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  #41  
Old 10-28-2011, 09:46 PM
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Already shared with Pelican Parts and Rennlist forums, so the Porsche "community" is well aware of who we're dealing with. My apologies to any Wharton grads for ending a sentence with a preposition.

I'll have to leave it to others to spread to the British car forums, on Kevin's behalf.
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  #42  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:21 PM
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Kevin, here's the response so far...this one is from a Porsche Club of America National Driving Education member (i.e. a member of the "inner circle" who communicate as you do and see your point of view):

I only read page one, but why is some dickwad ripping off a reputable (Ferarri) shop any concern here? $1300 dollars for some substantial work and he is complaining?? What area of Wealth Management is this fool in, Appalachian Moonshine Wealth management? And it's double funny when a ******bag tries to intimidate on an online forum with legal terms...
____________

Please let us know how we can continue to spread the message of Kevin Hedges.
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  #43  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:50 PM
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Mr Hedges' initial response brings up some interesting questions. Is anyone reading this thread practicing law in S.C.?

1) Are there really any State privacy laws that protect details of a business dispute between two individuals, or between an individual and a business?

2) When Mr Hedges chose to create a Ferrarichat user profile and respond in detail to Mr Troy's complaint in a public forum, did he pierce his own claim of privacy? I believe he did, but again, I'm not an attorney. My wife is, but she has no knowledge of the laws of that State.

It seems to me that this entire matter is now in the public domain, just like an argument between two people overheard by others in a bar, for example. It's a little late try to put the genie back into the bottle, so to speak. So following this line of reasoning, any of us who read this thread should be free to repeat it as long as it is represented as an unsubstantiated story, not stated as fact.

Interesting.

Last edited by m5guy; 10-28-2011 at 11:19 PM.
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  #44  
Old 10-29-2011, 12:10 AM
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Wealth Management? Hedges is a thief, $1300 is a joke. There is no argument, a piece of dirt stole from a good man that cherishes fine cars. End of story.

Last edited by GaryR; 10-29-2011 at 12:13 AM.
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  #45  
Old 10-29-2011, 06:14 AM
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Karl and I have had several conversations concerning technical issues on various cars as well as some discussion about a problem I had had with another business down in his neck of the woods. I was fortunate to have received resolution in that matter, and respect the help and information that Karl was able to supply.
Being a small independent myself, I can see the reason for Karl's OP. He is simply pointing out that he has an account outstanding and is wary of this customer's ethics. I regularly try to 'network' my group of customers as well as reciprocate business when able. I would feel bad were I to put the wrong two in touch.
I look forward to reading a satisfactory outcome in all this, and also to meet Karl and some of you in person.

Best, Brian
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  #46  
Old 10-29-2011, 07:49 AM
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The unbeatable defense of a slander allegation is if the statement is true. Karl made a truthful statement . He worked on Kevin's car who drove off without paying the bill. The time to have stopped this matter was before Kevin left Karl's shop.

To go on a public forum hoping to bring about closure and get paid is understandable.
To go on a public forum and threaten sue the website and community is not.
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  #47  
Old 10-29-2011, 08:37 AM
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In the insurance industry, we are required to take various course, one of them being Ethics. Although I have dreaded taking this course, and consider it to be a waist of my time, as I am ethical in my endeavors, I have found it to be very interesting indeed. I just read this and thought I would share a bit from the course....


"Moral principles or practices arise out of the desire to avoid the chaos of unrestrained personal behavior at the expense of the social order. Ethical dilemmas can be defined as undesirable or unpleasant choices relative to a moral principle or practice. What do we do? What are the chances that we’ll be caught? What does it matter, anyway?

A Harvard history professor, Henry Adams, observed, “Morality is a private and costly luxury.” Many agree and further believe that acting ethically limits their options, opportunities and their ability to succeed in business. While this thinking rarely proves to pass muster in a court of law, many ethical short cuts have seemed to go unpunished, giving rise to the thought that ethical behavior isn’t worth the risk of losing out. Lest you think that you’ve got a cop-out… the winds, they are a changin.’ What seemed to pass for OK has been redefined as criminal and penalties, in the unlikely event that you are caught, are just too large to risk. One of the basic insurance principles: Don’t risk a lot for a little."


