| Author | Message | ||
| James Dixon (Omnadren250)
Member Username: Omnadren250 Post Number: 310 Registered: 7-2001 |
Dave & Roel...... Actually in Canada, we got the Euro spec cars for the M3 in 1994 and 1995. The only came in yellow or black and they all had a plaque in the car stating the number of the car (only let in 147 each year). My friend had one and it was much more advanced that the regular M3 that came in Canada in 1996 which was the bored out 328 motor. It had a single throttle body for each cylinder and was much lower than the later cars that came. The car is actually for sale for $40,000 Canadian dollars which works out to be a good deal for you Americans. | ||
| ross koller (Ross)
Member Username: Ross Post Number: 436 Registered: 3-2002 |
i re-read the original start to this thread, and i think the question is useless imho. the 2 cars are apples and oranges. the audience is not the same. i would venture to say that there is little actual crossover for one-sportscar-buyers (ie not those lucky few who have multiple sportscars). you either want a corvette, or you wouldn't dream of it and want a ferrari or other euro car. hence comparison will only solidify the basic differences between potential buyers. if the question is asked purely as an excercise in statistical analysis fine, but then i would suggest just looking it up on some website. | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 483 Registered: 1-2002 |
Roel, you are right, it was & is disappointing. BMW's stated rationale was that Americans would not pay the $50,000 it would take to bring the M3 with the hand-made 286 (and then 321) hp all-aluminum engine here. Right or wrong, they decided to make a US M3 with a 328i engine bored out to 3.0 (and then 3.2) liters, with most of the same chassis & suspension as Euro M3's, and sell it for $35,000-$40,000. 0-60 MPH, where many Americans do their driving, the US car had gobs of torque, so it was as quick as the Euro car. However, over about 70 MPH, the Euro car absolutely left the US car in the dust...and it had much better brakes as well with bigger calipers & large floating rotors. In the current E46 version, the car uses the same engine world-wide, with 343 hp (US & Canadian versions have 333 hp due to slightly different emissions equipment), so performance is identical; I guess they got the cost of producing that beautiful engine down enough to keep the price of the car competitive. Ironically, though, BMW puts cupholders in US versions (regular posters here know the disdain I hold for these items in a proper manual-transmission driver's car...a disdain also shared by most Eurpoeans, and most Eurpoean car makers) but still shortchanges us in the braking department--putting glorified 330i brakes on the US M3 with small, solid rotors while it puts much larger M3-specific calipers & larger, gorgeous floating, cross-drilled rotors on Euro models. Bah!! | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 395 Registered: 8-2001 |
I love the beauty of Ferraris, I love the thrill of driving them. Of course, there is the prestigue. I had hoped to find a convertible Ferrari that I could drive 100,000 to 200,000 miles as a daily driver. That is why I have asked questions about reliability, any changes in maintenance for heavy use, build quality, etc. However, maintenance issues seem to make my plan impractical. Hence the interest in other cars for a daily driver. I am learning that Euro BMWs seem to be better than US BMWs. Still interested in Ferraris, but have not figured out how to get around the maintenance issues for frequent or daily use. Maybe it will have to be just an additional car for occassional use. The problem with that is it limits the amount of fun one can have driving it. Ferrari appears to be increasing the reliability of their cars and they have a track record of solving problems when they come up. Hopefully the financial problems with Fiat will not get in the way. Still trying to find the best solution, which I will. | ||
| Roel de Fouw (Spawnz)
New member Username: Spawnz Post Number: 40 Registered: 6-2002 |
Offtopic but; Dave, you say "LAST GENERATION of E36 U.S. M3(240 bhp, 236 lb-ft or torque)" I can't believe the US spec M3 is so much a downgraded version of the real EU spec car. In Europe, the early e36 M3's have I think 286 hp, while the later cars have a nice 321hp under the hood. A stunning 81 hp more then the US version. I'm sure you knew about these figures but I was just very suprised :-) | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 393 Registered: 8-2001 |
