The Holey Daytona | Page 18 | FerrariChat

The Holey Daytona

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Wheels1, Jan 27, 2008.

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  1. Randy Forbes

    Randy Forbes Formula Junior

    Jul 14, 2006
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    If I can be of any help in your fact-finding, please let me know.

    This is the brand of products I use: http://www.techlinecoatings.com/hi-performance/bs-internal-engine-coatings.html

    It appears that they have a UK source as well: http://www.camcoat.com/main/site
     
  2. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    Grant
    Thanks Randy, but i am not brave enough to try these new things, the engine has cost a fortune so far, so i think i will stick to new stainless steel ones from F-UK that are proven.
    Grant
     
  3. 246tasman

    246tasman Formula 3

    Jun 21, 2007
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    #428 246tasman, Jan 16, 2010
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2010
    Thanks Grant, I've just spoken to Rob who was very helpful. I look forward to viviting him & Mike soon. The man with the distrib machine is at Loughborough, so is handy for me.

    The distributors actually need to be done off the car to get them exact. It makes all the difference.
     
  4. Randy Forbes

    Randy Forbes Formula Junior

    Jul 14, 2006
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    #429 Randy Forbes, Jan 16, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    :)

    I can't say that I blame you, but it's hardly new technology. These are practices developed by NASA (National Aeronautics and Space Administration) and passed to the private sector through their "technology transfer" of the late 80s. I've been doing all my engines and various assemblies this way since approximately 1992.

    More stuff that came out of the oven last night (and then I'll leave you alone ;) ), these are coated with thermal barrier (hub/rotor interface flange) and thermal dispersant (to assist in radiating heat away from a part).
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  5. IanB

    IanB F1 World Champ
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    Jun 15, 2006
    15,653
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    Grant,

    I have been down the path of ceramic coating valves (and piston skirts) in a Stratos engine (i.e. Ferrari 246) and it made no discernable difference to engine performance or temperatures.

    However, I highly recommend having your exhaust headers ceramic coated, inside and out, as this gives a significant reduction in engine bay temperatures and extends the life of the headers - to the point that they simply don't wear out at all. It's not an expensive job.

    I think Randy's process below would be a real benefit to your internals, but I sympathise with the reality of cost vs. benefit. We all get wallet fatigue after a Daytona rebuild!

    Regards,
    Ian
     
  6. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    Grant
    Randy your work look great.
    Re the exhaust headers, they are being done as we speak Ian, or very soon any way. I went for the silver color as it is most like the unfinished steel color they would have been when new.

    Most of the engine work have now been done,[ bores honed, liners honed, crank ground, new oversize pistons to allow for the honeing, little end bush's made and fitted, etc etc etc.] just waiting for Ferrari UK to sell me some valves! They have been getting back to me [ or not is more like it] for two weeks, they do not have a full set but will have by the end of next month, but at least if we get most of the valves, the machine shop can make to followers [ this sounds like i know what i am talking about but not really].

    Rob is going to ice blast or bead blast the block before painting, i think he said ice but not to sure on that as i have got a cold at the moment and i am not sure which way round my head is at the moment. I have found the thread on engine paint and primer but any other suggestion on what to use?
    Thanks for your help guys.
    Grant
     
  7. Randy Forbes

    Randy Forbes Formula Junior

    Jul 14, 2006
    741
    Sarasota, FL
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    Ice blasting sounds like it has many benefits over conventional methods.

    Now, how can I fit this into this year's budget...?

    http://www.dryiceblastcleaning.com/
     
  8. pmallinson

    pmallinson Rookie

    Apr 9, 2008
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    Peter Mallinson
    #433 pmallinson, Jan 19, 2010
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2010
  9. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    hi Pete
    I hope you are well.
    Glad to see you are joining the F-chat fold. [ looks like you joined a long time ago, and choose the best thread to start your posts in]. LOL
    Thanks for the info, i did not know of them. I am hoping to get the valve soon with any luck.
    All the best
    Grant
     
  10. zstyle

    zstyle Formula Junior

    Jun 28, 2007
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    Jon
    this thread reminds me on craig jackson's daytona. Frame is tweaked into an s shape, front fenders and headlight area has/had to be replaced, door skins, and the tubing in engine compartment. big task to tackle by yourself.
     
  11. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    The exhaust and inlet valves arrived from Ferrari UK yesterday, [ at long last] so now back on track.
    Grant
     
  12. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    #437 Wheels1, Jan 25, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Strange news on the exhaust valves.
    The first ones where rejected as they had the wrong size collet and the heads where too big, about 30 thou. more than the ones in the car.

    The second lot from Ferrari UK that have just come have the correct collect and length but the heads are the same,[ too big again] they are the correct size according to the Daytona manual, but smaller than the ones that where in my car, so i would guess Ferrari changed the design part way through production and did not up date the manual! The inlet valves are correct so it's most strange.

    They have been sent to the machinist, who will decide the best way forward. I will keep you updated of course.

    I should have said, i had no intension of rebuilding the gear box, but when Rob took the leather cover of the gear leaver he found that someone had filed the H Gate, to make second gear work better, and i remembered it did jump out of second if i left my hand on the gear knob, so we thought it better to check it out while we where at it.
    Grant
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  13. maximilian.szwaj

    Nov 10, 2003
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    Maximilian Szwaj
    Grant,
    do you mean First Gear or Second Gear?
    Max.
     
