1. I have started the new week 1 FerrariChat Update poll, please vote... http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/ferrarichat-com-update-week-1-poll.560487/
  1. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    Aug 22, 2003
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    Bill Noon
    Nope, afraid that mystery holds some potential profit for me and my kids need to eat!

    The oddity "275 GTC" variants were not prototypes. They were in fact the exact opposite. At least in the case of the car we had, it was built for a client who wanted to race in some main events, in a Ferrari in the "stock GT" class as well as drive the car to and from the races as well as regularly on the road. No modifications or alterations are were allowed and the car's were basically "showroom stock" so no dry sumps, small frames, alloy bodies, six-carbs, outside fuel fillers etc... Think plain and boring and this is what the allowed. Kinda cool if you ask me. Wish I was there, then and had the bucks to give it a try. (I was barely a year old when our car was built!)

    If you wanted to go racing in that period and clocking 100,000 or so kilometers on the road was not part of the equation you bought a 275 GTB/C, Dino SP, or even a "P" car.

    On the other hand if getting to and from work, using the car on the road and flogging it on the track on the weekend was of interest, the "275 GTC" was one way to go circa 1966. That is if you wanted a little horse on the front end of your ride.

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  2. Jeff Kennedy

    Jeff Kennedy F1 Rookie
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    Oct 16, 2007
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    Bill, do you have an idea of how many of the "showroom stock" 275 GTCs were built? Are there going to be more than 2 that are actually stamped that way or did the factory ultimately start stamping all of them 275 GTB?

    Jeff
     
  3. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    I have only direct knowledge (i.e; touched, played, inspected, drove etc... our old car) I was told by Ferrari of one other they were aware of built and stamped the same way... There could have been others. If there were, some owners may not even realize the frame is stamped "275 GTC" rather than "275 GTB."

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  4. BIGHORN

    BIGHORN Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2006
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    This is interesting that some GTCs were made that were basically stock to be used as racers when plenty of regular GTBs were doing pretty good in races; The Fillipinetti road equipped GTB ( the Heuvink book states that it was not a lightweight) that was a class winner at LeMans comes to mind.
     
  5. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
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    Now, if there are no demonstrable differences with the regular GTB, what was the point of the different stamping?
     
  6. Birel

    Birel Formula 3
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    That's the car, it was a nice dark Rosso Nearco or similar many years ago, sorry I cannot remember the chassis stamping but suspect it might even still have been 275GTS(omething) ?? And I only have one or 2 old photos of the car in general. It was said the 2 stop watches on the dash were fitted for Mr EF.
     
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  8. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    #57 Julio Batista, Sep 13, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2010
    This is indeed a fascinating discussion. I remain however totally unconvinced that there is such a thing as a 275 GTC.

    1. There is still not even one mention of a Ferrari 275 GTC in ANY Ferrari litterature or documentation over the past 45 years. No book, catalogue, brochure, article, interview, year book, road test, manual, or official Ferrari publication mentions a Ferrari 275 GTC at any time.

    2. This thread doesn't have a single picture! Not even a picture of the "275 GTC" stamp!

    3. I see no reasonable and clear description of the eventual differences between a "275 GTC" and other 275 variations.

    4. I called my uncle in Rome who told me that he had never sold a 275 GTC, because there had never been a 275 GTC.

    At this point, I think the most likely explanation of the "275 GTC" stamp is that it's simply a mistake. It wouldn't be the first one!

    Cheers,

    Julio
     
  9. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    Hi Julio,

    I thought the same thing having never heard of such a car for almost 20 years until one showed up one day at our door step. Except for some internal engine reinforcements for engine life and reliability it was bone stock. Steel body, three carbs etc...

    The car had homologated options / improvements that could be had on any 275 at the time the car was built. These were limited to the higher profile cams, higher compression ratio pistons and an Abarth type exhaust system.

    The car was quite heavy coming in at almost 3,000lbs so certainly no light weight.

    It was however purposely built this was, stamped as such and raced regularly when new in some major CSIA / FIA sanctioned events.