I haven't been on for awhile, surprised at how big this grew. Wanted a convertible so this ruled out many of the Japs, althought they are very nice. Also wanted to be able to go 120 + with stability. Have not decided yet, but can one get bargins on new BMW's M3s in Europe anymore? At one time one could. Any details? Does anyone know good mechanics in Germany and Beligum (sp) to do pre-purchase inspections for reasonable rates? I need PPIs done on a couple of MB heavy duty 4x4 trucks. Just need one, but have found a couple. If the PPIs work out, will have a half full container coming into the East Coast before the end of the year. If anyone needs something brought over, email me off list. Thanks, Dave | ||
| Chris Coleman (Dmc4cc)
New member Username: Dmc4cc Post Number: 47 Registered: 2-2001 |
Well, maybe I am starting a strange twist on this, but why not something Japanese? I could name some very exciting sports cars that could compete very well in this region. NSX-T rev happy little exotic thats easy to drive. S2000 its not as quick as the others but I drove one and am hooked!!! 9000rpmm, short shifts, start button, top down, all add to an entirely new and exciting experience. | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 473 Registered: 1-2002 |
Dave, a 330 with a chip (really an EPROM flash...) will perform very close to the LAST GENERATION of E36 U.S. M3(240 bhp, 236 lb-ft or torque) with no chip. The current E46 M3 will eat the 330's lunch in every gear. | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 392 Registered: 8-2001 |
Frank and others, They were having problems with the C5 so have not test driven one yet. Checked back through the archieves - the BMW seemed to be well liked - thanks for the info Frank. Test drove a 330 to check the convertible effect and handling. Was impressed. What does Ci (think it was called) stand for - forgot to ask? Test drove a M5 (M3 was not available) to check for acceltration. Salesperson said the M3 would have better acceltration than the M5 due to less weight, even though the M5 has 8 cylinders. BMW literature says otherwise. The M5 acceltration put a smile on my face. I think the Ferrari acceltration is more fun, but they are two entirely different cars. In the lower gears I kept bumping up against the rev limiter on the M5. At that point the car felt like it had much more to offer and felt like it was no where near redline, but the rev limiter said no more. Is the rev limiter there for physical reasons, or is it political and/or government (or selling) reasons? The salesperson said that a European chip is available for the 325 and 330, but he was not for sure about the M3. He said that it greatly increased the high end speed and performance in general. This sounds like the rev limiter is an artificial limit. He furthur said that a 330 with a European chip was close to a M3 in performance. Is this true? That type of increase sounds a little fishy. What are the advantages and disadvantages of these European chip(s)? How does a 325/330 with a European chip compare to the M3? How do the 325/330 in general compare to the M3? Thanks, Dave | ||
| Scotty (Pzerowaster)
New member Username: Pzerowaster Post Number: 17 Registered: 10-2002 |
Boys, Isn't it all just a matter of personal preference? And what you want out of your car purchase? I think comparing a Ferrari to a Vette is just plain silly. Just an opinion fellas, don't hurt me. I've owned a couple vettes, and drove the holy hell out of them. Very reliable. But they just held me over until I could buy a Ferrari. I recenty spent some serious seat time in a pal's new Z06. Loved the car. The interior remided me of an S-10 Blazer, but just a fantastic car nonetheless. But would I trade my 348 for it? Not a chance! They are 2 different animals, and I happen to love what my animal does for me. And like all you Ferrari owners, I have the Mustang GT's and Vettes and the hoopdie kids egging me on all the time. Sure, some of them can smoke me in a drag race. Who cares? I don't. In my garage, right now, there is a little red car sleeping under a satiny red cover with a huge black prancing horse on it. Life is good indeed. :-)> | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 395 Registered: 11-2001 |
Ross, I've seen the GT40 motor in its bay and it looks killer! the headlights suck •••• due to it's worthless design though. I'm not into this type of old design coming back as a modern car because to me it don't feel right kinda like the new T-Bird, but if you put this motor in a new body style, then you got something real hot. | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 394 Registered: 11-2001 |
The Diablo is a crude ride overall, fast on straights, at high speeds through turns it gets touchy, but I wouldn't trade it up for any car, I'd just keep it since there's nothing like it. Strange as it may seems, this car makes you work but it's fun. Although the Viper may be raw in its power, I would never own one, it's not for me, wait! "You are what you drive!" ha ha... But I will drive one when given the chance or wreck one going down the track to see what it's made of. | ||