  14. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    Sorry Max,
    yes i meant 1st gear,[ its been a long time since i have driven it].
    When i sat at lights or roundabouts and left my hand on the gear knob, when i went to pull off sometimes in would disengage, mainly when cold tough. I am Glad it was checked out and rectified.
    Grant
     
  15. IanB

    IanB F1 World Champ
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    Jun 15, 2006
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    Grant,
    there are several possible reasons for jumping out of first and most of them involve a gearbox rebuild. But worth checking for something simple, such as wear in the two couplings, one at each end of the grearshift linkage rod. As these age, it takes more rearward movement of the gearlever (which pulls the rod forward) to get 1st, 3rd and 5th engaged. Also, renewing the couplings removes freeplay from the shift and you get an excellent & positive shift action, as it should be.
    Ian
     
  16. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    #441 Wheels1, Jan 27, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Thanks for the info Ian.
    Rob did tell me what needed doing to the gear box, after they had stripped it, but as it was not alot i did not take much notice, unlike thee the bill i bet!!!
    I will keep you informed when i get the info.

    I had a bit of a fight for a steering control column switch last night. It was new old stock and was bought for a UK Daytona in 1974.

    After a lot of digging i found out that you can get a similar one from Eurospares for a Dino, £590 plus vat, which they told me was the same on the Daytona other than the arms being black.

    Then Rob came back to me and told me that the Daytona's arms are offset to the centre hole making them sit higher on the steering column which i confirmed when looking at the photo on E-bay and the Eurospares one.

    Apparently i was the only bidder from the UK !! Japan, USA, Australia, anyone else here going for it.
    Pic's of both below
    Grant
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  17. Edward 96GTS

    Edward 96GTS F1 Veteran
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    Nov 1, 2003
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    grant,
    both look like 308 column switches. stalks are square.
    daytonas have "blade" stalks.
    ed
     
  18. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
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    Grant,

    What defects are the colums switches suffering from? They can be repaired quite adequately in most cases.

    Look for Verell in the 308 section, I think he posted in here once as well after the re-build of a 330 or 365 cluster.

    Prices for new or NOS clusters are quite rediculous compared to the cost of a re-build, and they'll be better than new but correct for your car.
     
  19. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    #444 Wheels1, Jan 27, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi Ed.
    I think early Daytona's had the blade shape and later had the ones pictured. I was told this by Eurospares and checked that ones i bought are exactly the same as i have on mine. below are some not very good pic's of my car.

    Jack the usual thing of the plastic cracking where the stalk go's in, can be glued up, arms a little rusty, easy repair, almost forty years old now so going to be worn, it is always good to have a spare, especially as they are becoming so rare.
    Grant
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  20. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    #445 Wheels1, Jan 28, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Ed
    Done some more digging and I think you are right, it is not as the original Daytona ones where, so I guess mine must have been broken as they do and this was the Ferrari replacement part. There seems to be a lot of Daytona's with the same switch because of this.

    I have spoken to the guy selling it and he will take it back so nothing lost.

    Interestingly Eurospares list about 5 different versions for the Daytona on their web-site and the cheapest new remanufactured one sells for around £300.00, they also sell the £590 one as well. I wonder what the difference is?

    Below is what they should look like from the Registry.
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  21. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
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    May 5, 2001
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    #446 Verell, Jan 28, 2010
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2010
    I've restored both Daytona, 330, & 365 switches, in some cases making complete new stalks for them. You're probably thinking about this thread:

    Reproducing a 330 GT Turn Signal Stalk
    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=234801

    I have the molds to cast new 'blade' and 308 style knobs, and also can cast pivot (switch) ends.

    In a couple of cases I've helped Daytona owners by modified their 308 switch by removing the 308 style square knobs and replacing them with petal style knobs. The result is a switch that once installed is quite hard to distinguish from an OEM Daytona switch. The only externally distinguishing difference is the 308 switch doesn't have the stalk offset Wheels1 mentioned.
     
  22. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    I just asked this question on the Daytona Registry. "does anyone convert the knobs"?
    When i find out which model of switch i have i will be in touch and hopefully you can sort something out for me.
    Grant
     
  23. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
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    Good going Grant, you'll get your switchgear back with the pieces that break made out of a much better material and everything working as new.
     
  24. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
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    This may help: All 308/328/Mondial style switches have a black body with "Vitalloni 245" molded onto it in about 1/4" high letters followed by a /a, /b, or /c variation identification. The knobs have a rounded square profile, or else are cylindrical with grooves on the cylindrical surface, and flats for the icons. The stalks for early version (till about 1980) switches were silver, after that they were satin black.
     
  25. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    Thanks Verell.
    I spoke to Rob today.
    He told me the controls are still on the steering column, as there was no need to take them off when he dismantled the car.
    The car is not near to me, so it would mean Rob removing the steering wheel, cowl etc to get at the switches, this is a job i know i can do myself, and it is no harder when the column is on the car, so it seems logical to let Rob carry on with the main job of putting the car back together, and when i have the car home [ and i have driven it a bit/ might be alot, i can look into it. Thanks for your help and i now know where to turn when the time comes.
    Grant
     

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