    The stamping was no mistake. I have seen plenty of "Ferrari" botched stampings that nowadays, drive current owners and historians nuts. At least on this car and one other it was not a mistake but quite clear and purposeful, done by Ferrari for clients and done so on purpose so that upon inspection prior to racing the officials could see it clearly. Send me a private email at bnoon@symbolicmotors.com and I will email you a photo. Share and send it to anyone as you see fit.

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  10. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    Hello everybody,

    Well this discussion turned out to be quite interresting after all! Once again I'm sorry I can't post the pictures on this forum, I was again specificaly asked by my friend not to post any picture of his car. Actually I can understand his point of view, since I already found 2 pictures of one of his former cars taken in his garden, and even his name written in a thread of this forum! Again, if you want to see the pictures, don't hesitate to contact me by private message.

    Bill's explainations are consistent with the fact that the mechanic who restored my friend's car's engine had told him the engine was not a regular 275 GTB engine. Anyway, a mechanic specialized in vintage Ferrari should come this week to my friend's place to repair some slight problems on the 275, I will try to take a leave on this day and meet with him, we'll be able to talk details about this car. I'll let you know if I learn anything of interrest!

    Thank you all for your comments!
     
  11. technom3

    technom3 F1 Rookie

    Mar 29, 2007
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    Justin
    This thread is great.

    i love how some people say well if I haven't read it in a book, and I don't know it and this other guy I talked to doesn't know about it then it never existed... Especially when Bill Noon has done the research on it, touched one, drove one, owned one etc...

    I guess thats good for him, that way when he comes across another one people will just say... ehh... its just a standard car... no biggie... and then he will say. YES... just standard... YES... thats the ticket... and then be able to feed his family when he sells it. Ignorance of others can work for you sometimes I guess.

    Thank you Bill for the clarification on the existence of these cars.

    I am trying to get a better understanding of the differences in GTB and GTC though... What was the difference? Was it that they were all built plain jane and if it has any options it wouldn't qualify for racing therefore the GTC is the homologation special BUT... is also like the base stripper model??? I know thats not completely the case but am just trying to give an example.
     
  12. BIGHORN

    BIGHORN Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2006
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    JOHN F KELLY
    +1 Julio.
     
  13. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    Hi Bill,

    Again, thank you for the interesting discussion, and for all the details you provide. I will PM you soon.

    Incidentally, the person I consulted on this matter has been selling Ferraris, including a few to my father, over the past fifty years, with exclusive distribution in the Center and South of Italy. He and Marcel Massini have been absolute references for me over the past few decades. Of course, neither he nor Marcel are perfect...

    I look forward to more posts on this thread about the mistery 275 GTC. All posts have added to the discussion, with of course the notable exception of your fanboy, which is unsuccessfully attempting to turn a civilized debate into an argument. He shall be ignored.

    Cheers,

    Julio
     
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  15. technom3

    technom3 F1 Rookie

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    Woah woah woah...

    My intention was not to start a fight. I am sorry if it came across that way. I guess after rereading my post I could see how it could be interpreted that way... however, that honestly wasn't my intent.

    Seeing as I have ZERO interest or stake in this whole thing I am kind of surprised at the backlash... but hey... perhaps with the way my post is written I might have deserved it.

    As far as status of "fanboy" Actually, I am not a fan of symbolic motors if I might say so myself for personal reasons, AND Bill Noon couldn't pick me out in a crowd of one.


    My point was more of a blanket statement... I see many people who come on here especially in the vintage section and argue facts with some of our beloved experts who are on here... Such as Marcel.. and they really don't know what they are talking about. Perhaps its not the case this time around... but I still stand behind what I said, I will stand behind what Bill Noon said because he has personal experience with one of the actual cars in question and is a professional in the biz. I would say that is a pretty fair side to back.
     
  16. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    Cool!

    I fuly agree with you on the uninformed arguers. In my book of shame they come a close second after the replica crowd. However, unlike the fake-lovers, the uninformed are not always easy to identify, especially off the bat...