| Mitchell L. Davidson (Jussumfastgi)
Member Username: Jussumfastgi Post Number: 266 Registered: 4-2002 |
Modman, if you have never driven a Viper before, you owe it to yourself. Go test drive a GTS. They have much the same feel as the Diablo, but a little more raw. | ||
| ross koller (Ross)
Member Username: Ross Post Number: 414 Registered: 3-2002 |
linking from another thread....i think 'america's best sportscar' label is going to go the gt40 the moment it gets built. it looks awesome.....exclusive too at only 1000/yr (at least thats what they r saying now....) | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 388 Registered: 11-2001 |
Frank, you are what you drive! In a good way that is..... Hey just noticed your last comment, is Viper a pure performance car? never driven one. I thought NSX is pure performance? never driven one either, I must be missing out, or am I ?.. | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
New member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 31 Registered: 9-2002 |
Frank, I agree completely. Of course, I'm a bit biased. Haven't seen you on the board in a long time.... --Dan | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Member Username: T88power Post Number: 804 Registered: 2-2001 |
Wow, Ed, the Corvette is America's best sports car!!!! I am now convinced!!! Now, stop it! Ernesto | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Intermediate Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 1390 Registered: 9-2001 |
As great as Ferraris are, and I love them, they are nothing compared to an M car from BMW. My e39 M5 seats five, does 0-60mph in 4.6 seconds all in the lap of luxury. And while more expensive to maintain than a Chevy, the M5 is cheap compared to a Ferrari. I own my Ferrari because I love its looks, its sound and the way it makes me feel. If I wanted a pure performance car I would get another Viper. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2114 Registered: 2-2001 |
http://www.autoweek.com/specials/2002_ambest/ | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Junior Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 90 Registered: 6-2002 |
Ferrari! Totally Hetero! Best! Ben. | ||
| Paul Newman (Newman)
Member Username: Newman Post Number: 577 Registered: 12-2001 |
Just curious how a new C5, say a Z06 would hold up against a viper? Is a C5 that much better? | ||
| Mark Izzo (Tdf355)
Junior Member Username: Tdf355 Post Number: 124 Registered: 3-2002 |
Peter-Please dont post pictures of that!!! | ||
| Peter S�derlund /328 GTB -88 (Corsa)
Member Username: Corsa Post Number: 261 Registered: 4-2001 |
Mark. I like the way she spank me. What shall I do? No one else do it in that special way that my 328-baby does it. Ciao Peter | ||
| Mark Izzo (Tdf355)
Junior Member Username: Tdf355 Post Number: 123 Registered: 3-2002 |
I agree Tim. | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Intermediate Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 1479 Registered: 6-2001 |
I think "ferrari vd C5" is a little too general. Which ferrari? Id rather have a 360 over a C5 any day of the week. | ||
| Paul Newman (Newman)
Member Username: Newman Post Number: 576 Registered: 12-2001 |
Sorry Jason, just didnt want people to believe what you were saying to be correct. I re-read your post Ed, you're wrong too. Sorry. | ||
| Mark Izzo (Tdf355)
Junior Member Username: Tdf355 Post Number: 119 Registered: 3-2002 |
Ill post pics of the Carravaggio Z as soon as I get it back in two weeks. Peter S- You need to get out more and stop fondeling your car. Martin- Ill hook your 348 to my trailer hitch and drag it around the track for some fast times | ||
| Lawrence Coppari (Lawrence)
Member Username: Lawrence Post Number: 304 Registered: 4-2002 |
One reason the Z-06 gets high mileage when cruising is because of its low rpm. With low rpm, the frictional losses of the engine are minimal. If you want any kind of acceleration, you must get out of top gear. I saw a piece on TV about the yellow Corvettes that race at LeMans. The engineers took one of the engines and spun it up using an electric motor. As electric motors are very efficient, you can easily determine how much power it takes to spin the gas engine (ignition off). The result was that at 6000 rpms, 100 hp were consumed. The engineers had worked on the engine to reduce the internal losses because the Vipers had a hp advantage that needed closing. Internal frictional losses manifest themself by heating the oil. Losses are also associated with the passage of heat to cylinder walls from compression of air as the engine was turned. Consequently, if you lower the engine rpm, you get better gas mileage. This, along with modern fuel injection and computer control, allow it to get high mileage when cruising. | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 2970 Registered: 5-2001 |
