Gougoul, Are you always this bitter? You seem to blast others for enjoying things you don't like or may seem like they are only doing it for "poser" reason, but yet like to advertise how you live.
Actually i'm usually far worse No frankly, nothing was meant personal. As i already said, i see nothing bad that someone wants to pay 100k over sticker for whatever it is, even a used Pontiac Aztec. Simply bringing on arguments (maybe to test them and later try them on the wife...) other than, i do because i don't care is stupid. There is no economical reason for doing that. There is no life threatening reason either. There is no emergency either, as you will end up with the car anyway, and it's JUST an objet, you'll get bored of it sooner or later. Simply you want it, can afford it, agree to pay this price for it. You do it. End of topic. Now for about blasting what i don't like, first i try to do it in a cynical way, that may sound from time to time a bit rude,but if you forget that, i think that's the main definition of a "discussion", to bring arguments against a point (if they are of any value is something else) and then again, discussing is what a forum is here for, among with learning a few things etc. Now about posing, i don't realy think that it's better to do it or to drive too fast on open roads. It was just for that most of the buyers don't jump in for that extra performance hike, but rather buy it for the status symbol it is. It is probably somehow sad.
Hey what's the big deal? If a guy has 100 million what's 100k. It's like me paying a premiun on a steak. If I have to pay 10.00 more it's not going to change my lifestyle just like 100k isn't going to change a multimillionaires life style. The funny thing is I know quite a few rich people and not one own a Ferrari period!
Thanks for clearing that up. It's hard to read people on the internet sometimes. I've always believe you live one life, and if you got it (the $, time, love, ect. whatever it is you have), enjoy it.
heres another one... http://cgi.ebay.ca/Ferrari-2007-Ferrari-599-GTB-SPOT-US-Car-Full-Warranty-599GTB_W0QQitemZ260020513090QQihZ016QQcategoryZ6212QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem i love the text.. "the successful bidder will pay for the right to order Ferrari 599.." i guess the right to order a Ferrari isnt one of those free inalienable ones... drat... GT
Thankfully those aweful cameros and corvettes are not sold over here in Europe!!! IMHO the 550 is a beautiful car, and the 599 will be a classic - stunning and powerful - a perfect 21st century Ferrari v12 with the genetics of the 60's & 70's classic before it.
Wow. I'm new to this chat community, and all I can say is that I am glad that this thread was not the first that I read, as I would never have been back. There is such a huge amount of bullsh*t, generalisation and general negatitive undercurrent in this thread that it is an embarrassment to read. Come on people - get a grip. If you have serious complex moral issues regarding personal wealth, go and seek help - the Ferrari chat community is not the place to air your grievences. And if someone wants to pay over list for a car, so what? I'd love an Enzo - try getting one of those at list price...
Probably because otherwise they would have to bring a new model out every two years to keep the hype running, and theses costs would never pay for themselves. Simple economics, eh Joke beside, i think they're way overpiced given the engineering complexity, like almost every car on the market
Any product that brings premium in the secondary market is not overpriced,quite contrary. The only Ferrari model priced right is the 612 ,which depreciates immediately like any other "normal" car.(percentage wise of course)
Close, I think that Ferrari knows exactly what it is doing when it sets a below market MSRP. They would much rather see their cars sell at a premium than at a discount. See Lamborghini and Maserati for examples of the opposite effect. The only change is that Ferrari is now allowing dealers to benefit from their marketing strategy. Dale
You're absolutely right. The hype created by an inpenetrable waiting list, and ridiculous markups, is probably the best marketing plan ever. People want to be a part of what they can't have.
I think you give Ferrari too much credit. I'm not sure they really understand the world markets for their cars. The pricing of the Enzo, and now the 599, just proves that they have no idea of supply and demand.
It's all an issue of market credibility. A car has competition, that will evolve during its lifespan. If you want it to remain viable, you need to take that into account. Nobody will want to buy a sportscar that sees the dark side of a saloon priced for a tenth of it after 5 years, and nobody will respect a maker (or for me, a buyer) that puts the price too high in the beginning. See what everybody says about the SLR. It's not only a matter of market success, it's also an issue of having a consistent price with what the car delivers. The 599 is currently an amazing car, but how will it be compared to the next- gen M5/M6, 911 Gt2 etc. Would it still be a strong seller if it was sold for 400-500ks ? Same for the 430, if it would be sold for 300ks, who would still wish to buy one in three years time ? Also, the cars' price will in the very end fall to its regular value, no matter how long it will take. This doesn't help credibility either if you sell it for x and it goes for x/20 after 10-15 years.
Apparently you are right,since a lot of Ferrari dealers plan to sell new 599s with premiums added right of the bat,on brand new cars, not just the "used" ones with 200 miles.
Waoo this car is fantastic.. thanks Marcel for the pics, very nice. I think the 599s would be no different from other V12 Ferrari's. Unfortunatly they will depreciate quickly a year after the first models are delivered to their lucky owners. As far as I am concerned, I really want one.. but I'll be patient ( for a few years ) and will wait untill I can get one at good value.
Maybe in your market. In the US, I guarantee that it will be at *least* three years before you'll be able to buy a used 2007 model for close to MSRP. Will it follow the same trend as the 550/575 and eventually settle down, or will it follow a path more closely aligned to the traditionally popular V8 models -- only time will tell. I personally anticipate that there will be a waiting list in the US for the F599 for at least the next five years, possibly longer.
This same thing is widespread in the world of collectible, high-demand wines such as limited production cult wines from Cali. The waiting lists are painfully long, sometimes not even open, and the only way to purchase them is on the secondary market where the markups are huge (i.e. Screaming Eagle $300 MSRP at winery, selling for upwards of $1500-2000 a bottle at auction) Free market is a powerful thing.
....in Europe, there are 599's available for msrp, or very near to it. Somehow Ferrari has managed to turn the American buyer into someone who loses all common sense. This is a 'production' Ferrari, and as good as it is...they will produce several thousand of these things. In a way I admire Ferrari's marketing genius....but why does it only seem to affect the Yanks...? Still....a fool and his money....
How is it enforceable? The selling dealer isn't legally obligated to honor the "first right of refusal" they gave to one party, if that party sells it to another? For example, myself being a dealer, if I took a deposit on a 599GTB from customer John Smith for 4th car I've got coming in. Then John Smith goes and sells his "slot" or "option to first right of refusal" to Jesse James. When the car comes in, Jesse James attempts to pick up the car, I'd can tell him to fly a kite, because "first rights or refusal" are not assignable to anyone else without my express consent an that would have to be contractually noted. As a dealer why would I allow the first right of refusal to be assignable to someone else by the intial party, so John Smith party can benefit $50-100K. It doesn't make any business sense? The is no benefit to facilitating this transaction. Most dealer require that ordered cars are registered and contracted in the orignal ordering parties name. So I guess my question is -putting yourself in Jesse James shoes- you "purchase" an option for "first right of refusal" that doesn't have to be honored by the dealer. What have you really got, you're not legally entitled to anything?
hello, i was under the impression that ferrari looked down on dealers that sold above msrp and took that into consideration on their next years allotment. i remember in the late 80's early 90's when dealers cleaned house on F-40's ferrari stepped in with certain rules and requirements (read; F50 lease only) but then again, i could be wrong. regards joseph.
The reason why Ferrari's bring so much more here is because the demand has gone up Fourfold. While our allocation has not been increased accordingly.While Europe has enjoyed ample allocation all along. Take away some allocation from undeserving Europeans and you will soon see things balance out.