Another thing that I found very interesting is this about P.T. Barnum...

Let’s posit that the primary goal of business is to increase profits. Decision-makers need to have a series of steps, and maybe some rules, to follow to get there. How do you increase profits? It seems reasonable that satisfying customers would be one way. Then that needs to be broken down further: how do you satisfy customers? A commonly held view is that one should go about business ethically with integrity, and honesty. Remember P.T. Barnum, the fellow who is most famous for his statement, “There’s a sucker born every minute”? It’s catchy, but Barnum never said it. In Capitalism, Democracy, and Ralph’s Pretty Good Grocery (Princeton University Press), John Mueller points out not only that Barnum didn’t say that, but that it would have been seriously out of character if he had. “Barnum’s great discovery,” writes John Mueller,“was not so much that such behavior is immoral but that from a business standpoint it is stupid.” Barnum did make an important financial discovery early in his career. He noticed that nearly all his deceptive schemes “ended in disaster,” reducing him to a low income of only $4 per week. His fortune, however, came almost wholly from his legitimate enterprises. As Barnum put it, “[N]o man can be dishonest without soon being found out and when his lack of principle is discovered, nearly every avenue to success is closed against him forever. As a mere matter of selfishness,” he concluded, “honesty is the best policy.”
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  #48  
Old 10-29-2011, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by brian.s View Post
Karl and I have had several conversations concerning technical issues on various cars as well as some discussion about a problem I had had with another business down in his neck of the woods. I was fortunate to have received resolution in that matter, and respect the help and information that Karl was able to supply.
Being a small independent myself, I can see the reason for Karl's OP. He is simply pointing out that he has an account outstanding and is wary of this customer's ethics. I regularly try to 'network' my group of customers as well as reciprocate business when able. I would feel bad were I to put the wrong two in touch.
I look forward to reading a satisfactory outcome in all this, and also to meet Karl and some of you in person.

Best, Brian

Yeah, don't get me started on that 'other business.' That deserves a thread in itself. I don't want to take away from the issue at hand. I hope Karl can resolve this issue.
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  #49  
Old 10-29-2011, 10:40 AM
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Yeah, don't get me started on that 'other business.' That deserves a thread in itself. I don't want to take away from the issue at hand. I hope Karl can resolve this issue.
I wonder what "other business" you are referring to... Yes, that does deserve another thread. Would be best if started by one of the MANY unsatisfied customers.

I think the issue of this thread is likely done...not resolved, but done. Either Kevin will pay his debt or he won't. We all know Karl's reputation will not be tarnished. We also know Kevin's firm has a Wharton grad. What else can be said?
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  #50  
Old 10-29-2011, 02:07 PM
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Just letting everyone know that Kevin Hedges of Hedges Wealth Management has informed me he's going to sue the FerrariChat.com community and Karl unless we removed this thread. Just making the threat clear to the community.
I'll represent Karl and F-Chat.

For free.
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  #51  
Old 10-29-2011, 04:52 PM
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I'll represent Karl and F-Chat.

For free.
Can you throw a pre-nup in there for that price?
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  #52  
Old 10-29-2011, 09:38 PM
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wealth manager huh? but you could not manage coming up w/ more than $400 bux?

that is laughable. let me suggest to you that you may consider looking into alternate payment vehicles so....that you can pay for your vehicle.

i love the wharton ref...i suspect there was a week long executive class he attended. lol.
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  #53  
Old 10-29-2011, 09:44 PM
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I'll represent Karl and F-Chat.

For free.
you are a good man. thank you counselor.

pcb
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  #54  
Old 10-29-2011, 09:52 PM
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Reference #3): Many members on FChat are already members of the Ferrari Club, so no need to spread lies about Karl there. I'm sure many of the Porsche Club members are quite familiar with Karl, so your lies about him and his shop likely won't fly there either. I've seen British cars at Karl's shop, and he's referred friends for service at a local Range Rover independent shop, so you're probably out of luck in that circle too. I don't think Karl's intent was to hurt your company. I think his intent was to warn the community you are threatening to sue about behavior which is suspect and sheds light on your character. And your threats to Rob Lay and the community definitely support my suspicions that you may have a broken moral compass.