Love ALF! Big Simpsons fan as well. ALF had the right idea: do nothing and have a cat for dinner! | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 2969 Registered: 5-2001 |
Sure Ed, I perform that! We beat them with a Pinto fender and then make them walk over Cavalier broken windshield glas! | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2102 Registered: 2-2001 |
Boy Martin. Are you up watching ALF too? | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 2968 Registered: 5-2001 |
You can also install a hitch on a Corvette but not on the 360, so here is an argument! | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2101 Registered: 2-2001 |
I do not believe that cars have a soul. Operating characteristics, yes. Some of the OWNERS however do seem to be possessed. I think we have some candidates. Anyone here do exorcisms? | ||
| Peter S�derlund /328 GTB -88 (Corsa)
Member Username: Corsa Post Number: 260 Registered: 4-2001 |
Tim, I believe PASSION is what it's all about. That is the reason why this site and why threads like this exist. Cars do have a soul, especially italian cars. When a friend took the rear seat out of a Maserati he found a greeting from one of the assembly guys at Maserati. Assembling that car meant something to that guy and I'm sure that those feeling are transformed and lives with the car forever. If your Ferrari simply refuse to start one morning she is probably mad at you because you have mistreated the gearbox or somesthing the day before. They have a soul, believe me. You can communicate and discuss thing with your Ferrari. -Ok mate, you didn't like that I didn't match the revs and now you are punishing me with a 360 spin. Right? -Yep. -I didn't like it. Don't do it again. -Learn how to treat me then, you SOB. Sometimes when I leave my Ferrari in the garage I feel that she gave me a real telling-off. And sometimes like a hot night with... And they do have PMT... If you prefer a Corvette you also probably prefer living in calibacy. That's one of the reason that a Corvette never can be compared with a Ferrari. If you are in to love. Ciao Peter | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 379 Registered: 11-2001 |
Ferrari vs. Vette? both are fast, yes but I look at it this way like comparing an Armani suit and a Mens Wherehouse suit, both same materials except one feels better wearing it. It's wrong to say which is a better car as it is opinioned to ones need or liking. | ||
| Jim Conforti (Lndshrk)
New member Username: Lndshrk Post Number: 12 Registered: 8-2002 |
There is only one month of M3 that has "engine problems".. traceable to someone who made a big boo-boo in changing bearing clearances. All the other problems are either "improper gear selection" or some yet unsolved mystery with some of the SMG transmissions ALSO selecting an improper gear. If your motor isn't from the one period in question and you can think.. you'll have no problems with it. I have 2 of them.. an 01 M3, and an 01 MZ3. No problems except a permanent smile. Also owned an '02 Z06 and regret selling it Performance is amazing. | ||
| Jason Godsil (Godsil)
Junior Member Username: Godsil Post Number: 167 Registered: 9-2001 |
I am with you Ed. I knew someone would bring this up about the LS1, that is why I explained that it was redesigned in '97. There are definate differences but the basic layout is the same. Nothing enterchange but the basic 50 year old small block chevy is there. | ||
| Kevin Marcus (Rumordude)
Junior Member Username: Rumordude Post Number: 73 Registered: 9-2001 |
Hmm. well, i own an f355 and a z06. I drive the z06 mostly every day. i only drive the f355 on the track. the pedals on the f355 are "stiff and hard" which is exactly how i like them. the z06 pedals are soft as mush (which is great for normal driving, but i have too much pedal travel on the track). the suspension on the f355 is awesomely stiff compared with the bubbliness of the z06. the back end of the z06 is light as a feather and is very easy to break loose. the f355 feels like it has better traction. the z06 has way more power than the f355 - or at least the gearing is better such that it feels like it's a hell of a lot faster for acceleration. at the track last week i turned in a 1:39 which the c5 turned in a 1:46 at pacific raceways. of course i cant speak to driver abilities here but anyway. | ||
| Jeffrey Caspar (Jcaspar1)
New member Username: Jcaspar1 Post Number: 30 Registered: 5-2002 |
I would definately avoid e46 M3's as they have serious engine reliability problems. http://members.roadfly.org/jason/m3engines.htm | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2100 Registered: 2-2001 |
Please re-read my comments and all answers to your questions are in there. | ||