    I don't have the pleasure of knowing Bill Noon. I am neither standing behind him nor standing in front of him: We are just having a highly instructive discussion (well, instructive for me at least), after 40 years of passion I am still learning, because as you know Ferrari matters are rarely what they seem... I also have zero material interest in this matter: 275's are very great Ferraris, but they do not fit my budget right now, and they are a bit too "modern" for my taste.

    Cheers!

    Julio
     
  17. kare

    kare F1 Rookie
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    Nov 11, 2003
    3,096
    If that is the case, what would be the purpose of such stamping? There are a few examples where the best explanation seems to be that an uninformed worker did something wrong until things returned back into normal. I see no reason why this wouldn't be one such case. I understand that the owner would like to think his car is very special, but don't we all?

    Best wishes, Kare
     
  18. BIGHORN

    BIGHORN Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2006
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    The best answer is often the most straightforward-The stamping was a mistake. I do not represent myself as knowlegeable as Bill or others, but I have been around these cars for 40+ years and have seen a lot of Factory mis labeling. Just a few examples- 275 GTS described on build sheet as Scagletti Berlinetta, non existant carb types on build sheet, Heritage certificates with paint and interior colors reversed, 330GTS with engine type # instead of S/N stamp on the block (this was a new car at a dealer).
     
  19. 275gtb6c

    275gtb6c Formula 3
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    #67 275gtb6c, Sep 14, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2010
    The value on the chassis stamps is currently totally overrated in my opinion. At that time no one was interested apart from customs in stamped numbers. For the new owner this information was completely irrelevant, something like the bithday of your mother in law.....

    I do think fresh owners of the Ferrari's were interested if their body was alloy (ref to the Supperleggera badges on some Maserati's and AM and so), number of carbs and quality of building.

    As for now I dont even know my license plates let alone chassis numbers of my modern cars, I do know the birthday of my wife though....(always forget when we got married...)
    Just my opinion, but than again I can be in the herd of noknowers
    ciao
    Oscar
     
  20. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I agree. Race History if any has value like Mark's that ran at the Ring but the one the factory raced or an alloy one, 6 carbs, outside fuel filler are more interesting to me than a steel 3 carbed one with no race history.
     
  21. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
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    At least according to Ferrari's modern personal, the chassis stamping was done purposely to distinguish the car for "GT" racing for a private client in the lowest / stock level category.

    Porsche did the exact opposite in period at the same time on at least two 911R models. The chassis number on one of our 911R models was stamped "11899002P" rather than the way it was listed in all of the "history" books and chassis lists which identified the car as "11899002R." Initially this gave us quite a bit of concern as the car had been missing since the late 1960s and we were concerned we had purchased a fake.

    When I inquired with Porsche about the "P" in the chassis number rather than an "R" they explained that there was great concern that a client would enter a 911R in a "GT" race and Porsche would risk loosing the homologation status of the 911, 911L Rally and 911S models.

    The "P" for "Prototype" would make it impossible during scruitineering for an entrant to pass the car off as a production "GT" as the officials would have copies of the homologation documents for each model as well as the homologated chassis number range as approved by the officials.

    Right about 1966/67, Ferrari as did Porsche and several other manufacturers made it impossibly easy for both the Factory Teams as well as clients to switch and swap chassis numbers at will on their homologated race cars. Rather than using elaborate chassis stamps on special sections of the frames, they would simply stamp a 3, 4 or 5 digit number onto a small metal tag and tack weld this in an easy to see area. This would allow for numbers to be swapped at the track or anywhere at will as needed to meet race requirements.

    I would guess more than 1/2 of the 917 Porsches have had numbers changed in order to meet entry deadlines when a car was damaged etc... and another had to be substituted. Ferrari did the same thing on a variety of 312P and 512S/M models at the same time.

    Today collectors are shocked to think that the manufacturers might do such a thing but believe it or not, the practice was quite common.

    In the case of the 275 "GTB" and oddity "GTC" variant, the chassis stampings are done on with a block die that contains a slew of information and done so in a very precise way. While not impossible to make a mistake, you would have to really bone-up to mistakenly use a "C" rather than "B" when organizing the letters and numbers into the press block prior to making the stamp. Unlike the chassis tag which is pop-rivetted on, the chassis stamps are what Customs will look at during import and export of a given vehicle.

