| Author |
Message |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1239
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 5:58 pm: | |
Netviper, the Pagani is no doubt a bad ass machine, and will beat the Murcielago in a straightline, thats why i love the Pagani, and would choose it over any ferrari, including the Enzo. |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1238
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 5:56 pm: | |
Hmmm, heres the #'s for the Ferrari 575M Fiorano vs a 911GT3 on the same EVo track! Looks like the Ferrari was very close to the 911 and just barely lost! Not bad at all! OH, gosh lookee here, its not a GT3, its just a regular 996! 
Since its hard to read the laptimes, here they are:
Ferrari 575M Fiorano 1.24.55
Porsche 911 (316hp) 1.23.20
Oh and the STI nipping at the 575's heals 1.25.15 |
Paul Loussia (Bumboola)
Junior Member
Username: Bumboola
Post Number: 205
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:44 pm: | |
Since this is the ONLY objective test so far between the Challenge Stradale and the 911 GT3, I am posting this chart from the PCOTY Autocar issue. This comparision, with the same drivers and track conditions, shows that the Ferrari is quicker around a track and faster in a straight line than the Porsche. As far as the BMW being quicker than either of them, Autocar concluded that the Michelin Sport Cup tires were worth 3.3 seconds on the track over the no-cost optional Conti street tires and superior to the Ferrari and Porsche rubber, which were deemed equal for track use.
Brian, don't expect the Ferrari to weigh much less than the Porsche as some of the magazines have stated. Porsche's weight figures tend to be right-on and Ferrari's tend to be, well, very Italian. |
-- (Netviper)
New member
Username: Netviper
Post Number: 35
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 3:18 pm: | |
I am shocked to see the Pagani got beat by the lambo. I guess they did say on top gear that the lambo does better in the turns and that seems to be the reason why. The Zonda will toast it in the straight line -- which is all Allan cares about. Regardless if it is 0-100 or 60-200, it is still a straight line.
I would like to have seen how the 2002 NSX-R would have done. |
James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Advanced Member
Username: Napolis
Post Number: 2759
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 2:57 pm: | |
The 575GTC may be a pig but it's a fast pig as those who raced against it found out. It should be interesting to see how the Murcie GTR does against it and the Maser/Enzo. |
Pat Pasqualini (Enzo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Enzo
Post Number: 1128
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 2:46 pm: | |
Isn't the 575M a GT and not a supercar? If so then woouldn't that be comparing apples to oranges? |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1232
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 1:35 pm: | |
Lol, Brian, that is a truly ignorant post. Just because you THINK the 360CS will post better numbers does not mean that it really will.
The Murcielago is a fat pig? Well, yes it is a little portly, but it handles its weight extremely well, as shown by its very close performance to the Pagani Zonda C12S. Id say the Murcielagos size hurts it more on this track than its weight does. But in the end, think of it this way, the Murcielago will not destroy, but it will obliterate any stock Ferrari barring the Enzo, on any real racetrack, as shown by its vastly superior numbers on the Nurburgring and Hockenheim.
Also, remember, when that 360CS finally does come out and posts decent numbers, numbers which will not better the Porsche GT3, since several tests have already concluded the GT3 is the quicker of the 2, Lambo has a lighter, faster Murcielago on it way, and the Gallardo can stick it to the 360CS in the meantime.
Also, why isnt the 575M used in any of these tests? Becuase not only is it a big fat pig, it is a slow pig at that! |
Andrew (Enzo250gto)
Junior Member
Username: Enzo250gto
Post Number: 104
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 12:33 pm: | |
Here are 15 very nice photos of this car
http://www.corsaphotos.com/gallery/view_album.php?set_albumName=ford |
Faisal Khan (Tvrfreak)
Member
Username: Tvrfreak
Post Number: 942
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 11:46 am: | |
James,
very impressive!
|
James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Advanced Member
Username: Napolis
Post Number: 2747
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 9:36 am: | |
Fisal
Even though the TVR is much faster than the Murcie note how the Lola T-70 did vrs the GT3 and the Lambo. Not bad for a 36 year old design.
 |
Brian Kennedy (Kennedy)
Member
Username: Kennedy
Post Number: 447
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 8:19 am: | |
Paul, thanks for posting that chart. Very interesting.
The light 911 GT3 showed really well. And the Murcielago performed like the fat pig that it is. Its a shame they didn't have a 360 CS... even lighter than the GT3, better aerodynamics, and 50 extra horses... it would be right up there where a Ferrari belongs.
Allan, what was that about Lambo building so much faster cars than Ferrari... that Ferrari has lost sight of performance??? Did you ever consider that Ferrari might just have its sights focused on a different definition of performance than Lambo? And, BTW, Ferrari is focused where I want to be... Lambo is NOT.
Now that we have real numbers on a whole bunch of production cars, will you please go away? (Or at least stop all the anti-Ferrari pro-Lambo talk -- nobody here wants to hear it.) |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1231
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:48 am: | |
Faisel, absolutely still hate TVR's. Simply Trash.