| Paul Newman (Newman)
Member Username: Newman Post Number: 575 Registered: 12-2001 |
Ed, are you saying the Ls1 design is a small block chev like a 97 LT1? you're on crack if you are. Not even a head bolt interchanges between the two where as interchangeability was a big plus with a SBC. The LS1 is no more like a SBC as it is to a 351w. It is not a SBC and gm even says its completely different. Its actually closer in design to a cobra 32v dohc block, than a chev of any design. They are both deep skirt aluminum blocks with cross bolted mains. The cams being the obvious difference. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2099 Registered: 2-2001 |
The small block Chevy has been produced in configurations from 262 Cubes to 400 Cubes with dozens of different bores and strokes and head designs. The current designs which has some differences and improvements, are basicly the same as from years past and is a very durable powerhouse. One horse per cube in the standard C-5. The Small block Chevy is probably the most legendary engine ever made and takes more people to work and wins more races every weekend than most manufacturers win in a lifetime. | ||
| Paul Newman (Newman)
Member Username: Newman Post Number: 574 Registered: 12-2001 |
The LS1 and LS6 engines have absolutely nothing in common with a small block chevy. A completely different design. They share the fact that they have 8 pistons and 16 pushrods. the bore and stroke are even different than the SBC. | ||
| Jason Godsil (Godsil)
Junior Member Username: Godsil Post Number: 166 Registered: 9-2001 |
I am on my 6th Corvette and this last one is my second '98. While I would definately rather have an exotic, I will always own a Corvette. You can drive comfortably to the race track, race and then drive to dinner afterward. I have no interest in the M3. They hardly compare to the C5 performance and honestly they look like a luxury car, not a sports car. Maintenance is nothing, oil every 3,000 and maybe an airfilter once and awhile. They can be beat on, they have had roughly the same engine design for almost 50 years. This proven engine is I believe the longest produced engine in history and that is why they get the horsepower from 350-405 and with my car, I have seen 32 mpg. The smallblock Chevy that these run now were brought out in '97 in the intro of the C5 and feature all aluminum construction and 6 bolt mains, these were meant to last. I have not heard of anyone having problems with these engines. Infact these are the same engines that Lingenfelter uses as a base for his 650hp twin turbo engines, and he offers a warranty. I am not saying to buy a C5 over a Ferrari, but they make a great daily driver and I personally wouldn't waste my time at a BMW lot. | ||
| SteveF (Stevef)
New member Username: Stevef Post Number: 47 Registered: 12-2001 |
In my experience, the z06 outperforms the e46 m3 in every measurable performance category. However, the m3 has a much nicer cockpit and communicates better to the driver. I got 13mpg in the z06 and 18mpg in the m3. Also I'm much better behaved in the m3 without the sound of that throaty v8 and popping exhaust tempting me. What can I say ? I'm weak.  As an everyday driver, I recommend the m3. if your priority is track events, then consider the z06. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 2097 Registered: 2-2001 |
The 5th and 6th gears in a C-5 are both overdrives. At 70 mph on my Corvette the tach is reading 1500 RPMs. The car attains it's top speed in 5th gear. If you shift to 6th at top speed the car will actually slow down. A lot of owners are getting well over 30 MPG with a car that will go 0 to 60 in 4.7 seconds. In comparison, my 2001 Chrysler Sebring gets 28 mpg with a 2.7 engine. | ||
| Joseph (Mojo)
New member Username: Mojo Post Number: 39 Registered: 9-2002 |
BMW M's are cool, class. Z06's are cool, fast!!! | ||
| Joseph (Mojo)
New member Username: Mojo Post Number: 38 Registered: 9-2002 |
If you need to seat 5 buy the M, but if you don't buy the Z06 better at everything even gas mileage. 405HP and 28MPG How do they do it? | ||
| neal (95spiderneal)
New member Username: 95spiderneal Post Number: 29 Registered: 3-2002 |
having driven at northeast tracks with 348 spider this year, i can say z06 is always one of fastest car there. ive also been in other cars that can leave a z06 in the dust. having said that however, i would not trade for anything. my car esp with top down feels and most importantly sounds like a lemans racer. its also the best looking car. its not only about hp (although reliability is imp) esp since 95% fcar owners arent skilled enough to max their car so why get even more unused performance? bottom line - maint. aside, fcar is best for combo performance and looks | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 382 Registered: 8-2001 |
