| Author | Message | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 6999 Registered: 8-2002 |
LMAO...!!! | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 191 Registered: 2-2003 |
Guys, thanks for all the help. I have put my friends in touch with the resources mentioned here. I think they will be fine from this point forward. DES, it was never for me. I don't think any amount of armoring could stop the firepower in each Texas city block!  I would like to ask the moderators if we can close this thread? Unless you guys want it to morph into a discussion of armored cars and related issues in general. That ramming class offered by O'Gara...I have to find out how much that would cost! Again, I personally am not looking for any sort of armored vehicle. Thanks for all the help. | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 6993 Registered: 8-2002 |
Amir, there's an add for exactly what you're looking for in the most recent issue of the Dupont Registry (black cover w/ yellow Pagani Zonda Roadster); some company called C.I.A. - i can't remember the name or their contact information, but if you'd like, i can post it tomorrow... Maybe you can have them slap something together for you and while you wait, get one of the used suburbans someone else mentioned... | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Intermediate Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 1023 Registered: 6-2002 |
Amir- you have PM from me too. | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 176 Registered: 2-2003 |
Taek, thanks for your email. I did get it. I have passed on your info and have not heard back. When I do, I will let you know. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2203 Registered: 11-2002 |
Amir, I don't know if you got my PM, but along with what I found for you I did find some Suburbans and Expeditions. Email me back and we'll see if it suits your friend's needs. Otherwise let me know so I can tell my friends to forget about it. Cheers | ||
| 360 Killer (Dario)
New member Username: Dario Post Number: 23 Registered: 12-2002 |
How about this one available NOW ... http://www.alpineco.com/new_armored_ford_excursion.htm or http://www.lascointl.com/armored-cars.shtml#new | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Intermediate Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 1007 Registered: 6-2002 |
William H- Exactly. INfact the SVI is not armoured at all. In armored vehicles, defenders tend to hide. The lack of armour encourages gunmen to get out and RECTIFY the situation. (and belive me, 3,000rounds/minuite has the tendency to do just that.) Rich- you would be amazed at the human instinctual responce to the imperative of staying alive, if you were ever pushed to the limit. I think this is where I bow out... Best! Ben. | ||
| rich stephens (Dino2400)
Member Username: Dino2400 Post Number: 623 Registered: 10-2001 |
Remember the scene from "Running Scared" where they get the bullet proof taxi and then can't escape from it when they need to because they can't kick the windows out? I know that was comedy (a good one) but there are just too many possibilities and I can't image having any success staying alive if someone really wanted me dead. Having said that, I hope your friends' security detail does its job. | ||
| Tom Bakowsky (Tbakowsky)
Member Username: Tbakowsky Post Number: 673 Registered: 9-2002 |
If you need a built proof anything...I think it may be time to change your line of work..either that or stop playing cops and robbers. | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Advanced Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 3270 Registered: 2-2001 |
Gabe, lets hope nobody has a fender bender with an 18 wheeler carrying a nuke, could be a messy cleanup | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2197 Registered: 11-2002 |
Amir, I sent you a PM. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 175 Registered: 2-2003 |
Dave, too cool. I would love to do that one day...ramming, I could definitely use some tips there!!!! I did pass on all the contacts mentioned here so far--I believe O'Gara-Hess are backed up right now and can't deliver anything in under 5 months. They definitely seem to be the authority, except when it comes to website design! Thanks for the info. That skills practiced in their driving school--cool stuff! Wish I could go. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1948 Registered: 5-2001 |
Amir, William H gave you the best of the best: http://www.ogara-hess.com/ these guys make all sorts of armored vehicles, I have personally seen one of their Suburbans, and they are impressive. They also have the contract to "up armor" all the US military Humvees, to make them more bullet resistant. If you would like to discuss some of the options, weaknesses and levels of protection, please feel free to contact me off list. I think a purchase like this must be carefully considered, as there are good and bad out there, and differing levels of protection. I believe the MB and BMW factory offerings are limited in scope and protection...probably not worth considering. This group also offers a driving school for government contractors and military operators. Through some contacts I was able to attend a one week "tactical vehicle operations" course. We covered a lot a material on personal security when travelling in a vehicle, both on been survailed and counter survailance. One day was on vehicle searches and improvised explosives. Lot's of practical driving, both defensive/evasive, ramming, night, and percision. Interesting segment on ambushes. We also did an off-road day as well. | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 174 Registered: 2-2003 |