Im not into drag racing at all. I like to race from 60 to 200mph!
|
Ben Mainwaring (Bukem)
New member
Username: Bukem
Post Number: 12
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:37 am: | |
Ok - give me 5... |
Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member
Username: Amenasce
Post Number: 1561
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:32 am: | |
Im on Ben , andmen360 . |
Ben Mainwaring (Bukem)
New member
Username: Bukem
Post Number: 11
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:22 am: | |
andrew - no ICQ at work - go on MSN!!! |
Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member
Username: Amenasce
Post Number: 1559
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:19 am: | |
Go on ICQ ! |
Ben Mainwaring (Bukem)
New member
Username: Bukem
Post Number: 10
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 4:13 am: | |
Andrew - the JP1 is the V6 powered Jaguar that looks Le Mans LMP/675 spec. It's quick too - 60 in about 3 secs, top speed 180mph, from 250bhp.
My mate drove one at a Johnathan Palmer day recently - in the wet - said it was "quite a handful". I bet... |
Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member
Username: Amenasce
Post Number: 1557
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 3:56 am: | |
The JP1 is an F1 car ? Isnt it the Jonathan Palmer car ? |
Faisal Khan (Tvrfreak)
Member
Username: Tvrfreak
Post Number: 938
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 2:23 am: | |
TVR in 3rd place, after an F1 car, and the Ariel Atom, an engine/chassis with virtually no body panels...woohoo!
Allan, you know what's a little disconcerting? TVR has at least three models with higher performance than the car used here. So, you still hate TVRs?
Look on the bright side, at least the Gallardo is hideous! |
PSk (Psk)
Intermediate Member
Username: Psk
Post Number: 1034
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 1:45 am: | |
quote:BTW, to some others on this thread, if all you care about is drag racing then you are an inbred redneck.
... Gosh that is a bit hard. I appologise Allan for this sort of abuse 
Hehe
Pete |
Paul Loussia (Bumboola)
Junior Member
Username: Bumboola
Post Number: 204
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 10, 2003 - 1:22 am: | |
"I think the EVO outlapped the Murciealago on Top Gear's test track."
Even at Rockingham, a small track TOTALLY unsuited to the Murcielago, it spanks the Evo and STi. And this was against an FQ300 Evo and a Spec 3 STi. At a big track it would crush them. Hey, I admire both of these cars and their amazing performance per dollar , but let's get the facts straight.
The Murci was crushed by the GT3 though.
BTW, to some of the others on this thread, if all you care about is drag racing then you are an inbred redneck. |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1227
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 5:14 pm: | |
Also, i meant to say 93 octane in the last post. |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1226
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 5:13 pm: | |
I sold it because i had been driving 2 similarly modified Porsches for about 5 years. Time for a change.
Diablo is still fast enough, especially with the nitrous, that nothing has beaten it.
|
Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member
Username: Mitch_alsup
Post Number: 1186
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 5:06 pm: | |
"I had 2 Porsches, last one made 714rwhp, 1.1bar of boost, on 98 octane, in a 2490pd car. It would dust my Diablo, even on spray. It was a 9 second car."
So why did you sell this obviously faster and less expensive car and get a slower more expensive diablo? |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1225
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 5:02 pm: | |
No the Evo did not outlap the Murcielago.
Performance is a very big issue when it comes to the purchase of a exotic car. Cars are rated as to how they perform on a stock basis, not modified. |
-- (Netviper)
New member
Username: Netviper
Post Number: 31
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 4:57 pm: | |
I think the EVO outlapped the Murciealago on Top Gear's test track. So a 30K car beat a 300,000K on the race track. What does that say? |
Nebula Class (Nebulaclass)
Member
Username: Nebulaclass
Post Number: 655
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 4:38 pm: | |
Allan - you are missing the entire point.
There is ALWAYS a faster car out there. I remember once at a local drag strip, this guys pulls up in a totally tricked out VW Bug with a 993 TT motor. Pulled something like high 8's or something.
The point is this: you sais that F-cars are losing their touch for various reasons, including the lack of serious power/performance. I simply stated that, if power/performance is what you are looking for, you can get it for a HELL of a lot less.
F-cars will always sell well and be popular because they are F-cars. Same goes for Lambos. Will there be cars that are faster? Sure. Will there be cars that handle better? Sure.
But will they be F-cars or Lambos?
Nope, and that *can* make all the difference. |
allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member
Username: Allanlambo
Post Number: 1222
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 2:05 pm: | |
Oh my god, here we go, i agree that these cars would rip appart a Diablo. We're talking stock production cars. Anyways look at it this way, if they beat a Diablo, just imagine what they would do to a Ferrari!
I had 2 Porsches, last one made 714rwhp, 1.1bar of boost, on 98 octane, in a 2490pd car. It would dust my Diablo, even on spray. It was a 9 second car.
MJ, on spray, the DIablo turned a 10.98@133mph, with heavy wheelspin through 3rd gear.
So, i should be here saying ill kick the crap out of an Enzo, but im not. Stock to Stock. |
M.J. Callie (Dream_cars)
Junior Member
Username: Dream_cars
Post Number: 96
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 11:43 am: | |
I own a '98 Mustang that makes 556 RWHP runs the 1/4 in 11.2 @ 132mph.on street tires. Allan, don't know how I would fair next to your SV but thats plenty to take a stock Diablo or Murc. and I dont use NOS, built motor w/ 13lb Vortech |
Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member
Username: Mitch_alsup
Post Number: 1181
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2003 - 10:15 am: | |
"And by the way, it will take more than a 500rwhp Mustang to beat my Diablo. "
There are streetable Mustangs running 10.2 in the 1/4 mile
There ate streetable Vettes running 9.7 in the 1/4 mile
There are streetable Vipers running 9.2 in the 1/4 mile
Any of these will eat a Diablo and spit it out as crap. |
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