Question for owners of non Ferrari cabrios | FerrariChat

Question for owners of non Ferrari cabrios

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by davebdave, Nov 13, 2008.

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  1. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    Mar 18, 2007
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    #1 davebdave, Nov 13, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I have had it with the top latches on our Mondial Cab. They are made of a brittle pot metal and keep breaking. I have replaced the arms with stainless steel made by Fchat members but now the base of the latch has broken. In addition to weak metal, the design itself is awful. The top cannot be closed from inside the car and my wife can not manage it at all.

    Do any of you have a convertible (or know of a convertible) with a quality latching system that looks like it could be made to work (see pictures below)? I would preferably like something with a pin for guidance and a hook and lever to pull it tight. It needs to have at least 3/4 inch travel as the mondial top needs to be stretched a bit to latch it. Also it would have to look good without any plastic fairings so that would probably rule out most modern cars.

    I am not necessarily looking for something that would simply bolt up but that once modified to fit it would look like it could have been original

    Any ideas would be much apreciated,
    thanks, dave
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  2. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    #2 Artvonne, Nov 13, 2008
    Okay, I have heard people talk about the cheap parts Ferrari have used. Having never seen anything of genuine poor quality with my own eyes I never fully appreciated the subject. But seeing those pictures I have to admit it pi$$es me off to see that kind of crap parts. This is something that should be built to the same capacity as a seat belt latch, something that would pull through the sheet metal or tear out the bolts before failing. The top latching mechanism should be secure enough that something somewhere else should have to fail well before the latch.

    I dont know of any car that uses anything simular, and I doubt you will find anything. The best would be to have Verell machine some parts out of high grade steel, but ultimately, IMHO, this is clearly a safety issue, and if Ferrari wont address it it might be of use to notify the NHTSA. Sorry Ferrari, this is just not something to laugh off. I dont even think Fiat ever used anything that cheap, unbelievable.
     
  3. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    #3 Skidkid, Nov 13, 2008
    The latch is very similar to what is on a Fiat 124. I had one for years and never had problems with breakage.
     
  4. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    #4 Artvonne, Nov 13, 2008

    Maybe they made it out of cheaper metal for Ferrari? Sure doesnt look like good solid steel.
     
  5. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

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    #5 Miltonian, Nov 13, 2008
    I don't think the Mondial latch looks much like the Fiat (124/2000/Dino) latch. I can post a picture from the parts manual, or you can look it up on Chris Obert's Fiat website.

    Have you checked to see if the two parts of the top latch are properly lined up when closing? If the latch is being used to pull the top into alignment with the windshield frame, as well as closing the top itself, that puts a great deal of extra stress onto the latch in directions that it may not be designed to handle.
     
  6. SonomaRik

    SonomaRik F1 Veteran
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    #6 SonomaRik, Nov 13, 2008
    That part doesn't look hard to cast. I'll bet it can be farmed out and Ricambi can have a whole new line.

    Shoot, IF I get lonely in the garage with projects, I'll make a cast and see what goes.

    where that investment....
     
  7. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    #7 davebdave, Nov 13, 2008
    Yes, I first extent the paddles all the way forward so they go in the guides, and then latch both latches, then release 1 latch, draw back the paddle and relatch, do the same on the opposite side.

    The broken latch base is original and I have been worried about it because the holes were worn and elongated when we installed the new steel arm.

    FChatter Gianluca is machining me a new base out of a steel block so I dont expect it to break again, but I still think there has to be a better way.

    Luca has a 124 and I looked at the latch. Not bad but probably not beefy enough to stretch a top that could potentially travel at 150+mph.

    thanks, dave
     
  8. Randy Forbes

    Randy Forbes Formula Junior

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    #8 Randy Forbes, Nov 15, 2008
    Boy, you're not going to like this, but it sure looks like an MGB top latch could be very easliy fitted to replace that one.

    The hook is a casting, but the latch is chrome-plated stamped steel (real steel). They were fitted to every one of the MGB Tourers produced from September 1962 through October 1980, and I've not heard of one ever failing.
     
  9. Artvonne

    Artvonne F1 Veteran

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    #9 Artvonne, Nov 17, 2008

    Those parts should be equal, at the least, to high grade gun parts in quality. You should be able to rip the roof off the car, crush it flat, or blow it to Kingdom come before those parts fail. And to do that those parts need to be machined from high grade forged steel and heat treated.
     
  10. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    #10 davebdave, Mar 28, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    And here it is. . . . .

    Fchater Gianluca machined a new latch paddle/mount out of steel and we painted it with POR 15. There is no way this thing is going to break again. I think I have finally made my peace with the OEM latch design. It just never should have been made out of cast pot metal.

    Dave
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  11. FF8929

    FF8929 Formula Junior

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    #11 FF8929, Mar 28, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2009
    For reference: My 83 Mondial uses latches that are identical to my 78 Alfa (except for finish). Never had probablems with either.
    Also, I thought there was someone here that already made "bullet proof" latches.
     
  12. Vito

    Vito Formula Junior
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    #12 Vito, Mar 29, 2009
    I concur - the top on my Fiat Spider never failed & it sealed well. The only time it would leak is if I sprayed the top & door window seal directly with a hose at full blast. The parts are readily available from International Autoparts in Charlottesville, VA or Vick's Autosports in Fort Worth, TX & they cost about $170. You might also look at the top latch used on the Alfa Spider.
     

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