FOC Mudslinging - not pretty

Well, seeing as you do not know the "politics" of what has been going on, let me fill you in....

This was supposed to be a "Club" for the benefit of it's Members, who Pay Dues to belong to "their Club". But it never became a "Club", Why? Because a couple of the guys on the "Board" did not want to actually have to meet up with the "Club members" in any, Any kind of a "Club Metting". "Too busy for that" they said. It doesn't matter when, where or how often. Just sometime, anytime, with the rest of the "Club members", to get THEIR input as to how they would like to see THEIR "Club" run. Some of the "Club members" told me that they wanted that, as well as I did. And I was willing to do that. That's called "Commitment". "Responsibility".

And WHY is it such a "big deal?" I'll tell you why. I had many people ask me why there aren't ever any "Club" meetings with this "Club?" "Why don't they ever hold any Elections?" So, I wanted to find out why for their benefit, as well as my own. That's all. I mean, if you are a member of a "Club", don't you want to participate in what goes on with Your "Club?" Well, apparently so, as, I had many "Club members" coming to me complaining as to how this "Club" was being run. And, apparently, I was the only one that cares enough. In the almost 3 years that this "Club"" has been in exisitence. There was never even one "Real" meeting of ANY kind... There was never even One Election so that ANY of the other "Club members" who might want to have a chance to try out a Board position, (That means EVERYONE ELSE BUT the "Original" Board members, BTW...) could have a chance to.

And, I was also told by several "Club members" that poor attendeence of "Club events" was probably due to the fact that the members did not feel part of the "goings on" with the "Cub". That is, "Their Club". And I can't blame them. They're right. They joined to be part of a "Club", but were disappointed that they weren't. You think that's right? Funny?

It became a one man operation. And, in my opinion, that does not constitute a "Club". That's all. I'm not bickering over anything....Just stating the facts. Dave's little grade school rant is just out of line. Very amusing coming from a "professional". And who said that Andreas was a bad guy?

 

Just a note from a mod.......

I don't follow this section enough to want to get involved in mediating this argument. Hopefully the other mod for this section will be along soon to figure out what to do. My initial observation is that no rules are seeming to be broken.... just a soap opera with one of the parties reporting the others posts. Quit reporting the posts, somebody will be along shortly.

Yes..... it is rather ridiculous.

 

Have I been asleep for a few years???

All the time I have spent (wasted?) on this site, I never knew there was this underlying animosity among (between?) some of the guys. Too bad, really.

Frank... you should check out the Lotus Corps. This sounds exactly like what you are looking for. They meet in Addison once a month, have elections, contuct business like meetings. A great group of guys, incredible with the wrench (that club single handedly kept my ****** brothers Esprit S1 running). Lotus has gone to Boston, so I'm not "involved" anymore. They do lots of events.

I personally feel the more the merrier, when it comes to events. BUT... I have 2 small kids, another to be born in about 5 weeks, and I work on average every other weekend. This leaves little time. Huskerbill's post regarding a decentralized "commission" may work better here.

Is the FOC "dead"? Could we not just do events under the banner of the cavallino?
FCA has some premier (in my opinion) events. The Italian Village was great. Mike E's party has been great in the past (darn weather!). And FCA's events always brings in great cars.

And Frank... I feel like some of us did make a "commitment" to FOC. We had a tech session at my house, and I am more than happy to do it again. I make it to what I can.

Can't we all just get along?

 

Where and why is everybody blowing this so out of proportion? There is no "Fighting" or "Animosity", at least on my part anyway. Or so I thought until Dave posted....

What is up with this "Can't we all get along?" We were! As far as I could see, anyway.

And, yes, Spike. You really did make a great "commitment" to the FOC by hosting that Tech Event. And again, Thank you for that.

The origin of this post stated that the car club scene in this area sucked. I replied that I couldn't agree more. And that I TRIED to make a nice car club for everybody, but, unfortunately, the rest of the board had other plans for the Club than I did. But, I was the one hearing the complaints from the disgruntled Club members about it. They weren't. That is all! So what, a person can't speak what's on their mind now? Without getting reamed?

I simply stated what really went on with that Club. I did not lie. I did not embellish anything. I just stated the facts. And, apparently, the truth is hurting some people.

Spike, I like what you said about the Lotus Club. Nobody here knows this, but they will now. The whole idea of "re-kindling" the F.O.C. here in the Midwest was mine. No one else thought of it. Why? I don't know. It was just sitting here, waiting....When I first bought my Ferrari 5 1/2 years ago. I joined the F.O.C. Only to soon find out that there wasn't a "Branch" here in the Midwest region. So, it always stuck in my mind. But, because I really didn't know anyone here in the "Ferrari Community" well enough, never brought it up. I also then joined the FCA.

