Has anyone here backdated a 911? | FerrariChat

Has anyone here backdated a 911?

Discussion in 'Porsche' started by davemqv, Dec 20, 2016.

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  1. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
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    Dave
    I've always wanted a nice old 911, but they're kind of ridiculously priced right now, IMO. Have been considering an old 912 for a while, but recently started thinking about getting a 911 SC and backdating it - mostly the bumpers and the mirrors.

    Anyone here done this or know of any shops that do a good but reasonably priced job with it?

    I know about the usual resto mod outfits like Benton, Emory, Willhoit, etc. but don't want to end up with a 250k SC or wait 2 years to drive it.

    Wondering who else does backdating, and how expensive it is to do (ie- would it just be cheaper to buy a 60's 912 and call it a day?)

    Thanks
    Dave
     
  2. Michael B

    Michael B F1 Rookie
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    #2 Michael B, Dec 20, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I have done this (1985 Carrera), and had a ball doing so. I also have a true short wheel base 912 so I will give you a quick summary.

    For a conversion starting with a S/C or 3.2 is a great idea because the flares in the rear will suffice for the look you are going for. There is a lot of work needed in the front bulkhead latch area, and obviously you will need to either convert the later front fenders (for the turn signal buckets) or just go with correct early long hood units. Porsche sells new fenders that I have gotten quite a few sets of. And they are super quality (albeit expensive). The rocker panel will take some doing for a true early look when using a later car, and then backdating the taillights and license plate area can be a small hurdle. The biggest thing for me is the interior. The later interior is nice to work out of, but it really does not have any vintage thing going for it. I have a true longhood 911 2.7 (in addition to the 912) just because I wanted that early 7200RPM no radio correct look. Yes the backdated cars are more livable, but its hard to get one down to 2100lbs like my personal longhood is. And to me its all about the weight.

    Now speaking of weight... The 912 is a super lightweight ball to drive. Mine has been bumped up in HP a bit and fully restored for driving. Its just plain fantastic to experience. It is truly like going back in time when you are on a nice winding road all alone, the unmistakeable light steering feel from the factory wood wheel and the purr of Porsches fabulous flat four as you cruise with the windows down. It is really a pleasure.

    No doubt 911 power is great, but small bore vintage cars are popular for a reason. They are remarkably simple & offer miles of smiles. With that said... You can't lose either way.
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  3. 4CamGT

    4CamGT F1 Rookie

    Jun 23, 2004
    2,649
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    What I would do is find an affordable rust-free pre '73 911 that has needs. If you really search you can still find them in the $40's or less especially if it's non-matching numbers. In some cases you'll get a later 3.0 or 3.2 aluminum case motor already installed. Do a lot of research on what your goal is. A well built tasteful early 911 is a great investment. There's lots you can do yourself.

    SC's, Carreras and 964's are getting too valuable and are better suited for other projects such as Carrera 3.0 RS's, IROC's, Safaris, Cup Cars etc.

    912's and 912E's are also coming into their own and have a growing fan base willing to pay up for good cars.

    Freeman
     
  4. 356racing

    356racing Formula Junior
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    Sep 24, 2004
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    #4 356racing, Dec 21, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Have you looked at IROC bodies or the RUF SCR? Those can be done with just bumper and mirror conversions on a SC or Carrera and turned around in a week by a competent body shop. There are a lot of variables in doing a backdate depending on how much fiberglass you can tolerate and the desired fit and finish. I would second the above advise to find a decent driver early 911/912 if that is the desired look. For backdating, take a look at TRE Motorsports in Van Nuys, CA. Dave was one of the first to develop specific components for backdating although most of his stuff is fiberglass. If you want to spend more time and money, it can be done in all steel. Here's my old 78 SC down at Patrick Motorsports being backdated to an ST. You can see how the front signal boxes are modified and a new front closing panel has been welded in.
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  5. KM1959

    KM1959 Formula Junior

    Nov 12, 2014
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    Up until about a month ago I hadn't driven an 80's Porsche... since the 80's. But I do have a really clean, low mileage 911 Turbo so I haven't neglected the marque. I was thinking that an old one might be a fun weekend car so I called on an '84 and we went for a drive. While driving it in town, it honestly felt like a pickup from the 60's; heavy steering, sloppy linkage, weird pedal movement, loud... Of couse it would be way more fun in the canyons but getting to those said canyons would be drudgery for me. I so wanted to fall in love with car. The appeal is lost on me.
     
