MCLAREN 720S OR 488 | Page 22 | FerrariChat

MCLAREN 720S OR 488

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by doccharlie954, Jun 7, 2017.

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  1. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    #526 TheMayor, Jul 29, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    You can't compare the resale of the 12 cyl GT cars. They have traditionally depreciated more than 2 seat sports cars.

    If Mac made a 12 cylinder GT it would be worse.

    McLaren likes to make and send a lot of cars to the states. When they don't move dealers discount them which then drives down used car prices, even low mileage ones.

    Right now there are 161 Mac 570's for sale on Cars.com. Not good:
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  2. douglas360

    douglas360 Karting

    Nov 7, 2016
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    I heard on YT (from Shmee150) that McLaren intend to introduce 15 new models in the next 5 years. Jesus Christ on a Candlestick. You have to be nuts to *buy* a Macca right now - because soul crushing depreciation - but by all means if you can get an attractive lease then go for it.
     
  3. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    It's all the folks jumping up to get a 720.
    Same thing will happen when 720 spider comes out which is when I'll be in the market for. 720 coupe. :)
     
  4. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    They made a ton of money on the P1, even in such low quantities. Look for 2 more of these "hypercars" in that mix.
     
  5. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    I don't think so.

    120 of them are NEW

    How many new 458's were sold new from Ferrari dealers without a pre-sold order? Zero.

    IMO, you could probably walk into any Mac dealer today and ask 20 grand for any new model on the floor and they wouldn't toss you out. That drives down resale car values because they have to compete.
     
  6. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    You sure those are new cars? The one you posted has a bit over 1000 miles.
     
  7. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Never registered. Probably a demo. 30 grand off MSRP as a starting point is a pretty good deal on a 1000 mile demo.

    If you go in Cars.com and click on new for 570s and 570gt you get 120 cars


    I can't vouch for the dealer's accuracy of the ads but for sure, these are real cars on real lots being offered for sale.
     
  8. LARRYH

    LARRYH F1 Veteran
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    488 for certain .. the Mac is nice enough and drives great.. but it is not a Ferrari.....
     
  9. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Ok you are right. 50 or so 570s. The rest at GTs. Yes, that is quite a bit.
     
  10. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    I still like the spider. Spiders generally hold value better than coupes in the US.

    If you're not into Porsche the 570 could hit the spot as a DD.
     
  11. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    I actually prefer coupes. I'm on the "list" for a 488 spider but honestly, not really sure I want it. Same thing with 720. Everyone is going to jump to a 720 spider when it comes which means coupes will be great bargains.

    I'm in no rush, happy to wait and not get the latest and greatest.
     
  12. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    In general, the 488 just doesn't do it for me. But, that's just me.

    Like someone said, "they made the Speciale too good".
     
  13. 1mean3

    1mean3 Formula Junior
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    And there are 81 488s and a 151 Ferrari 458s.....Lots of everything. You want a new 488 spider? No problem.
     
  14. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    No argument from me. My dealer is emailing me every week about a 488 he has.

    The market is over saturated. But Ferrari does not bring in new cars like McLaren does and that's where the cost cutting and depreciation start.
     
  15. exoticcardreamer

    exoticcardreamer Formula 3

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    I'm not making any case for mclaren. I could've roped in aventador sv's into my example too.

    Nothing I said was a revelation or earth shattering. It's all captain obvious stuff and everyone who actually plays in this space knows all this.

    On these forums people like to talk about depreciation or lack of it. Many of the postings are from people who are buying 3 to 5 year old cars that are pretty much fully depreciated and then brag about how the price is holding steady.

    Very, very few first time ferrari owners can go straight to a brand new 488. Everyone else has to buy another car which is a money losing type car and hold onto it until they get 488. You can't then just isolate how much the 488 depreciated because there was another car involved in it.
     
  16. 1mean3

    1mean3 Formula Junior
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    +1 truth.

    Thats where Ferrar's history + product + market management makes them #1. Its good to be king!
     