    Hope this helps,

    Bill
     
  22. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Fascinating stuff. Thanks Bill
     
  23. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Block stampings were changed as well to match carnets. In 67 Ferrari admits to have swapped the identies of 0856 and 0858. The chassis tags are as you've described but the last digit of block stamping were also altered and altered back. There are other blocks that were altered as well. PPP has photo's of altered block stamps.
     
  24. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
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    Can anyone translate this:

    Le "4000 Prototipo" non saranno le sole macchine "sport" per la prossima stagione. Fra le "sport" (minimo 50 esemplari) vi saranno le "Le Mans", e fra le "gran turismo" (minimo 500 esemplari) le "275 GT/B" il cui impiego in corsa, pero, sara lasciato exclusivament ai clienti. Ci sara, ovviamente, anch un certo numero di Dino. Costruite le prime 50 unita, anche questo tipo di vettura potra correre solo in mano a privati."

    From Quattroruote, January 1966, "Ferrari Svela (con cautela) i suoi piani per il 1966"
     
  25. sixcarbs

    sixcarbs F1 Rookie
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    From my friend:

    I'll try but it's written for someone who knows car lingo...

    The 4000 Prototype won't be the only sport car for the next season. Among the sport (minimum 50 exceptions) there will be "le Mans" and among the "grand Turismo" (minimum 5000 exceptions) the 275GT/B in which will be done right now however will be left exclusively to the clients. There will be, obviously a certain number of 'Dino'.

    There will be 50 units built, also this type of car can run only in the hands of private (clients?customers?)
     
  26. Mark Shannon

    Mark Shannon Formula Junior
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    #74 Mark Shannon, Sep 15, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 19, 2011
    I have seen a 275 GTB, that does not appear to be either the cars talked about by Furanku or Bill and is not Mark K's car, with the chassis stamping "275 GTC". The engine was out of the car, so I cannot tell you anything else about that.

    Otherwise it looked completely normal.

    Mark Shannon
     
  27. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    Mystery thickens every day... I really wish Marcel Massini could give us his point of view on that matter, but I understand from other threads he doesn't have much time these days to share his very impressive knowledge.
    I hope we will eventually find the light and get a clear answer about this big question mark.
    Thank you all for your inputs!
     
  28. JazzyO

    JazzyO F1 World Champ

    Jan 14, 2007
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    This is how I read it, but I'm not Italian. Yet. :)

    The 4000 Prototype won't be the only sportscar for the next season. The "sport" version (minimum 50 cars) which will run at "le Mans", and the "grand Turismo" (minimum 500 cars) version of the 275GT/B, which can also race, however this will be left exclusively to clients. There will be, obviously, also a certain number of 'Dino'. There will be 50 units built, and this type of car will also only be run in the hands of privateers


    Onno
     
  29. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #77 Napolis, Sep 15, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2010
    What mystery? Ferrari made some cars eligible for "Showroom Stock". Steel bodied, 3 carbs and may have stamped them with a C. They weren't factory race cars. Mark's ran at the Ring. Did your friend's run anywhere? For a fee Classiche will answer your questions but your friend doesn't want to pay for that. Marcel's bored with answering questions for free. That doesn't surprise me. Bill told you what he knows. Stating the mystery deepens is silly.
     
  30. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    The word "mistery" might not be the right one here, but there are still unanswered questions. We are not sure about the actual number of cars that were stamped "GTC", we don't know specificaly if there are any differences between GTC and GTB, and some people here don't even believe it was purposedly stamped differently.

    You're probably right, Classiche may answer all those questions, the point is my friend is curious about his car history, but has no will to sell his car, therefore the fee that may be considered as an investment in case you think it can ad value to your car becomes ridiculously high.

    If Marcel is bored with answering questions for free, that's perfectly understandable. I was only refering to him since I saw many very interresting messages from him, and I thought he enjoyed sharing his knowledge. If it's not the case anymore, I will not blame him.