Gabe, yeah, I was at the airplane junkyard in Tucson, Arizona, and they had entire airplanes in civilian garb that were used to shuttle stuff around without arousing suspicion. There was also a recent 60 Minutes "investigative report" on the seemingly lax security when these warheads are parked up overnight. The TV crew was worried about the stuff being hijacked. The military wasn't. They are rendered fairly inert when being transported in civilian guise, but it seems that someone with the right skills can make them operational in a few hours. Interesting stuff. Ever since I saw a McLaren being unloaded from a shipping container, I always wonder what's inside when I pass closed containers. Safeway's refrigerated ones look especially innocuous and are probably the most lethal...! | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 173 Registered: 2-2003 |
Taek, yes, they have a fully trained security detail. Very security conscious people--the security folk refresh their skills twice a year. I asked for was sources for armored Suburbans. They know where to get new ones from but they don't want to wait the three months to get custom ones made. Not really asking for help in any other matter. It's turned into an interesting discussion, but the only thing being actually sought is a source for armored Suburbans. They are based in the US and Phillipines. If you can pass on any info re: the Middle East vehicles, it would be much appreciated. Thank you. Amir. | ||
| Gabe V (Racerxgto)
Junior Member Username: Racerxgto Post Number: 133 Registered: 4-2003 |
Sometimes.... you don't want to attract too much attention. A armored vehicle is a useful tool for personal protection for a low profile customer. High profile customer's have unique needs. Allow me to illustrate one example in a military format. The USAF has an assortment of nice toys. Sometimes you need to transport those toys and as SOP, they utilize their own transport services. HOWEVER; there comes a time when certain toys cannot be transported by normal USAF due to their, how can I say, "delicate" nature? A USAF transport truck with a convoy of Hummers and personel trucks with armed soldiers makes for an something worth taking a shot to grab the goodies. But on any given day unbeknownst to everyone except to only an elite few...... and you may have been driving right next to one, is a genuine USAF nuclear missile cleverly disguised inside a commercial truck trailer going down the highway as just another trucker. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2196 Registered: 11-2002 |
Amir, If your friends already have security detail I doubt there is much we can do as onlookers to help them out. There are too many unknowns. If they are located in Asia shoot me an email with the country they live in and I can probably find you a ton of stuff they might find useful depending on what they need. I did find some armored vehicles, but they are not Suburbans, they are used, and they are in the Middle East. Cheers | ||
| Tyler (Bahiaau)
Intermediate Member Username: Bahiaau Post Number: 1072 Registered: 12-2001 |
Amir, I should clarify that. I was not suggesting out and out murder although I know that sort of thing does happen. I was simply suggesting that they try to "come to terms" with the possible threat ahead of time. Sometimes these situations can be avoided, sometimes they can't. I've got lots of friends who live in Central and South America and over the years I guess I've become desensitized to the unbelievable lack of importance that many in those parts of the world place on a human life. | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 171 Registered: 2-2003 |
Tyler, very interesting. My friends' security detail is treated like family, and they wouldn't hesitate to give them the maximum resources they need to do their job. But, they are looking for defensive, not offensive options. I also don't think you can always preemptively eliminate threats. That sounds like a trap of the "never-ending circle" kind. Besides, that has all kinds of moral implications--don't think my friends are the kind of people who resort to threat management strategies like the one you are suggesting. I am amazed to hear it's widely used around the world, although I guess I shouldn't be. I know a few people in the business, and I was under the impression that this was not the case. Perhaps in gangster circles, but in successful business circles? Yikes...! | ||
| Tyler (Bahiaau)
Intermediate Member Username: Bahiaau Post Number: 1071 Registered: 12-2001 |
William, I'm guessing that that is a chase vehicle. You tend to want less armour in the vehicles defending you. The reasoning is that if people(even ones you've paid to engage in combat) have a place to hide they tend to do so. Without ample protection they are encouraged to rectify the situation as rapidly as possible. Amir, another option that is widely used around the world, though certainly should never be discussed on a public message board is proactively eliminating a known threat. | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Advanced Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 3254 Registered: 2-2001 |
nice gattling cannon but isnt the shooters backside a little exposed ? | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 998 Registered: 6-2002 |
Gabe- you bring up some good and very valid points. Security is never ever 100%, and if they want you bad enough... I'd still take the GAU-17 6-barrel Gatling Cannon as a fighting chance over an armored vehicle.  Still, there's no substitute for a countermeasures-equiped G5/550 doing 0.8Mach. Best! Ben. | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Advanced Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 3242 Registered: 2-2001 |
contact a good security Co, maybe they can find you 1, I think its like Ogara, Hess, & Eisenhardt, they might have some SUVs for sale | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2185 Registered: 11-2002 |
I can certainly ask around. Don't know any bulletproof stuff in Asia, but wouldn't be surprised if some Indonesian friends of mine had some. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 151 Registered: 2-2003 |
Not always an option. Yes, they do use them when feasible. The family spends a lot of time in Asia, actually, so that's probably where the Suburbans will end up. So, do you know of anyone selling one out of their fleet? You sound like you have done everything and know everyone! | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2183 Registered: 11-2002 |