Reference #4): Your firm being credentialed didn't prevent you from neglecting to pay your debts, or making up false statements about Karl and his shop. So, I'm not seeing the connection you are trying to make. If you can't pay your debts, or simply refuse to, how can others trust you? Being educated doesn't automatically make someone responsible, honest, ethical or moral. Bernie Madoff is educated...although not a Wharton grad.

Reference the last quoted statement: Gentlemanly conduct would have been to pay what you owed immediately. Offering a small portion is not gentlemanly or appropriate. I would bet that the majority of the bill was parts anyway. I think Karl's rate is lower than the local Ford dealer...maybe you should have taken your car, I mean the car you sold and no longer feel obligated to pay debts associated with same, to the Ford dealer...just a thought.

I'm not sure if I should seek legal counsel in the event you sue the community. I think I'm comfortable being represented by common sense. Maybe the community should hire a lawyer...if he/she charges a $5000 retainer, that should be like $0.50 per person??? I'm in!

I'm sure there are a lot of people you could bully, threaten, lie about...but Karl? The FChat community? Really???
great post gil. i too am in on retaining counsel. my reasons differ however...it is nearing the end of the year and if i don't use the $.50 i have budgeted for annual litigation...i will lose it for next years budget! simply put: i need to litigate
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  #55  
Old 10-29-2011, 09:55 PM
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wealth manager huh? but you could not manage coming up w/ more than $400 bux?

that is laughable. let me suggest to you that you may consider looking into alternate payment vehicles so....that you can pay for your vehicle.

i love the wharton ref...i suspect there was a week long executive class he attended. lol.

I agree. Why not discuss this when the Porsche was picked up? He obviously never intended on paying him. Financially reasons???
And the weak threat of suing F Chat is nauseating.
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  #56  
Old 10-29-2011, 10:06 PM
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I agree. Why not discuss this when the Porsche was picked up? He obviously never intended on paying him. Financially reasons???
And the weak threat of suing F Chat is nauseating.
DrJohn, the interesting thing is that when he stood at my counter to pay he had no knowledge of wether his car was properly repaired or not, so I would have to agree that this was a plan all along. Of course I should have learned my lesson in 2006 when I had difficulty getting paid for repairs on his other car. I guess I forgot.
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  #57  
Old 10-29-2011, 10:15 PM
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I'll represent Karl and F-Chat.

For free.
Thank you kindly.
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  #58  
Old 10-29-2011, 11:30 PM
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears that this is not even about $1300, but more like $900?

Didn't Kevin pay $400?

If so, it's really absurd.

Kevin, a three-figure check would make this disappear. PLUS, it's the morally, ethically, and legally correct thing to do.

If you are either (a.) stubborn, or (b.) in denial, do note that NOT paying the $900 is giving Karl so much good publicity.....

So, either pay your bills and have this disappear, or don't pay your bills and know that your money is going to positive marketing for Karl's business (and potentially injuring your own business, but who knows? No way of knowing if Ferrari owners may be potential clients for wealth management firms.....)
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  #59  
Old 10-30-2011, 07:22 AM
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Desmo, you are correct. A bit over $900.- and life would go on as usual. Some may say if Karl's that busy what's $900-$1000 matter but at $85.- it translates into about 11hrs of labor. If I had chosen to not work for a day and a half I would have spent the day with my wife and children but in this case I didn't get either.

His rear tires were at the end due to a bad alignment i guess and I even offered him tires at cost to help him out. I must be an idiot.
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  #60  
Old 10-30-2011, 11:20 AM
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Desmo, you are correct. A bit over $900.- and life would go on as usual. Some may say if Karl's that busy what's $900-$1000 matter but at $85.- it translates into about 11hrs of labor. If I had chosen to not work for a day and a half I would have spent the day with my wife and children but in this case I didn't get either.

His rear tires were at the end due to a bad alignment i guess and I even offered him tires at cost to help him out. I must be an idiot.
$900 is $900...it doesn't matter if you were a millionaire! It's owed to you and you should be paid. If it was $10, it still should be paid! You own a business, not a charity.

What if I went to Kevin for wealth management services and chose not to pay for services rendered...then complained that his advice sucked? I bet he would expect to be paid. And I bet he wouldn't keep it a private matter, but make it public by suing me. By his example, I could counter-sue him for blasting my good name in court.
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