Differences in parts between QV FI and QV DD engines?

I beleive the the FI QV power difference is tied the the FI unit. There is a US variant Countach which is owned by the most experienced Lamborghini mechanic of all time - near the city of Modena. He replaced the original FI unit with that of the Diablo, and that particular Countach is very fast.

 

a good working DD with sport exhaust is not much slower than the average diablo until...180-200 Kmh
then the diablo VASTLY improved aerodinamic will make a big difference

no idea how fast a FI qv is stock, for sure some mods will make a big difference in weight and power on them and it is easier to find more power on the FI than is in the carbed QV.

 

Guys,we do know,all of us,and please chime inn those of you who still dont get it, the dd as delivered is quicker than the Us spec fulie with cats and log exhaust,why are you beating the old horse, lets move on ,we get this ,we have seen the pictures posted of cams and pistons,please ,your car in the picture is pretty,thanks for posting,but its off toplc, this is about removing the cat and log exhast on the fulie,install Joes exhaust or dd style headers,then get rid of 150 lbs or so in bumpers,this way it would be back to original weight, this is all i am saying,this is afair assumption, beeing the hp diff is 35 as delivered,and in my world easyli obtained in the exhaust departement, thats alll ,please no more comparos stock us with dd we all get that

 

Keep the comments constructive. My thoughts on the dd vs fuel injection are that the cars will run similar - given similar specs, but the edge would still be the carbed version. That means the cams, pistons, exhaust, added dot jewelry (I like that one Nils), smog pump etc are the same. The 80's were some dark years emission wise in the US. I still remember taking my different cars to the vet testing station (vehicle emission testing) and having them fail. I would have to retard the timing (in the parking lot to the point that the car was hardly drivable), run almost straight fuel additive, and not get on the throttle when they told me, to get it to pass. My old Ducati had to be done on really cool day or forget it. If they restarted that mess up, I know for sure a carbed car would never fly. That's the reality regardless of collector demand.

Now collector wise, there is no dispute in my mind which is more desirable, but that's not the point of this thread. The differences are what we are interested in.

So far, we have:

-pistons
-camshafts
-cat convertors, smog pump (which no one ever has connected anyways)
-dot jewelry
-fuel injected system (different gas tanks?)
-timing settings

Anything else?

 

Good post, progress,yes exhaust headers, the most important part, Srt/Viper guys claim 40 hp with good headers my marine experience, is better than tat,but also motors of different nature than the countach . As stated ,35 hp should be very easily obtaiable just on the exhaust side, and perhaps the cams with todays fuel does in fact make the fi /header /combo the better performer,

 

And yes i am not refering to value or desirability, wich is up to each and everyone to decide,and ofcuorse the market , as it moves along,

 

F/I headers are terrible. The open collector is a terrible design. My FI has quicksilver jet coated headers, and quicksilver exhaust. Any DD owners in Southern Cali want to meet up? Wonder if there is a scale around I can weigh mine at.

 

Look for a place that sells gravel or rock? The truck scales are fairly accurate from what I've seen.

 

Truck stop , not shure if accurate to the lbs but iwould think nearest 10 or so. We use them for the boats. Beeing they fit my long boats with the tractor or dually. Hey. Joe is in so cal. Perhaps this would be a good chance to do some dragracing��������

 

Would anyone have camshaft specifications for both? (not part nos.) Lift, duration, and timing specs. Once you have a thorough understanding of how CIS works you'll understand the audio differences better.

 

Lamborghini Owner's manuals are always correct.

 

Its a great idea!

We have a Fuelie QV in the shop, and have access to others plus more Downdrafts besides mine, so, we can do some side-by-side Dyno comparisons, then, also do some performance testing at a suitable local venue - say an airstrip. Perhaps even have a factory test driver drive both cars, and have the event properly electronically recorded and photographed for the purposes of an online video & magazine feature.

Such a piece in a prominent magazine would be the appropriate venue for highlighting the differences between the two variants.

Side-by-side comparos are essential, and we can only thank DaniT for the basis of these posts http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/145168901-post2.html & http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/145175409-post9.htmln which I have in the Downdraft thread also.

When I published the Miura and 288 GTO books, I thought that was enough for me. A faor number of people have asked me to do a book on the Countach (yourself included), and, although I was reluctant in the past due to the effort involved, Ive now decided that in due course I will, and the differences between the Downdraft and the Fuelie will be highlighted in a dedicated chapter, the proposed magazine article included.