  17. Shack

    Shack F1 Rookie
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    !00% correct - worse than soul crushing !! Fall of a cliff stuff - Been there done that and very happy not to be in a Mac right now. Wouldnt even look at a 720 Coupe as the second the spider arrives it drops another 30%.

    Here we have to absorb 33% tax which compounds the problem
     
  18. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Here's another way to look at it.

    Imagine this thread were "720s or Aventador"


    I think almost all of us would say 720s. So we are biased for Ferrari --but its understandable

    IMO, the 720s will hurt Lambo sales quite a bit. Its faster, newer, has more technology, handles better, has "drama doors", and might be sexier at a lower price. It lacks the V12 but I bet it will run rings around an Aventador.
     
  19. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
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    *sigh*

    This includes super low production models, spiders, LTs, spider LTs, lower performance spiders, track models, etc.

    This is not 15 models. It's 15 model variations. This is a normal amount of models. Ferrari will have produced just as many over 5 years -- coupes, spiders, speciales, gtos, super rare LEs, etc. Normal product life in this segment is 5-6 years.

    2015 - 2020:

    570S
    570GT
    570 Spider
    570 LT
    540 Spider (maybe?)
    570 Sprint
    720S
    720S Spider
    720LT
    720 LT Spider
    720 Sprint
    B23 (106 cars, $3M)
    P15
    P15 GTR
    570 replacement
    570 replacement Spider
    570 replacement something

    Ferrari will have released nearly as many models over a 5-6 year span as well.

    2012-2017:

    458 Spider
    458 Speciale
    458 Aperta
    F12
    F12 TDF
    California T
    LF
    LF Spider
    LF KXX
    488
    488 Spider
    488 Speciale
    New GT car debut this Fall
    F60 America
     
  20. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
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    You can definitely get $15-20K off a new 570S or GT. You can's get $15-20K off a new one with zero options, but you can definitely get a car with $20K in options for $15-20K off.
     
  21. mik458spider

    mik458spider Formula 3

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    Prices of super cars and hyper cars were rocketing because many people bought them as investment. But in the end, they'd need somebody to really buy it and drive it. Because unlike stocks or bonds, cars investment doesn't give coupon or dividend.
    Now there are so many models being thrown into the market, unlike last time only Ferrari and Lambo. So these end-users better spend money on few super cars rather than one overpriced limited edition. And with interest rate keeps increasing, "investors" are thinking to sell their collections.
    Some one-off models like LaF, Enzo, etc will definitely hold the value better, but those Speciale Aperta, TDF, 675 LT, etc (normal model on steroid) will plunge imo.
     
  22. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
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    Globally agree but I guess there are more factors into play, rarity and "historic value" being two of them.
    430 Scuderia and 458 Speciale have begun to mildly drop (and it's probably only the beginning) but 16M and Speciale Aperta may resist better. Probably the Scuderia will have a harder time because the 458 is objectively a better car and apart from its (very relative) raririty the Scuderia does not have much to offer; the Speciale may rely on its "historic value" of last NA V8 to counter the fact the 488 is a better all-rounder.
    The 675LT is blown away by the 720S so again not sure its rarity will protect it, because it's not that different (same carbon and turbo technologies) and the 720S is apparently a far a better car.
     
  23. Camlet1

    Camlet1 Formula 3

    May 3, 2014
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    I think you're spot on, as usual.

    Up until now I hadn't given Macca a second look, I'm a rabid Ferrarista. But the 720S has started a tickle down below in my never regions which only Ferrari has touched before ;) In my opinion the 720 it makes the 488 look old. And from early reports, Macca have seriously raised their game with the 720 in all areas.

    I agree, the main hit will be Lambo buyers, as for me I am waiting to see the 488 VS. I think a strong Macca is good for everyone. It sharpens competition, it raises the bar. From Porsche up, the choice has never been more exciting.

    Anyway here's hoping Ferrari turn the screw tighter and make the 488 VS volcanic :)
     
  24. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
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    Ha ha ... wish it was that way ... The Factory knows/decides "what is good for us" :D
     
  25. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Rookie
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    Huracan is selling like crazy. Lambo cannibilized the Aventador with the Huracan P.
     

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