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Spark Plugs

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by upolld00, Sep 24, 2015.

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  1. upolld00

    upolld00 Rookie

    Nov 19, 2014
    26
    SF Bay Area
    Looking for some help with replacement spark plugs for my ’91 t.

    My car is experiencing some misfires and the 5-8 light is on. The 1-4 light comes on intermittently. My service guy is recommending I replace the NGK plugs with Champion Part number #809 (Plug type RA6HC) which are OEM by Ferrari to see if that will solve the issue. They are $2.89 from sparkplugs.com. Ferrari wants to charge my service guy $43.95 each. Crazy.

    Anyone else use the same plug from Champion?
     
  2. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Ferrari quite using Champion plugs and went to NGK for a very good reason.

    I really have to question the sanity of anyone who wants to go back to Champion.
     
  3. Bell Bloke

    Bell Bloke Formula 3

    Dec 6, 2012
    1,839
    UK
    I'm on NGK.
    What was the issue with Champion, Rifledriver?
    Regards Bell
     
  4. MvT

    MvT F1 Rookie

    May 25, 2013
    4,248
    The Netherlands - NH
    Full Name:
    Tijn
    #4 MvT, Sep 25, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  5. David Lind

    David Lind Formula 3

    Nov 19, 2008
    2,248
    Full Name:
    David Lind
    What component of the plug is iridium, and how does that enhance its performance? (May be an ignorant question, but I really don't know!)
     
  6. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
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    Brian Crall
    Huge warranty costs from running quality complaints.
     
  7. alexion

    alexion Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    May 20, 2013
    1,303
    New York
    Are you still using the original ignition coils? The backs tend to crack and arc which could be a reason for your intermittent problem.
     
  8. floridadoorman

    floridadoorman Formula Junior

    Jan 14, 2014
    392
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Alex
    I am running on NGK and had the original ignition coil changed at that time on my 91t.
     
  9. MvT

    MvT F1 Rookie

    May 25, 2013
    4,248
    The Netherlands - NH
    Full Name:
    Tijn
    Let's say in normal language the little tip :)

    Better Performance = unnoticeable
    More economical = unnoticeable

    However with cold starts the engine runs way better and it has a better ignition so it pollutes the engine compartment less. This is the only thing I notice, besides the fact I, theoretically, would never have to change them in my lifetime.
     
  10. Allen S.

    Allen S. Formula Junior

    Mar 16, 2001
    512
    Morgan Hill, CA
    Full Name:
    Allen / AKA tCoupe
    I hadn't seen anyone mention gap.
    The DR8EIX seem to come with a .030 gap and my manual shows .024 - .028.
    Should we be gapping these to spec or install as is?
     
  11. MvT

    MvT F1 Rookie

    May 25, 2013
    4,248
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    Full Name:
    Tijn
    I was told by NGK not to gap them and leave them as they come. I have no issues.
     
  12. Allen S.

    Allen S. Formula Junior

    Mar 16, 2001
    512
    Morgan Hill, CA
    Full Name:
    Allen / AKA tCoupe
    Thanks for the input.
     
  13. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

    Jun 18, 2013
    1,511
    Georgia Mountains US
    Full Name:
    David Rapalyea alias
    #13 Rapalyea, Sep 26, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2015
    I believe the iridium is the central electrode material. My experience with such plugs is they also are pointed on the end, not flat.

    PS: In the old days I experimented with every spark plug design offered. The only one I ever noticed that made a difference was the two post Bosch. In some circumstances where I was previously seeing a little bit of roughness it went away. I forget which car it was. Possibly my 1965 Corvair. I don't know exactly what is in my 1986 Ferrari, (I can look it up in the records or perhaps Rob remembers). Anyway, the harder and longer I have driven the car the better it runs. Right now it is about perfect, and that is after about 12 or 13 K miles.

    PPS: In the old days MSD stood for multiple spark discharge. It fired each plug multiple times. However, the time between each spark was long enough that it only made a difference at idle or at low rpms. After that the additional spark was to late to make much difference. It did make a difference on my 1974 Vega!
     
  14. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

    Jun 18, 2013
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  15. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 25, 2010
    2,903
    Central Florida
    They come with the gap pre-set because it is very difficult to re-gap them without damaging the tiny center electrode.

    I was advised to check them and use them as they came out of the box. If any are out of spec, exchange them for plugs with the proper gap from the factory.
    Alden
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
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    Brian Crall
    They are quite easy to gap and measure.

    There is no such thing as properly gapped from the factory. Any given plug number has many applications so they are not gapped for all possibilities.
     
  17. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
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    Apr 25, 2010
    2,903
    Central Florida
    I must have found a unicorn.

    The last set of iridiums I put in my Jag were pre-gapped exactly where the factory specs said they should be.

    And IF you start jamming a feeler gauge in there like a gorilla, you can snap the tiny center electrode.

    Just some cautious advice for DIY folks and those of us who remember plugs with normal size and ordinary material center electrodes that cost very little if you screwed one up.
    Alden
     
  18. 2281GT

    2281GT Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 9, 2006
    1,132
    Germany
    Full Name:
    Markus
    +1
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    The factory specs for Jag maybe but what about the factory specs for all the other applications for that particular plug?

    If you feel proper plug gapping consists of jamming a feeler gauge in there like a gorilla I submit you have no idea of the proper procedure or the proper tools and you are the poster child for the instruction given not to gap them. A feeler gauge is a measuring device, not an adjustment device.
     
  20. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

    Jun 18, 2013
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    David Rapalyea alias
    Has anyone heard anything whether these pointy electrodes SHOULD be gapped the same as the flat type?
     
  21. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    Yes. It has been SOP since they came out.
     
  22. FCnew

    FCnew Formula Junior

    May 5, 2015
    687
    Hong Kong / Canada
    Full Name:
    Jonathan
    .

    Everybody is a winner !!!

    Source: NGK Spark Plugs USA

     
  23. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 25, 2010
    2,903
    Central Florida
    Back off please. I was simply trying to give advice to those less experienced than you, of course. Re-read my post and I think you will understand what I was trying to say.

    I understand what you are trying to say and given the nature of my post, I don't think I deserve your blast furnace right now.
    Alden
     
  24. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
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    Brian Crall
    Back off?

    Pot meet kettle.

    They are your words in case you forgot.

    If you do not like being corrected do not offer up incorrect information and then when corrected, defending it in such a rude manner.
     
  25. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 25, 2010
    2,903
    Central Florida
    I was advised not to mess with the gaps on iridium plugs, but we can all learn something new. I think the main thing here is to be careful with the tips on these plugs.

    Response from NGK about gapping plugs:

    "Thank you for your inquiry. When I looked up your Mondial, it came up
    with DR8EIX, is what I assume you are using. That plug comes out of the box at
    .032", but your Ferrari requires a gap at .025". We do highly recommend that you
    gap the plug accordingly with a wire style or feeler gauge so that you do not
    compromise the fine Iridium tip. We recommend that you double check the gap on
    all plugs, even the ones that are pre-gapped out of the box. I hope this helps
    answer your question."

    Thank You,
    Lela Martin
    NGK Spark Plugs, (USA) Inc.

    Alden
     

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