F355 F1 pump (using a 360 pump from Ricambi) | FerrariChat

F355 F1 pump (using a 360 pump from Ricambi)

Discussion in '348/355' started by mowater, Apr 23, 2011.

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  1. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #1 mowater, Apr 23, 2011
    first, has anyone done this to a 355 F1 or knows of someone who did?

    Daniel Pass over at Ricambi America has been truly great in replying to my emails, and he has specified those two parts for the fix:

    F1 pump

    Ferrari Parts : 213264 : 213264 Electric Pump (F1)

    and this adapter to enable using the pump above on the 355 F1

    Ferrari Parts : PABF355F1 : PABF355F1 F355 F1 Pump Retrofit Kit

    obviously, i have some concerns for using the kit, so here are my questions:

    1. how trusty is this thing?
    2. any pro mechanics here who can help me with their expert opinions?

    kindly advize
     
  2. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    Dec 7, 2003
    16,251
    Winston Salem, NC
    #2 Ricambi America, Apr 23, 2011
    BLAMPEE (user here) and WINDSOCK (professional technician here) can offer some advice.
     
  3. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    12,314
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jimmie
    #3 greyboxer, Apr 23, 2011
    Many many folk here have Hiils items in critical areas on their cars

    See in particular here : http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=302088

    I believe this conversion has been tried/developed in the UK for several years in association with one on the major independent shops
     
  4. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #4 mowater, Apr 23, 2011
    Jack, thanks bro
    I have contacted Daniel today regarding this kit :) he is the one who has sent me the two specific items + told me that I would be needing to make a heat shield.
    Send my regards to him.

    BLAMPEE has been kind to respond so far and I am awaiting his thorough reply whenever he gets the time. Such a fine gentleman.

    greyboxer,
    Again, I thank you greatly for the link! That is EXACTLY what I needed :)

    I am not a very active user on those forums (unfortunately), so can anyone fill me in on who Hills Engineering are? :)
     
  5. vvassallo

    vvassallo F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 4, 2006
    8,281
    Palos Verdes
    Full Name:
    Vince V
    #5 vvassallo, Apr 24, 2011
    Hill Engineering, a British company that makes a variety of aftermarket improved parts for many vehicle applications. We are fortunate that they do many Ferrari pieces. I have several of their parts on my car - high quality all.
     
  6. 285ferrari

    285ferrari Two Time F1 World Champ
    Sponsor

    Sep 11, 2004
    20,847
    Southern Md
    Full Name:
    Robbie
    #6 285ferrari, Apr 24, 2011
    +1----Hill parts equal quality!!!!
     
  7. BLAMPEE

    BLAMPEE Man Card Status: Never Issued

    Jun 28, 2008
    15,424
    Sunny Heavenly Beautiful Arizona
    #7 BLAMPEE, Apr 26, 2011
    Email sent, buddy. :)
     
  8. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #8 mowater, Apr 27, 2011
    thanks Brock :)
    such a great community
    Mark has also replied

    i am waiting on an email from Ricambi with the tracking number, and then it's just a week or so for the parts to arrive until the party begins

    i will keep you gentlemen updated

    THANK YOU FOR YOUR HELP :)
     
  9. Andretti Molletti

    Andretti Molletti Formula Junior

    Sep 19, 2010
    345
    Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Dré
    #9 Andretti Molletti, Apr 27, 2011
    It looks exactly the same as a Hydralic pump of the Alfa Romeo 156 or 147 Selespeed system.
    Maybe that is something to investigate?
    Alfa Romeo parst can be cheaper. Also Denso improved the system: in vans they use "speed-shift" with almost the same pump but now japanese Denso quality. Also intresting to investigate I suppose?
    Just my 5 cents ;)
    Good luck!
     
  10. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #10 mowater, Apr 27, 2011
    ^ i would not be surprised :)
    i remember i changed my thermostat once, but unfortunately i cannot recall the price.. a friend who had an Alfa told me he got his for 45kd, and mine could NOT have been less than 90kd lol

    so yes, it is worth investigating :)
     
  11. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #11 mowater, May 1, 2011
    shipment arrived in kuwait; expect delivery tomorrow :)
    imporant questions, kindly help:

    1. when i install the F1 pump, what kind of programming will be required?
    will the pump NOT work unless the car is hooked to a computer to let the f1 breathe?

    2. same for the clutch
    is there anything that MUST be done before testing the car through a computer?