Let's just say this thread has got me fired up and enthusiastic about a Countach book!

Good comes out of everything

 

Some Downdrafts had these headers you describe, specifically, cars delivered to Switzerland.

Even using free flow headers and a sport exhaust, based on the pistons/cams/injectors setup of the Fuelie, it will always be significantly slower than the Downdraft.
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Emilio, as you know Ive owned & driven everything from LP400 to 25th so I'm blessed with a little more Countach experience than some. On that basis, there is no question in my mind that the Fuelie QV 'feels' the slowest of all the Countach variants I have driven. It does not have the 'punchy' feel of any of the carburetted cars, and, you'll note in its only proper test it topped at at 166 mph.

Knowledge of Countachs is a journey, and at this point, I'm not convinced the stated 420 bhp is genuine. The reason I feel this way after giving it much thought is simply, the 375bhp LP500S feels just as quick and in fact more alive than the QV Fuelie.

As regards finding more power in the Downdraft, it can easily be done (as with most cars!), with sport cams, air-intake adjustments, etc. in fact, Vale & I talked about this extensively, and both he and Ing. Luigi Marmiroli have assured me that the Downdraft engine leaves some power on the table. The Countach Evoluzione (Super Countach - below) proves this.
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Good points Alex.

The trouble with some of the viewpoints on this thread is that some of them are coming from people who have never owned/maintained/restored or driven a Downdraft extensively, so in reality, they are not really in a position to make any legitimate first-hand comparisons of any value.

I have driven a good number of Fuelies a good distance, and owned two (2) Downdrafts the first of which I drove practically every day! That said, I can say from an educated and balanced perspective that the Downdraft is just as reliable and drives as well as a Fuelie in all conditions, in fact, more so. Personally, I didnt think the Fuel-injection system of the Fuelies Ive driven was all that inspiring. The notion that a Downdraft is temperamental is completely false, a trumped-up concept perpetrated by people who don't have one. Now that I look back, in the late 80s my nearly-new Downdraft which I used almost daily was as reliable as my Mercedes Benz!

I also agree with Simon Kidston’s knowledgeable remarks (as posted on the image you've posted) that the Downdraft is the best all-round Countach variant - this coming from an LP400 owner! I'll always concede that the LP400 is the purest-looking and the 25th is the best built/handling, but as Marcello Gandini himself said in 2002 whilst looking at a Downdraft: "This is the way the car should have been from the start".

Ultimately, the Downdraft is the sweet-spot for the Quattrovalvole, and values reflect that. I think its value will ultimately increase beyond that of all others in time.

 

You bet.

Just today, I am walking through Whole Foods Market and I receive a call from a USA gentleman (who may be reading this) who says he wanted to buy a Countach from an FChatter but the car didn't work out for him. He would like a Countach and he was at pains to let me know without any prompting on my part "I’ve concluded that I do not want a Fuel-injected Countach". I think the precedent towards how the Countach is appreciated in popular culture is well-established even before threads like this and the Downdraft thread came to be.

 

I guess it is close to comparing LM002 DD vs fuelie.
My friend has a DD Anniversario and to me the camshaft sounds VERY different than a fuelie Anniversario or fuelie LM.

 

Joe ,did you read any of this?

 

This is a good post ,constructive and meaningful,in your oppinion even with the exhaust cleaned up on the fuelie. It will still be slightly behind on power, beeing the fuel injection somewhat consticts the power, even thogh the engines are identicalwit the exeption of 0,1 in compression ratio, fair enough

 

I look forward to the article and subsequent book Joe!
R

 

You are aware this discussion is about the two versions of the qv(4 valve) engines in similar unrestricted exhaust setup?one fi one carbed. Thanks

 

Absolutely mind boggeling and disapointing why you have such problem reg giving the fi the dd exhaust treatment,its performance could poss improve or perhaps match the dd, beeing the cars are identical with ex of us reg bumper eqipment, fi and 0,1 comp ratio. Are fighting a personal war against fi owners? Your behavior makes absolutely no sense coming from a guy like you.

 

Funny that the Lamborghini factory didn't choose to register the racing FIA certification with the fuelie engine equipped with an ansa exhaust instead of the "old" carbed version 😀😀😀😀😀😀

 

Are you for real?have you read any of my posts?