Titanium Intake for the Murcielago | FerrariChat

Titanium Intake for the Murcielago

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by white out, Sep 26, 2016.

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  1. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #1 white out, Sep 26, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    After success making more power with smooth intake tubes for the Huracan, Gallardo and R8 V10. The itch was to strong to do the same to my Murcielago and I finally couldn't take the factory intake hoses anymore. Time for the accordion to GTFO, but there was a problem, it was going to be a complete PITA and stupid expensive to make the intake out of silicone tubes. So I decided to go another stupid expensive route, pie cut titanium.

    Here's some video clips from the dyno. Mears are still bleeding from the DTP exhaust. lol

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcLuUdMeDjY"]Lamborghini Murcielago LP640 on the Dyno - YouTube[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atofi99S78A"]Lamborghini Murcielago LP640 on the Dyno - YouTube[/ame]
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  2. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #2 white out, Sep 26, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. hashiriya

    hashiriya Formula Junior

    Feb 26, 2010
    351
    Great effort!

    Titanium has a very low thermal conductivity which makes it good for pipes, or ideal if it's a 2-layer titanium pipe (hypothetically).
    :)
     
  4. Hola! That's incredible!
     
  5. hashiriya

    hashiriya Formula Junior

    Feb 26, 2010
    351
  6. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    That was one of the reasons for choosing it.

    Thanks!

    I love that car.
    My car is about 720hp at the engine (figuring 18% drivetrain loss.) So the 6.2 with those modifications could easily hit 650ps (640hp). Based off the engine shots, it looks like an '02/'03 motor.
     
  7. rbf41000

    rbf41000 Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2005
    676
    Charlotte NC
    Full Name:
    Russell
    Yes it looks like a 6.2 engine from the pictures, notice the oil filler is on the engine where the 6.5 is only on the tank.
     
  8. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

    Aug 18, 2007
    5,079
    CANADA
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    Olivier


    congratulations

    where did you post the model & results for the Gallardo ?
     
  9. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #9 white out, Oct 3, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    It is only for LP Gallardos (2009+). There are threads discussing the intake on LamboPowrr and R8talk.

    Here's info for the V10 intake:
    On 91 octane, the intake increases peak power by 15hp (13whp) along with a nice power bump in the middle of the powerband. The torque gains are similar. The Gallardo Intake replaces the factory accordion intake hose and is constructed of 4-ply silicon. The intake reduces air turbulence, amplifies the engine's intake sound and makes throttle response quicker.
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  10. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #10 white out, Jan 11, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I am doing further development with the intake on my car and have removed the air boxes and fitted 4 K&N cone filters to the titanium tubes. The fresh air inlet to the factory air box is 4.5" and the throttle bodies are 3" in diameter each. So there is a bit of a restriction in the factory box on the coupe. With the box removed there is a lot of volume in the fender and it is still fed by the 4.5" fresh air duct. The roadster is a maze in comparison to the coupe.

    The car feels MUCH faster and has better throttle response in real world driving conditions with the individual filters. I strapped the car on the dyno and the carbon engine covers don't create a good enough barrier while the car is not in motion, which allows the filters to suck in hot air from the engine bay and as a result the car retards timing, so the dyno testing is useless. Next up are some vbox tests to see if there are power gains in the real world besides what my butt dyno says.
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  11. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #11 white out, Jan 11, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Also, my fabricator made a jig that feeds the inside of titanium intake tubes with with a gas to for better heat transfer properties and to reduce oxygen while welding. Now he gets cleaner beads with a smoother interior surface and some great colors. Each set requires 13 hours of fabrication, but the new intakes are a piece of art.
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  12. teak360

    teak360 F1 World Champ

    Nov 3, 2003
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    Scott
    Those are just beautiful.
     
  13. BlueBiturbo

    BlueBiturbo F1 Rookie

    May 19, 2004
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    Those are truly a work of art. Amazing.
     
  14. BlueBiturbo

    BlueBiturbo F1 Rookie

    May 19, 2004
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    Do you consider 3D printing this part? I guess it will be made from a different kind of metal.
     
  15. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    I haven't considered it. This is a super low production item and each intake built specifically for each order, which has its own unique flavor. If this was a part with higher production figures, then it would definitely be worth looking into other manufacturing options.
     
  16. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    A little update:
    the car went on a mustang dyno and put down 719whp.
    vbox testing resulted in a 7.65 second 60-130 run.

    Mods: titanium intake with K&N cone filters; primary deletes; DTP exhaust (secondary & muffler delete); and 2WD conversion. Using 91 octane.
     
  17. BlueBiturbo

    BlueBiturbo F1 Rookie

    May 19, 2004
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    619 wheel HP?
    Assuming 15 percent loss that is 728HP at the crank
     
  18. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #18 white out, Jan 25, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    612whp on dyno dynamics
    719whp on mustang dyno
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  19. BlueBiturbo

    BlueBiturbo F1 Rookie

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  20. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    Nice project.

    The reason you have better throttle response is because airflow is greatly improved. The plastic ''flexi tube'' thing with it's many ribs in it is **** for smooth airflow.

    If you can, could you post some drive by video's and cockpit mounted video during a drive? Would be interesting to hear any difference in intake noise :)
     
  21. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    The response was better when switching from the flex tube to the Ti. But after swapping the airboxes for cone filters, the results were even greater. These engines are definitely starved from the factory.

    I will get some video soon. The most noticeable intake sound is highway driving with the windows up. With the windows down my exhaust overcomes the intake's acoustics.
     
  22. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
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    I would be worried about the pipes fracturing over time. The accordion tubing is there to compensate for engine vibration and movement. The open air filters are nice, but it appears all you are doing is filtering hot engine bay heat into the engine. Those filters should be encased in a filter box with outside air consintraighted directly into the filter box. Cold air (or less then that of the engine bay) will help with power. Engines like dense air.
     
  23. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #23 white out, Jan 30, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The pipes are attached on each side by a silicone coupler, so there is room for it to flex with the motor.

    The carbon panels in the engine bay block the majority of the heat from the engine bay, but there are still some open areas (cut outs in the carbon) that I am going to add carbon panels to further isolate the filters. Further isolating the filters is for when the car is at a stop, idling speeds or on a dyno, not while at speed.

    While in motion, the inner fenders are fed by the original fresh air inlet, which dumps directly on the filters (picture attached.) The engine bay has large openings in the hatch, bottom of the car and the rear vent, so the vacuum from those low pressure areas is going to draw out airflow from the engine bay (heat.) The small openings in the carbon covering the intakes don't lead to any openings in the inner fender, so they act as low pressure areas for the fender dumping excess air into the engine bay.
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  24. white out

    white out Formula 3

    Mar 3, 2010
    1,229
    #24 white out, Jan 30, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here is the design of the upper airbox, it is a bottle neck. There amount of surface area for the engine to pull air from the filter is tiny.
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  25. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
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    Air boxes are designed and inststalled for a reason. Mostly it's for intake noise reduction, but they also serve a purpose for better air charge getting into the engine. Maybe not the most free flowing, but at least it's colder air then what is in the engine compartment. Car companies would not invest big money in a component that is not needed.

    Even with your tube and filters under the carbon fiber paneling. You are still not getting outside cold air into the filters. You are getting radiant engine heat into the engine. Yes the engine cover is vented, but it's not enough to over come the heat generated buy the engine. You need to encase those filters, and isolate them from the heat of the engine bay. A good and well designed air box will do that for you..

    The titainium intake pipes are beautiful, but even with the silicone connection points, I would still be worried about fracturing over the long term.
     

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