gave more power by 3% compared to others.

2. (JS) Can you elaborate on the engine used in the Spice-chassis Lamborghini QVX as tested at Monza for David Joliffe & co? I think Mauro Baldi drove. What was the output of that engine?

(LM) Yes. The main changes were:
- Change engine rotation from left to right
- New electronic injection TDD
- New intake system
- New exhaust system
- Dry oil sump
- Capacity improvement

The engine code was 509i
Capacity 5825 c.c.
Power at 7000 rpm 585 HP

See attached:
Drivers and engine photos
Photo of the Monza test in October 1986

3. (JS) Can you elaborate on the engine used in the Countach Evoluzione as tested extensively in 1987, what was the output of that engine? Also, what was the real purpose of that car? To build a special series?

(LM) The purpose of the Countach Evolutione was:
1. Verify the feasibility of a frame made of carbon fiber in comparison with the traditional on steel tubes.
2. Check the on-road performances
3. Check the behavior to crush. This is why the car was subjected to the crush test at MIRA in the UK.

There was therefore no reason to change the engine and also it was a test vehicle.
I had just arrived in Lamborghini coming from Alfa Romeo F1. On F1, for the first time, we employed for the fuel tank, integrated to the frame, the carbon fiber. It was my intention to transfer the same technology to the chassis of the road sports car. Also because the Lamborghini already had a department for the construction of flaps and bonnets in composite materials.

See photos of the chassis and of the engine compartment

4. (JS) Can you elaborate why on Jan 1st 1988 the Countach QV was Homologated with the FIA? Please see attached:

(LM) The FIA approval was based on the standard engine. The FIA approval was to allow to the Countach to compete on the racing track .

Ciao
Luigi

I thank Luigi Marmiroli for this image below from his own library, showing the legendary Countach Evoluzione with its Downdraft engine. All 12 trumpets are an impressive sight.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Marmiroli small.jpg (253.4 KB, 3768 views)
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Last edited by joe sackey; 10-25-2015 at 01:14 AM.
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:32 AM
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180 mph - This 1986 Countach Downdraft was tested in the UK @ Bruntingthorpe (sounds familiar? Top Gear test track) in the summer of 1987 to a terminal velocity of @ 180 mph (the Yamaha FRZ 1000 bike maxed out at 160 mph!) on its 2 mile-long runways. The timing was done with Leitz Correvit Test equipment. These images were made by Andrew Yeadon.
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File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_6 low.JPG (411.6 KB, 3763 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_5 low.JPG (376.8 KB, 3743 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_9 low.JPG (333.4 KB, 3652 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_7 low.JPG (316.3 KB, 3731 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_4 low.JPG (336.8 KB, 3668 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_2 low.JPG (365.4 KB, 3627 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:34 AM
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A fabulous Downdraft I was acquainted with when it was new
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:35 AM
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Last two
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File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_1 low.JPG (376.4 KB, 3572 views)
File Type: jpg Autocar27May87_3 low.JPG (369.4 KB, 3478 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:41 AM
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FIA Homologation

This is perhaps the most exciting document discovery I have made in 25 years of automotive research.

Last month, I discovered that the Countach QV Downdraft was FIA Homologated (# B 291), in the same Group B Class as the 288 GTO (# B 273).

At the end of 1987, upon the production of 200 series Countach Downdrafts, Lamborghini SpA submitted the necessary paperwork to finally Homologate the Countach for competition purposes with the Fédération Internationale de l'Automobile (FIA).

The entry in the FIA's log simply reads:

"B 291 - Lamborghini Countach Quattrovalvole, 5167cc - January 1st 1988"

Most cars Homologated to Group B from 1982 onwards were specifically for participation in the World Rally Championship and international rally events. However, Group B Rally participation was banned at the end of 1986, so all subsequent Homologations for Group B (including the Countach QV) were for participation in GT1 & GT2 classes on closed circuits. Like Ferrari's 288 GTO, the Countach's Homologation became a story of promise unfulfilled, yet it is exciting to know that the this specification of the legendary Countach sufficiently inspired competition intent from its iconic manufacturer.
The 470bhp carburetted Countach Evoluzione tested extensively on the road and at Nardo @ 200 mph motivated Ing. Luigi Marmirolli to file for FIA papers on the basis that a limited run of lightweight QVs would be built for GT1 & GT2 in 1988. Sadly, by then Patrick Mimran had decided to sell Automobili Lamborghini to Lee Iaccoca's Chrysler, and the whole idea was shelved in favor of a tilt at F1 involvement.
As with Ferrari's 288 GTO (B 273), the 85/86/87 Countach QV Downdraft (B291) is a genuine FIA Homologation car, a member of the exclusive club of 'Killer Bees'.
To the faithful, the FIA documents are the ultimate in terms of sporting approval for the variant they love. Supercar provenance simply does not come any better.

Not only are the Homologation papers a revelation for Countach owners everywhere, but they are also a treasure-trove of information in that they are a source of all aspects of the car's technical specification, including gear-ratios, output numbers & materials used, confirmed by an independent entity.
I have all 16 pages of the FIA Homologation papers, the originals given to me personally by Louis Quiniou the FIA Sporting Coordinator based in Geneva, to whom I am very grateful and wish to extend my thanks yet again. The trouble it took to get these papers was not inconsiderable!

Also special thanks to Ingegnere Luigi Marmiroli for helping establish what happened.

I won't bore you with all 16 pages, here are just the first 4, I have an original set saved away
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File Type: jpg *FIA LOUIS.jpg (11.5 KB, 3312 views)
File Type: jpg *FIA P1.jpg (78.9 KB, 3352 views)
File Type: jpg *FIA P2.jpg (78.2 KB, 3324 views)
File Type: jpg *FIA P3.jpg (65.1 KB, 3268 views)
File Type: jpg *FIA P4.jpg (69.1 KB, 3254 views)
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:50 AM
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The full list of Group B cars can be found on this website:
Grand Touring Sports Cars - Racing Cars

In spite of the 1988 Homologation and any hopes for a competition version, once Mimran sold the factory to Lee Iaccocca & Chrysler, plans for the Countach (bar the 25th Anniversary version) were shelved
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:53 AM
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Another man arrived around the same time to help shape the end of the Countach era
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:54 AM
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Another of my favorite images is Valentino overseeing a Downdraft engine sing at full volume!
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Last edited by joe sackey; 10-25-2015 at 01:16 AM.
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:56 AM
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Nuccio Bertone received a production Downdraft which Bertone SpA kept in its Museo
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:57 AM
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Bertone SpA used it in advertising the company
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Old 10-25-2015, 12:59 AM
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Countach Downdraft factory brochure
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File Type: jpg Scan 152180007.jpg (145.3 KB, 3192 views)
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