    3. most importantly, what SD can work with a 1999 355 F1?
    is it only an SD1? or can an SD2 work?
    are SD3 and 4 out ot the question
    ^ mind you, this is to program the hardware and not to diagnose


    kuwaiti members:
    do you trust Satesh over at Kuwait Performance (formerly Gemballa garage)?
    do they have an SD1 or SD2?
    i am hearing that NO ONE does except alzayani
     
  12. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #12 mowater, May 9, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    UPDATES:
    a. parts arrived last week; made space at the shop yesterday
    b. the work has started today :)

    well, the manual did say that the light will flash when the clutch is not fully/properly engaged (cannot remember exact term), and i think we were 80% on the correct path.
    even if i am now questioning the initial diagnosis that the original 355 f1 pump was low-pressurized, and that it was only the matter of the clutch; i tell myself that since the car is at the shop dismantled, **** the price and do everything all at once

    turns out the clutch-release bearing leaked, so i just put in an order with Ricambi (i am amazed by how good Daniel Pass' customer service is) for a Hill Engineering throw-out and it will ship TODAY!! :D
    i also threw in a new sensor kit, and that way, i would have:
    installed a new clutch, new pump (of a Modena + adapter for 355), a new clutch release bearing, and a new sensor

    thus, i am guessing and hoping that this will get the clutch/f1 system back to tip-top AND improved shape (stronger pump, tougher bearing)

    in the first pic below, you can see the adapter installed at the top of the unit

    in the second, you can see the OEM bearing; at first i thought the flange was an issue but thankfully and hopefully it is not

    finally, the 3rd and 4th are of the clutch
    unfortunately the 355 is my only "manual" car so i have no idea what to look at to see what 'damage' the bearing/pressure of pump did to the clutch.
    any pointers?
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  13. S Brake

    S Brake F1 World Champ

    Aug 3, 2006
    17,182
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Dave
    #13 S Brake, May 11, 2011
    You must be thinking of a different BLAMPEE.

    :D:D
     
  14. BLAMPEE

    BLAMPEE Man Card Status: Never Issued

    Jun 28, 2008
    15,424
    Sunny Heavenly Beautiful Arizona
    #14 BLAMPEE, May 11, 2011
    No doubt!

    According to the Silver thread that dude is a total *****....

    :p:p:p



    :D
     
  15. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #15 mowater, May 12, 2011
    ^ lol

    update: i picked up the bearing and the sensor from FedEx today and dropped it off at the shop, because otherwise i would have waited until Saturday afternoon for it to be delivered home, and then wait until Sunday morning for the shop to start working again.
    this way, i expect them to start Saturday morning, which buys me a full 24hrs

    i know that Daniel Pass has a great rep here, but seriously all you US/Canada guys just cannot imagine how UNBELIEVABLE it is that he was able and willing to ship my package out of the states in less than 24hrs than when i put in the order on Sunday, and i receive it in Kuwait on Thursday.
    this guy is a true enthusiast and it shows in his business.

    more pics of the set-up when i get them :)
     
  16. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #16 mowater, May 16, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    waiting for the metal bracket to finish installing the 360 pump :)

    new clutch went in
    new sensor in as well
    hill engineering throwout bearing in (sorry was at work late and could not snap a pic before they put everything back up)

    hope to be done with the bleeding by tomorrow at the latest - fingers crossed

    and seeing the mufflers out, i am wondering what a used Tubi would fetch or if anyone can direct me towards one?
    to be honest, owning a few different autos from different manufacturers, the thing that is irritating about Fcars is not the service and the hassle along with it(to me, it is part of the fun, to actually see and feel the experience of owning the MECHANICS), but the ridiculous mark-up on mods!
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  17. rayes83

    rayes83 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2011
    2
    #17 rayes83, Oct 18, 2011
    Mowater,

    can you send me your info in Kuwait?

    i am facing an F1 pump problem in my 1998 F355.
     
  18. ANCO

    ANCO Rookie

    Oct 19, 2011
    7
    #18 ANCO, Oct 25, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi guys,
    I own a 1999 F1 F355 and am currently facing a problem with the gear change.

    the gear does not change! and according to my engineer, he said that the motor of the F1 pump has seized.

    I have been looking through this forum (plus asking ricambi, whos been very helpful) and found that I can use a F360 pump + a special adapter and it will work just like a new pump?

    Now, does the F360 pump include the 'motor' as well? Also how reliable is it? Does it break down easily?

    I am asking another person to help me fix the 'motor' and see if it works too.

    Pls advice! Thanks a lot guys.
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  19. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    21,726
    WI
    #19 WATSON, Oct 25, 2011
    It is an easy & excellent upgrade / repair. Ricambi has the pieces you need.
     