    Now just to clear things up, there are two reasons why I started this thread. The first one is that I wanted to help a friend who wants to know as many things as possible about his beloved car. The second is that I thought Ferrari lovers (including myself) would be interrested in knowing the existence of 275 GTC stamped cars, and in learning as many details about those cars as possible. I think it's clear from the very beginning I have personaly no financial gain whatsoever on the outcome of this conversation. I have discovered the little world of vintage Ferrari through this friend I've been talking about, so pardon me if i'm not used to it. In this world I'm starting to feel the line between information that can be shared freely and information that bears potential profit is very thin and hard to define.

    While I was writing this message, I got a call from my friend. I'll meet with him and his engine mechanic tomorrow, I'll let you know if I find out anything of interrest.

    Cheers
     
  31. Jeff Kennedy

    Jeff Kennedy F1 Rookie
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    Beyond Marcel there is an F-chatter that goes by Tom Roland that may have the ability to get difinitive factory information, if he doesn't already have the information. Another, although he does not come to F-chat, is Jess Pourett. Jess does part of the year in France so you/your friend may be able to make some contact with him. Jess does have standing with the factory achieve section.

    I too remain curious on the quantity of 275 GTCs actually made and stamped as such. Related to that is across what timespan were these cars were built. Were they built in batches or randomly interspersed.

    By extrapolation from the apparent fact that this is an unknown/little known model designation I would think that the quanity is quite small. I think it would be interesting to understand if some of these cars were bought as just a normal 275 GTB because it was available at a dealer versus knowing it had a specific competion purpose.

    Jeff
     
  32. tazandjan

    tazandjan Two Time F1 World Champ
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    People who want all kinds of information but want to keep all details of their own vehicle secret usually do not fare as well as people who share and contribute to the general community. You might pass that message on to your friend. If he wants to post photographs of his car and the differences he has noted, he will probably get more cooperation. Nobody wants to spend time providing information that will disappear into a black hole with no benefit to the community.

    Napolis and others who share their information are the model that will generate all the help and information they need. Secret squirrel owners who hide all their nuts do us little good.

    Taz
    Terry Phillips
     
  33. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Exactly. While it is nice to think that F-Chat is a respected source it is primarily a community and should be respected as such.
    There has been a trend of late where single issue posters visit looking to take more than they share.
    Be it arguing a legal case, establishing bona-fides for a particular car or some other attempt to further a personal interest. I, for one, resent it when people are not candid about their interests.
    Be open with us and you'll get all the assistance you could ever want.
     
  34. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    +1
     
  35. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    +2
     
  36. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    I understand your point of views. It's true that not being able to post pictures of the car I'm mainly talking about is dissapointing to most of you. If you look closely at my posts, you may still see that I'm trying to share all I've got. You had a description of the car, which looks like any other 275 GTB series 3. You have the description of the stamping, and if you read carefully you can even guess its serial number that I didn't want to write so that it's not easily findable by a google search. I told you everything we know about its history, what we've heard from mechanics, and I know it's not a lot, but except pictures that I was specifically forbiden to post, I told you everything. It is clear that if it were my car, you would have many, many pictures, I would even be happy to make it its own website, but me and my friend are not from the same generation, and he has lived through experiences that made him a very secret person (in a small village, people get jealous easily, and you can find your animals killed in your garder for no reason at all...). Now I will try again tomorrow to convince him to share in a more pictural way, but I have to be honest, I don't think he'll accept.

    About the single poster aspect, I understand that you can think that of me. I've been reading threads for a long time, but never had anything of interrest to share/ask with you, and to be franc, you're all quite intimidating! As I told you, I'm not an owner, and probably won't be one in the next 10 years. I did everything I could, I was good at school, gratuated one of the best business schools in my country, I go a good position an have a salary that many would envy me, yet I'm not even close to get my hands on one of the cars I'm dreaming of. This world, vintage Ferrari, is the priviledge of very few people, and I am always amazed when I check your profiles. Please understand that compared to you, to your experiences, I have very few to share and to give you. But if you let me stay around, on this thread or other ones, I will learn, and in 10 or 20 years, I may be able to help people with my knowledge too.