Amir, Take to the skies my friend. Choppers are the way to go in the U.S. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 150 Registered: 2-2003 |
Uhm, yes, I see your point. But they are needed urgently. Apparently the family has received credible threats. Hence, if any are available immediately they would be better than nothing, and allow for some peace of mind while the custom ones are built, if those are still deemed necessary. Ordnance-dented ones won't fly, I am afraid. And neither will Benzes or Rolls. They want to support America. Lol - that rocket-dented thought had not even crossed my mind! | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2181 Registered: 11-2002 |
How about a "slightly used" with only a few dents from RPGs? Wouldn't you want these things built to your exact specifications? My friend told me that the plating is spread out thicker depending on the VIPs preference in seating. Not so much exact location, but driver's side, passenger side, rear, etc. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 149 Registered: 2-2003 |
Gabe, I have seen the movie and I understand the reference in the context of the movie. I meant, in the context of this thread. Were you just remembering Ronin fondly, or were you "exposing" something here? Sorry to beat a dead horse, let's forget it. Thanks for the links, everyone. It seems like there's a 3-5 month wait to get one built. If anyone knows of any for sale now, please let me know. Thank you. | ||
| Gabe V (Racerxgto)
Junior Member Username: Racerxgto Post Number: 131 Registered: 4-2003 |
*EDIT - It's ok, FerrariChat theater will host Ronin next week! LOL In the early dialogue of the movie, Robert DeNiro quickly weeds out the poorly skilled mettle of a faux English mercenary. During an impromtu plan on a chalkboard, the question is asked by DeNiro to throw a curve regarding location intelligence. The poor old chap failed, eventually getting kicked out of the group before the thick of the plot. (did I give too much away?) | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 147 Registered: 2-2003 |
Aha. Exposing who in this context? Still confused... Ralph, ECM are on the cards. Ramming equipment too. Dunno about flares and chaff. I think the recommended strategy is to get out of the killbox as quickly as possible, not stick around and fight it out. | ||
| Gabe V (Racerxgto)
Junior Member Username: Racerxgto Post Number: 130 Registered: 4-2003 |
"What's the color of the boathouse at Hereford?" RONIN It's from a line in the movie Ronin with Robert DeNiro. It's a movie based on an ambush. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2180 Registered: 11-2002 |
Ronin, I think... Mark? DeNiro's character exposes one of the crew with that line? Cheers | ||
| Ralph Koslin (Ralfabco)
Member Username: Ralfabco Post Number: 867 Registered: 3-2002 |
Don't forget ECM, flares, and chaff. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2179 Registered: 11-2002 |
Movie quote. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 146 Registered: 2-2003 |
Mark, I am confused! what's that supposed to mean? | ||
| MarkPDX (Markpdx)
Member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 855 Registered: 4-2003 |
. | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2178 Registered: 11-2002 |
Note to self: Don't f!ck with Gabe. Cheers | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 2177 Registered: 11-2002 |
I've been in one in S. America. A friend of mine has a pimp daddy one that has tear gas turrets on the roof and crap like that. Little portholes for "return fire", underside mine plating, runflat tires and impact resistance wheels etc. The car is painfull slow and heavy, as expected. The engine is supercharged but it still barely moves. He has told me that the car refrigerants in the engine bay to keep the engine cool. Even the hood is ridiculously thick. The windows are so damn thick and heavily tinted they might as well be solid steel panels. Prices and availability are going to depend on what stage of armoring you want. Funny thing about it is that if you drive this sucker anywhere the roads part like you wouldn't believe. And when you step out of the car people are afraid to even look at you. I'd go with what William H pointed out, although I don't think they have the pimp daddy packages available. Cheers | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 145 Registered: 2-2003 |
Gabe, at least two of the vehicles will be decoys. Swings the odds in your favor. And these won't be the only safeguards. | ||
| Gabe V (Racerxgto)
Junior Member Username: Racerxgto Post Number: 129 Registered: 4-2003 |
Amateur�s will resort to the simplified ambush method. If they want to get you, they will get you, trained bodyguards and all. Some tactics may include, but not limited to, .50 BMG or larger bore assault AMG-65 attack XM26 TOW (Russian) M-220 TOW(US) If they really dislike you, expect a Javelin up the tailpipe. Home made concoctions may include: Triple 15 mix of growing chemical inside a parked van or car. Under the street Assorted 5-mile per second explosive devices with directed blast Drive carefuly! | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 991 Registered: 6-2002 |
Forget armor, get one of these: http://www.digitalplace.org/~mweber/personal/raptor/part1.htm PS: the Guard S500 Mercedes can take some impressive hits. Not just pistol, but rifle bullets, and small bombs. | ||
| Joe (Jts)
Junior Member Username: Jts Post Number: 113 Registered: 8-2003 |
Becker in California http://www.beckerautodesign.com/armoring/ and Ultrasmith in NYC http://www.ultrasmith.com/armor.htm | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Advanced Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 3238 Registered: 2-2001 |
Hess & Eisenhardt, there are some places that advertise in DuPont as well check ads in High Times & Soldier of Fortune also LOL BMW & MB sell bulletproof cars from the factory | ||
| Amir (Amir)
Junior Member Username: Amir Post Number: 143 Registered: 2-2003 |
I am posting this on behalf of a friend...anyone know where to get Suburbans bulletproofed, or know of any readily available? |