  20. BLAMPEE

    BLAMPEE Man Card Status: Never Issued

    Jun 28, 2008
    15,424
    Sunny Heavenly Beautiful Arizona
    #20 BLAMPEE, Oct 25, 2011
    +1

    And Daniel is the best in customer service. :)
     
  21. ANCO

    ANCO Rookie

    Oct 19, 2011
    7
    #21 ANCO, Oct 25, 2011
    Got it. I will do that

    Just one more questions, does the F360 F1 pump include the Clutch actuator too? or is that a separate item that I have to purchase?

    Please advice peeps!
     
  22. JSBMD

    JSBMD Formula Junior

    Mar 17, 2007
    438
    The OC
    Full Name:
    John
    #22 JSBMD, Oct 26, 2011
    Clutch actuator is part of the "octopus" hydraulic system. Hydraulic pressure drives the system. The hydraulic pressure is generated by the electric "F1 pump". Looks like your pump is worn out from those photos. Doubt it's repairable. The Ricambi site has replacement 360 pumps and Hill Engineering adaptors to allow the newer, more powerful 360 pump to fit an older 355 system. If your clutch actuator is bad, your best bet is to source a used one off a breaker, since I don't believe the actuators are sold independently. Good news is that the actuators rarely fail, so your problem pump may just be your only problem. Fix that first, and you may find that clutch action is fixed also.

    As stated, this is a VERY worthwhile upgrade/repair for your car. I recently had my failing F1 pump replaced with one of these newer pumps and can only say good things about the upgrade. Now, the system primes in less than 2 seconds (initially I was elated because I realized it primed in less than 5 seconds, but now that I've had it a week and a half, I measured it and yes, less than 2 seconds). So, upon cold startup, the transmission light goes out with all the other warning lights on the dash--it primes that fast. Additionally, the clutch action is much, much smoother. Amazing what steady, increased hydraulic pressure in the system will do for the workings of the F1 system. I only regret that I waited for the old pump to start dying before replacing with the newer pump. It's no surprise that racers who used the F1 system in the 355 Challenge Series (there were a few) "hot rodded" the pumps to put out more pressure than stock. That is what the 360 pump appears to be doing here.

    Last comment: unless you are VERY good with fabrication and engineering/troubleshooting, I don't think this is a realistic DIY project. There is a fair amount of adapting and electrical troubleshooting, etc required to make the newer pump work. In other words, the Hill adaptor piece is NOT a complete kit. Fittings will be needed, hydraulic lines of appropriate duty rating are needed, mounting bracket will need to be fabricated, etc, etc. Don't misunderstand, this adaptor by Hill is outstanding, but it isn't a complete kit. It does allow this much better pump to be fitted to the older 355. But it probably is best left to the pros and seriously gifted/determined DIY'ers.

    For 355F1 owners, the 360 pump upgrade is a MANDATORY improvement to the cars, along the lines of aftermarket headers, aftermarket cats, and Gold Connector Kit (my next upgrade!).

    Hope this helps,

    John
     
  23. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #23 mowater, Oct 26, 2011
    first up, i am extremely happy my thread has become of use to my fellow 355 brothers :)

    second, i am expected to pick up my car TODAY but it will be on the original 355 pump

    third, i am sure from what i read here that the 360 pump + adapter is a great upgrade, however i agree totally with JSBMD about installation

    NOTE: MY CAR WILL NOT BE FITTED WITH THE 360 PUMP AND HE ADAPTER BECAUSE OF THE IDIOT WHO WORKED AT IT IN THE INDEPENDENT SHOP

    installation is KEY

    in hindsight, i would have no issue sending my unit abroad to a shop who can assemble it and be ready for a bolt-on and bleeding

    hopefully, i will re-visit the 360pump + adapter upgrade when my usual shop FINALLY get an SD that we can work with on the 355

    Daniel at Ricambi is the greatest
     
  24. mowater

    mowater Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
    362
    #24 mowater, Oct 26, 2011
    oh and yes, the clutch actuator (Clutch Release Valve) CANNOT be sourced separately

    the safest bet is to get a used power unit and source the parts from it

    that is what i did

    and still, the AD tells me that when they installed the 360 pump and drove the car, the flashing persisted. so that was the final straw for me and i said i will get it on my original 355 pump and deal with this later
     
  25. tamf328

    tamf328 Formula Junior

    Mar 9, 2005
    477
    #25 tamf328, Oct 27, 2011
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