    OK, I guess that was a little off-topic, but it felt good to tell you where I stand. Please be assured of my sincerity, and I'm sure you'll soon recognize my passion for Ferrari. I may not be able to touch it physicaly every day, but it's with me all the time.
     
  37. Julio Batista

    Julio Batista Formula 3

    Dec 22, 2005
    2,397
    A part from the merits of the "275 GTC" question (and I think you all know where I provisionally stand), I have been very favorably impressed by the sincere tone of Furaku's private correspondence with me.

    Good luck Furaku, I hope you find your vintage Fertrari soon.:)
     
  38. GTSguy

    GTSguy Formula Junior

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    Agreed.

    Someone has to start posting at some point.... And hey, this is far more interesting than 80% of the stuff typically found here....
     
  39. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    #87 swift53, Sep 15, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2010
    Why is it in this world, that we at times, are always acting in other persons' interests? As in "I have a friend that is having an impotence issue, and he asked me if you could diagnose over the phone", while pointing at his ugly wife's photo...?
    I mean, I can understand privacy, but you know, I have a friend that has a Dino, that would love to ask, but...Please, fill in the blank...
    This is f-chat, not the Da Vinci blah blah blah, no? If pm's are sent at will, why not post publicly, or, are we trying to "protect the innocent"? How frightfully dull can it get. We love photos, right?
    Regards, Alberto
     
  40. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    So, what do we know now? Proof, photos, pm's? Even if you speak only Sanskrit, you can in all likelihood, babel-fish it...Give me a break, or...is it brake?
    Regards, Alberto
     
  41. BigTex

    BigTex Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Hopefully the OP has learned what he was seeking.

    Not all answers will ever be known about Ferraris in the Paddock, some were race cars in prototype classes, some were entered as GTs, and sometimes they made one, that appeared to be something else.....;)

    I doubt the modern company will ever clear the air on such things, Napolis has already made them say more than they would like to admit, I'd imagine.
     
  42. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    I just remembered one thing I saw on a forum. It's a French thread about car meetings taking place every first Sunday of the month in my town. It may be of interest for those who really want pictures...;-) And I didn't post anything...
    http://www.forum-auto.com/automobiles-mythiques-exception/section5/sujet379137-385.htm
    Now it really doesn't help in finding answers, and I somehow doubt we'll ever be able to have everybody on this forum to believe 275GTC were no mistakes (or the contrary, I'm still not sure myself!).
    More tomorrow about the engine and hopefully chassis, I hope. I'll share as much as I can, I can assure you of that.
     
  43. Jeff Kennedy

    Jeff Kennedy F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Oct 16, 2007
    4,202
    Edwardsville, IL
    Full Name:
    Jeff Kennedy
    See if your friend will at least allow photos of the data plate and stampings. These will identify the car but not show the house/town/person/license plate.

    Jeff
     
  44. toddtim

    toddtim Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 4, 2010
    44
    Lubbock, Texas
    Full Name:
    Todd Timberlake
    This is the best thread I have read to date! I sincerely look forward to gaining more knowledge about this! I too wish we could have pics of "the friend's" 275 specimen!

    Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge...the folks on here never cease to amaze me! I now know where to come with any and all vintage Ferrari questions.

    Cheers!
    TT
     
  45. tazandjan

    tazandjan Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    27,402
    Albuquerque, NM
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Hopefully it is not the black GTB with the street Borranis. Those would never have worked on a race track. Completely different from the competition wire wheels. The silver car is very attractive.

    I agree with Jim and see no reason Ferrari would not have done a GTC. If they could charge extra money for it at little additional cost to themselves, I am sure they would have done it. In just a few years Enzo would be bargaining with Ford and ultimately "merge" with Fiat. They needed every dime they could find back then.