  6. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

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    Thanks very much. Your comparison is helpful. I think maybe I'll keep hunting down a 912. It seems you can still find decent rust free cars that need a bit of sprucing up and servicing for $35-40k give or take. I like those cars a lot.

    Your cars look great! Thanks for sharing!
     
  7. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

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    Yes, SC's are going up quickly, too! Arg!

    I've seen some old early 70's 911's for around $40-$50k, but then I see others for $250k. I know early 911S's are very desirable now, but my problem with 911's is that I don't understand the market well enough to know, when looking at early 911's, T's, E's etc in the $40k range - if I'm looking at a fairly priced but less desirable version of a 911, or if I'm looking at a basket case that someone is trying to unload. More importantly I can't identify WHY one car is cheaper than another. I've been reading a bunch on them, but so far I'm still a babe in the woods with early 911's.

    The 912 is simpler to grasp in that respect for obvious reasons. I've been told the '68 can be a trouble basket, but otherwise mostly the only complaint with those cars is the smaller engine, which wouldn't matter to me. It's a very light car with enough pep to move swiftly, and the early ones are stunning in terms of design.
     
  8. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

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    Thanks everyone. Appreciate the input. I think for now I will stick with my plan for an early 912. Maybe later go for backdating a later car as a project.

    As an aside, I'd be happy to hear advice on which early 911 models (even up to '75), are still in the realm of affordable ($50kish).

    Thanks
    Dave
     
  9. lola dog

    lola dog Rookie

    Dec 21, 2016
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    #9 lola dog, Dec 21, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  10. Mang

    Mang F1 Veteran
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    Hopefully Nerofer will see this thread or perhaps reach out to him. He sold a few years ago a really neat 912/911 modded short wheelbase car I think? It had a lot of really nice touches.
     
  11. 4CamGT

    4CamGT F1 Rookie

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    #11 4CamGT, Dec 21, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2016
    I wish you a lot of luck. 912's are getting into serious money now. On early 911's the best thing to do is read, read, read. 911S Registry Forum is a great place to learn. My current and previous 911's/912's have been '69 912, '71 911E Targa (Conda Green), '69 911E (Tangerine), '72 911T (Tangerine), '74 Carrera (Mexico Blue), '86 Carrera Cabrio, '89 964, '95 993C4, '97 993 C4S. I have to say, they were all fantastic and I wish I still had them all! Each is/was an amazing journey. They all went up in value as I owned them.

    Freeman
     
  12. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

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    912's are all over the map and I think will be the first to soften if and when that happens.

    There's a car not far from me for $35k, and I see some offered at $75k!

    Most are in the $45k region for a very nice driver+ condition car. $60k for an all original well preserved car. There are lots of them on the market at any given time.

    I'll check out 911S Registry. Thanks!
     
  13. nickd

    nickd Formula Junior

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    #13 nickd, Dec 22, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2016

    Rs-werks - Porsche Restoration, Porsche Engine Building, Engine Rebuilders

    They are based in DE

    Produced some really good cars ...... I've known scotty for year's when I lived in Delaware.
    He's building 2 or 3 cars for a friend down here in Houston ...
     
  14. ferraripete

    ferraripete F1 World Champ

    to me, the key to a proper back date is the window trim. a detail often over looked...the should not be black:)
     
  15. Finlander

    Finlander Formula 3
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    This just reaffirms my desire to get a SWB 912.

    Both of your cars look fantastic!
     
  16. Michael B

    Michael B F1 Rookie
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    You two are too kind. Thank you. I really enjoy the early Porsche lifestyle & try to represent!
     
  17. TKO

    TKO Formula Junior

    Oct 22, 2004
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    Hi Dave, I guess it really depends on what you want. I would suggest driving as many different 912 and 911's as possible. They are all great but for many different reasons. I, like Freeman, have owned many different models old to new. My current 'old' 911 is a '78 SC which is just slightly modded but is reversible to stock easily. I was going to post it here but just decided to make its own thread here ...http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/porsche/540823-1978-911sc-talbot-yellow.html#post145115963. All the best on your hunt! Tom
     

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