3500GT new bushes in front suspension | FerrariChat

3500GT new bushes in front suspension

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by lavaux, Jan 25, 2012.

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  1. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
    124
    Cully, Switzerland
    Full Name:
    Wilfried Vogel
    #1 lavaux, Jan 25, 2012
    As the visible parts of the rubber suspension bushes look rather deteriorated, I decided to fit new polyurethan bushes. The front suspension of the 3500GT is very similar to that of the Jaguar Mk2, on which car I have already changed the bushes with reasonable effort.
    I ordered and received from SUPERFLEX the kit suitable for Mk2 and 3500GT.
    The replacement of the bushes on the upper wishbone went quite well, but now I encounter a problem on the lower wishbone: on the 3500GT you cannot slide out the fulcrum shaft as on the Mk2:
    - there seems to be a setscrew on the fixed part to hold the shaft? Have not yet tried to remove it because it has a head for a normal screwdriver.. The Mk2 has no such screw. Does anyone know what it is for?
    - more seriously: once the shaft would be free, one cannot slide it out. To the rear there is (the exhaust and) a the wall of the body. To the front there is not enough space either, unless one removes the radiators. Is there any trick to avoid this?

    As I said above, the visible part of the old rubber bushes was quite brittle. But when I removed (with difficulties) the non-visible part, I found the rubber there in good condition. With other words, I have changed the upper bushes for esthetic reasons...! I do therefore hesitate very much to go into big work to change the lower ones. It would be much simpler to slide a small ring/tube over the visible part of the rubber to hide it....

    Wilfried
     
  2. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
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    Apr 22, 2006
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    #2 thecarnut, Jan 25, 2012
    You need to remove the slot head set screw. The shaft will slide and clear the body. I do not recall if it clears on the front or the rear. There are times the shaft will rust in place and not slide.

    Ivan
     
  3. mfletch

    mfletch Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2008
    480
    #3 mfletch, Jan 25, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Wilfried, after removing the set screws, I believe both of mine went out the front. I do not have the original radiator installed in my car. It did not look like mine would slide out without removing the radiator, but they did.
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  4. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
    124
    Cully, Switzerland
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #4 lavaux, Jan 25, 2012
    Ivan,
    I am sure that one cannot remove it to the rear because of the body. So you must have removed it front: Did you have the radiator in place when you removed the shaft?

    Wilfried
     
  5. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
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    #5 thecarnut, Jan 25, 2012
    I did the suspension after removing the engine therefore the radiator was out.

    Ivan
     
  6. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
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    #6 f308jack, Jan 26, 2012
    The set-screw makes a lot of sense: The fulcrum shaft can't waer a groove, making it extremely difficult to extract it when needed.
    Funny to see what Jaguar-influence (and parts) have crept into Maserati. We had already found that the Indy uses Mk2 front suspension, and the synchronizing tool for the Webers as described and depicted in the Khamsin owners manual looks suspiciously like the original S.U. tool I have in my trolley.
     
  7. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #7 lavaux, Jan 27, 2012
     
  8. 3500 GT

    3500 GT Formula 3

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    #8 3500 GT, Jan 27, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2012

    Wilfried, that would be Alford and Adler. The U.K. based automotive firm that engineered and built supension, brake and steering components for many auto manufacturers. They manufactured the suspension for the 3500 GT. Many components are shared with the Jag, but they are not exactly the same. Ball joints and bushings are interchangeable to the best of my knowledge. But I believe the durometer of the bushings is different from Jag. to Maserati.


    Ciao and best!

    ~Trev
     
  9. mfletch

    mfletch Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2008
    480
    #9 mfletch, Jan 27, 2012
    Any progress Wilfried?
     
  10. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
    124
    Cully, Switzerland
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #10 lavaux, Jan 28, 2012
    Yes, in the sense that I have made the decision to replace only the upper rubber bushes. I am now nearly finished with the right side: here also, the rubber inside the old bushed is still perfect. I had difficulties to drill it out! Also, to press the new polyurethan bushes in is not so easy. You have to heat them up to a temperature where you cannot hold them anymore (I never put on gloves) and then press them in rapidly, efore the metal of the wishbone cooles them down.
    Wilfried
     
  11. mfletch

    mfletch Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2008
    480
    #11 mfletch, Jan 28, 2012
    I remember inserting the new bushings was a challenge. I put a slight bevel on the leading edge of the rubber bushings to get them started. My friend that was helping me with them showed me a trick that was amazing....he used dishwashing soap to lubricate them and they practically jumped in. Good luck Wilfried.
     