    Taz
    Terry Phillips
     
  46. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 17, 2007
    3,760
    E.S.
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    "Juste un détail pour la forme, la Ferrari noire était une 275 GTB/2 de 66, et non une GTS (qui est un spyder avec un look complètement différent). Plus haut, la même en gris est une 275 GTB/4 (pour 4 arbres à cames au lieu de deux). Superbe plateau, hier, vraiment!"

    Translation:

    Just a detail for the shape, the black Ferrari is a 275 GTB/2, '66, and not a GTS (that is a spider with a completely different look) Further up, the same in gray is a 275 GTB/4 (4 cam instead of two) A super set yesterday, truly!

    Et alors?

    "So?"

    I simply don't get it. Hopefully someone will have a lot more to say. The suspense is simply...
    This is more than Insp.Clouseau can deal with...

    Regards, Alberto
     
  47. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    As I wrote before, my friend changed the wheels to Boranis some years ago.
     
  48. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    I actually had forgotten I had written those comments! You asked for pictures, and I remembered I had seen some that I technicaly didn't post myself, so I thought it was a good way to satisfy your curiosity, gain some people's trust without betraying my friend's directives...

    About stamping pictures, I will probably not post a picture of my friend's car's, because he would not want me to for reasons I'm not here to judge. What I do have is pictures of 08457 stamping. I wanted to ask you guys, those pictures were sent to me by Mark K, who's currently selling the car. Do you think it's OK to post it, given that there are already many pictures on Mark K's website, including engine stamping, and that the picture of the GTC stamping is not on the website probably because he didn't want the site to be overloaded with pictures? I honnestly think it can do no harm to him, but I would really like to be sure. You're gonna tell me I should ask him directly, but to be perfectly honest, I don't think he wants to hear from me anymore, since I turned out to be just another "time waster", after my friend's friend would decide he was not interrested in the car.

    Time to sleep in France, good night everybody, and thank you very much to those who argued in my favor, please know it meant a lot to me.
     
  49. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    1,402
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    Furanku,

    I don't know what the protocol is on posting something like that. Mark Ketcham is a member here http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/member.php?u=88045 if anyone would like to DM him to see if posting would be OK.

    Best,
    Dave
     
  50. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    Hi everyone,

    Sorry I didn't post any update before, but unfortunately I had nothing new / interesting to write. I went to my friend's on Friday, but his mechanic was unable to point out any difference with a "normal" 275 GTB. The only thing I learned is that originally the car had seats with horizontal stripes, when all the other 275 I've seen had vertical stripes.Given their worn out aspect when my friend bought the car in 1976, those were probably installed in the car when it was originally assembled. I don't know if it was an option or whatever.

    For me, it was an occasion to get in the car for the first time and go to a small tour with my friend driving. Apart from the fact I am not used to cruise in a car with no seat belt on, I felt the car was quite comfortable, and the roar of the engine, even not going at higher speeds than 5000/min, was astonishing. Before Friday, I couldn't wait for that moment when I could actually run in this car. From now on, I can't wait for the next time i'll be able to accompany my friend in one of his cruises again!

    My friend is still working on getting the build sheet of his car. Once he has it, we'll try to clear things up about the hypothetical differences that may or may not make this car special in any way. I'll keep you posted when I learn more about that. Again, thank you all for your inputs and views!
     
  51. T308

    T308 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    May 12, 2004
    979
    Southern Cal
    #99 T308, Jan 12, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Is Mark still the owner of this car? I have pre-restoration photos of the car that the current owner may enjoy.
    nose.jpg
    rear deck.jpg
    as found.jpg
     
  52. Furanku

    Furanku Formula Junior

    Sep 25, 2009
    351
    I think he finally sold the car, judging by the simple fact the ad is not on his site anymore.
    Thanks for the pictures, do you know where those were taken? I know the car was, at some point, maintained in France before racing at Le Mans Classic, but those look much older to me.
    For those who followed this thread 4 months ago, we still have not managed to get new information, in particular my friend has still not got his hands on the mounting sheet of his car, but it may be on its way... Anyway, I haven't forgotten my thread, and if I ever have new elements to share, I will keep you informed.
     

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