Coming from the exteme poor side of the tracks, I have made and lost fair amounts of money at different times. As such, getting value for money (not necessarily the amount of money) will always be important to me. I also try to be like a ratchet wrench - max the pleasure possible while reducing the downside if everything goes wrong. (There would obviously be much pleasure in a Ferrari.) I earned my Masters Degree in diasters long ago - that is why I am good at diaster recovery planning. Having used an exotic as an everyday driver, I thought I could do it with a Ferrari. It is becomming obvious that it is a bad plan even if I do not want to accept the reality. So the plan will be changed. Normally I drive 20,000 to 35,000 miles a year, but spread over several vehicles with one getting the most use. The Sebring with a max speed of 103 is too slow. Know nothing about the current Mustangs, but will take a look at them. The two most promising, at this point, seem to be the Corvette C5 convertible or the BMW M3 convertible. Of course, one is a 2 seater and one a 5. How would the list compare the two? Especially, What is the difference in stability at say 120 mph or higher? How is the handling at low speeds and high speeds, especially cornering? What is the difference on twisties? What is the acceltration difference? Any difference in reliability? Will they both last about the same? Is the fuel burn about the same? What is the difference in maintenance costs over 100,000 miles? Any other major differences in cost? Thanks! | ||
| Joseph (Mojo)
New member Username: Mojo Post Number: 37 Registered: 9-2002 |
C5 have 50/50 weight on front and rear, also pull a full 1 g on skid pad. Plus the amount a 360 depreciates in 3 years would buy a C5. but that only matters if you care. | ||
| Willis Huang (Willis360)
Member Username: Willis360 Post Number: 958 Registered: 8-2001 |
Tim, I think what Ernesto was trying to say is that a C5 on slicks going faster than a 360 on street tires is not a good comparison. Was the 360 you mentioned on slicks or street tires? No one is denying that a C5/Z06 is a potent car in the right hands. | ||
| Patrick Pasqualini (Enzo)
New member Username: Enzo Post Number: 49 Registered: 2-2002 |
Yes please post a pic. | ||
| Patrick (Patrickr)
Junior Member Username: Patrickr Post Number: 62 Registered: 4-2002 |
Mark, I would love to see a pic of the Carravaggio Z... I bet it is beautiful.  Patrick | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Intermediate Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 1476 Registered: 6-2001 |
A Z06 with SLICKS faster than a 360? no kidding! a 360 on slicks? im starting to question the point of spending $110k more for a slower car that doesnt handle as well, uses alot more gas, requires expensive services every 15k miles, and is uunreliable (in normal car terms, not exotic car terms). | ||
| Mark Izzo (Tdf355)
Junior Member Username: Tdf355 Post Number: 118 Registered: 3-2002 |
Dave- You can always do what I did, have the best of both worlds. I bought a 2003 Z06(I also have a 99 355 F1 Spider) and sent the car to Carravaggio in Canada for the targa top conversion. The quality is amazing and you'll have open air and exteme rarity. My car is number 15 in the world. For the price of the 360 Spider you can have these two cars plus plenty of cash left over. I love the Z06, its a great all around car with a lot of Balls. Next stop for the Z is Lingenfelter for a supercharger and an addition of 100 rear wheel horsepower. Still plenty of money left over. | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Junior Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 184 Registered: 4-2002 |
As one who owns both: The reason Ferraris (F355, F360) are faster in 5th and 6th gears is that 6th gear on the corvetts is a fuel economy gear. So in effect, 5th is called to service then entire 120 to 175 range--while 5th on the 355 goes 120 to 150 and 6th goes from 150 to 183 (theoretically--haven't been there--yet). Although grip on C5s is above the grip on the F355 (can't say about 360), when you are sideways in a turn at 100 MPH, the Ferrari is much more controllable. A good driver is faster in a Vette than a 355 but you drive the cars differently. The F355 you brake in a straight line and turn in crisply, and feed in power quickly it. The Vette you brake straight, then feed in the steering while trail braking, then feed in the power slightly slower. | ||
| Lou B (Toby91)
Junior Member Username: Toby91 Post Number: 89 Registered: 4-2001 |
Enesto. At LRP this summer I clocked a very well driven Z06 in the 58-59 sec range when the red group 360 Challange cars were doing 1:03-1:06. | ||
| Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Member Username: 4re_gt4 Post Number: 276 Registered: 4-2002 |