  12. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
    124
    Cully, Switzerland
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #12 lavaux, Jan 31, 2012
    The bushes are all in now: as you say it is quite a challenge. The last one just did not want to go in, it always slipped out somewhere. Just before the last (and successful trial) I had decided that I will make a little "tool" to avoid the bush to take an asymmetrical shape: a short steel ring that just slips over the leading board of the bush. As the bush went in (probably because of my threatening to squizze it into a tool) I did not bother further. By the way, with the bushes there came some white cream, no need for soap.
    Wilfried
     
  13. au-yt

    au-yt F1 Veteran
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    Aug 13, 2006
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    Graeme
    #13 au-yt, Feb 1, 2012
    Hi Wilfred

    Yes they used the same inner bush parts on the Khamsin.

    Did you greases the lower pin befpre you put it back?

    Also what was the part number of the kit you used?

    Cheers
    Graeme
     
  14. velocetwo

    velocetwo F1 World Champ

    Dec 11, 2006
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    #14 velocetwo, Feb 1, 2012
    This was also true for Iso, Bizzarrini, Monterverdi, early lamborghini and Jenson to name a few.

    Some parts on Iso look very similar to Jaguar, but when you disassemble them you see small differences in shims and such.
     
  15. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

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    #15 f308jack, Feb 2, 2012
    From a cost point of view this makes sense, of course, and at least if you run into damage, a Jag part could likely be made to work. There's still plenty of that around.

    Btw, does anyone have the dimensions of the Maserati-bushes? A lot of the after-market Jaguar bushes are made here in Cape Town, if the dimensions are the same, they would probably turn out very economical.
     
  16. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

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    Wilfried Vogel
    #16 lavaux, Feb 3, 2012
    Hello Graeme,
    The upper bush kit from SUPERFLEX is called "SF1199 BLK SS F" and cost £ 32.65
    It fits perfectly in my 3500GT.
    The lower bush kit is called "SF0286KSS F" Lower Inner W/Bone Kit 8B 4T Jaguar default black and costs £51.75. I cannot assure that they fit, because I have not mounted them (problem of getting the axle out). But they look as if they would fit.
    Wilfried
     
  17. Portenos

    Portenos Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2004
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    #17 Portenos, Feb 3, 2012
    Does anyone have some photos and or dimensions of a early 3500GT driveline as fitted to a car with a 4 speed ZF transmission?
    I would be very appreciative to have this information.
    Ciao,
    FGM
     
  18. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #18 lavaux, Feb 3, 2012
    Please do not put your same question on several different threads. Also, your question has nothing to do with bushes. You are possibly interrupting a dialog.
    Why don't you start a new thread if you have a question that does not fit into any existing thread.
    Wilfried
     
  19. Portenos

    Portenos Formula 3

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    #19 Portenos, Feb 3, 2012
    Good point, sorry I will consider myself reprimanded, and will in the future take yours and Herr Baumer's sage advice.
    Many thanks,
    ciao,
    FGM
     
  20. kevin.mccloud1@me.com

    [email protected] Rookie

    Feb 24, 2016
    11
    #20 [email protected], Apr 29, 2016
    This may be an old thread but I was trawling through it and came across Lavaux's query about the manifacturerof the 3500 suspension system. They were called Alford and Alder, a factory in Hemel Hempstead, England, who primarily made steering assemblies. The factory closed in 1969.

    I have a transcription in English of the presentation made at the AISA conference in 2000 by Giulio Alfieri about the history of the 3500 and how he came to source parts from the UK and other countries (due to punitive tax laws in Italy). Anyone interested??

    K McC
     
  21. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
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    #21 thecarnut, Apr 29, 2016
    I am interested in a copy. Would be glad to post it on my website so it is available for others to download. Please email at [email protected]

    Ivan
     
  22. Portenos

    Portenos Formula 3

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    #22 Portenos, Apr 30, 2016
    I would be VERY interested in having a copy emailed to me at [email protected]
    Ciao,
    FGM
     
  23. redfred84

    redfred84 Formula Junior

    Dec 24, 2010
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    SF Bay Area, USA
    #23 redfred84, May 1, 2016
  24. lavaux

    lavaux Karting

    Jul 18, 2009
    124
    Cully, Switzerland
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    Wilfried Vogel
    #24 lavaux, May 14, 2016
    Yes, I am interested!
    Wilfried
     
  25. kevin.mccloud1@me.com

    [email protected] Rookie

    Feb 24, 2016
    11
    #25 [email protected], Jun 17, 2016
    Gents,

    My apologies. I had vainly checked this thread repeatedly and rather despondently because no-one seemed to have replied to my offer. Then today I realise I was at the bottom of the page and a page 2 exists with replies from the end of April. As the Americans say, dumb.

    I have emailed the rather wonderful interview with Giulio Alfieri to all except Wilfried, for whom I can't find an email address. W: mine is as per my ID so please feel free to contact me if you wish your email address to remain private.

    Regards

    Kevin McC
     
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