Maintenance cost for a C5 is nil with 'regular' use. Oil is the only maintenance item. If you thrash it, expect some problems. I suspect that the Ferrari will stand up to more track/high rpm/semi-abuse long term than a Corvette will. Corvettes get a little ragged with use. However, with the price difference, buy two Corvettes, and throw them away when they wear out! | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 381 Registered: 8-2001 |
I have been told that the Corvette Convertible C5 has a top speed of 175. The 360 Spider has a top speed of 175 (according to FNA and magazine articles). The BMW M3 has a top speed of about 155 according to BMW. One advantage of Ferraris is the acceltration, especially at high RPMs. Do not remember the 0 to 60 of the C5, but the number was impressive (however, numbers can sometimes be faked). I have been told that the C5 will out acceltrate the TRs and be close to the 360. I have not yet looked at BMWs so do not have a feel for them. Another advantage of Ferraris is handling, especially the tossable ones. I have been told that the C5s remain flat in curves like the Ferraris and handling approaches the 360. Have no feel for the BMWs. Have no feel for the maintenance costs of the BMW vs the C5. Of course, resale value of all 3 will be low due to high milage. I am not trying to put anyone's car down, just trying to learn. Is the above information correct? Does anyone have additional information? | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Member Username: T88power Post Number: 792 Registered: 2-2001 |
A Z06 with SLICKS faster than a 360? no kidding! Ernesto | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Intermediate Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 1472 Registered: 6-2001 |
From what an owner of a 512bbi and 308 said, and he said the Z06 doesnt compare to the 360 on the track, its that much BETTER. i was shocked to hear this, but it just is. It has so much more torque. At lime rock, a 385hp Z06 with slicks was faster than 360's. IMO corvettes are the only mass produced american cars worth considering, but they arent convertibles and ppeople say the interior is crappy. A Z06 isnt a ferrari, but its still a serious car. The Z06 will also turn 28mpg on the highway and it wont need any maintainance for a while. In a perfect world i would have a corvette for daily driving and a ferrari for the weekend. | ||
| Ken Ross (Kdross)
Junior Member Username: Kdross Post Number: 154 Registered: 2-2002 |
If you want a car that will go 200K miles and is sporty, buy a BMW M3 (0-60 in 4.8) with a manual trans. The Ferrari will kill you on maintenance and depreciation. I seriously doubt whether a C5 Vette can go 200K miles. | ||
| Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Member Username: 4re_gt4 Post Number: 273 Registered: 4-2002 |
It seems a LOT of F-car owners have a Corvette as a second car. I even know of one guy who uses his 355 only on the street, and his Z06 on the track. Sort of the opposite of what others do. | ||
| Chris A. (Asianbond)
Junior Member Username: Asianbond Post Number: 72 Registered: 5-2002 |
Don't do it, don't go to the dark side, you will regret it...... | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Member Username: T88power Post Number: 791 Registered: 2-2001 |
The vette is just as fast, cheaper to own and cheaper to maintain. Better warranty and probably better service. Ernesto | ||
| Dave Wapinski (Davewapinski)
Member Username: Davewapinski Post Number: 379 Registered: 8-2001 |
I first fell in love with Ferraris while looking mainly at the TR a year and a half ago. I am a rag top man so that limits it to Mondials 3.2 or t, 348 Spiders, or 355 Spiders. I love the 360 but would never pay $50k over list. Importing a Euro 360 Spider seems too risky. I do have a deposit on the replacement for the 360 Spider. Also love the 328 GTS, but love true open air motoring better. Of course need something until the 360 replacement gets here. Love the beauty and image of a Ferrari. However, my main interest is in driving. As such, I had hoped to drive it about 20,000 miles a year. I had considered trying to get some magazines interested in a series of articles on what it is like to drive a Ferrari for 100,000 or 200,000 miles. I have not been interested in Corvettes, so have not been following that market or its models. Several people have recommended a C5, my first reaction was what is a C5. Hopefully I will not get flamed, but how does the C5 compare to Ferraris, especially the models I am interested in? What is the driving difference? What is the maintenance cost difference? I need a high speed Grand Touring car in its true meaning and a car for the mountain twisties. I will test drive a C5 this weekend, and wanted some information first. Thanks. |