Then, when I started seeing alot of negative posts here in FChat at the time about the FCA. Thought that maybe starting up the F.O.C. would be a good "Alternative". And, since it was my idea. I would like to have modeled after one of the really great Corvette Clubs that I used to hang out with. Check out this site and you tell me...www.windycitycorvettes.com Though the Ferrari group would have been much smaller, couldn't this be a great Ferrari Club. Ofcourse, if you had enough people that wanted something like that.

The problems arose when the guys that wanted to be on the board didn't want to commit any time to do something like that. Well, why did they offer to be on the board then? I made it very clear from the start that that was my goal. But it never happened. Why? Not enough involvement from "The Board". And one guy taking it upon himself to make every decision regarding as to what the Club was going to do. When, Where. How. Everything. It just wasn't a "Club" anymore. 1/2 the 4 person board never shows up at events, or particpates. There is absolutely ZERO discussion amongst the "Board" about what goes on. Planning, Etc....And, worse, there is NO involvement, or any particpation in the "Club process" allowed from the dues paying "Club Members". Is that a "Club"?

Yeah, I was not really happy about it. But I just went along with the program. (Hey....I was out numbered.) That is, until I started having Club members ask me why there aren't Ever any kind of Club meetings? Or Elections? Anything? What do I tell them? Well, I tell them the truth of the matter. And look where it gets me. Gee...my bad for being honest, I guess.

 

I don't believe in bringing club internal topics to the public, but would like to state for the record that we have offered Frank the position of president/leadership several times (including yesterday). So let me state this one more time: Frank, you can have the president's position on the board with immediate effect if you like to choose so. I will gladly step down and arrange everything for a smooth transition so that you can implement your ideas and plans. I will even offer my help as a non board member if you want me to.

Also I'd like to say, that I like Frank (otherwise we would have never started this journey) and enjoyed working with him and others over the years. We simply have different styles of leadership. Maybe it is time for somebody else to take the control. I have no problem with that.

PS: I look at the club and the cars as a hobby. Hobbies are supposed to be relaxing and joyful. Disharmony doesn't fit into that picture. I don't want to loose friends over politics.

 

Gee guys cool it. I thought Husker Bill and I had a feud but that was so tame to this mud slinging. Now kiss and make up and leave the politics off the Chat room. Even Bill and I are good friends and I have to say Bill really knows how to throw a car party because I was there. Bill you will do great with the various clubs in the bay area. I've been to a number of events out there over the years, you'll have a ball there. I hope you invite me for one or two events, especially if close to monterey weekend.

 

Good friends?? I hate you.


;-)

How about I work on getting you your hat you won??

By the way...........

I was sitting in a Daytona Coupe yesterday (it was a '71 I think.....). One of my friends just bought it and I went down to take a look. You would have been in hog heaven....

 

That's not sooooo bad, Rick and Bill ... Everybody hates me

 

You hate me? After I offered you an olive branch by offering to buy you a beer? I'm hurt you $^%&*% Wisc Cheesehead! Yes where is the hat that I won at your crummy show. And to think that I gave you over 15 car related posters for your event, some signed and limited editions. Glad you're moving away, too bad it's to CA. You should be banished to Siberia and see how often you see Ferraris there.

LOL, so will this reestablish us being the best feuders? LOL Again!

Well, you are right I would have loved to see that Daytona but I did get my fill in Monterey and was able to drive the one Daytona Spyder up onto the RM auction block. I'll be there again next year and better see you there!

 

Again from the peanut gallery: This is coming from someone who is not a member of either club, and I haven't had much time this year to attend anything anyway, I only made it to the last 15 minutes of Oak St., and then the drag racing thing (which was easy because I hosted it). Although I was part of FCA for a few years. Nobody from FCA has asked me why I haven't renewed.

Anyway, Frank, the comment about Andreas "Where did he come from all of a sudden" read to me like a negative statement. Forgive if I am wrong. It sounds to me like you are upset about nothing happening or being organized, but then have issue with Andreas organizing things, which is what I thought people wanted, was an organizer.

Anyway, my understanding of why you guys wanted to start FOC was because FCA did not drive around. To me, two competing clubs in this region does not add value. Sure, another magazine is nice, but FCA has hugely organized events which are fun to attend, and frankly, with the power of FChat and email and the phone, you don't need another club just to get people together to go for a drive. Obviously Huskerbill got 49 cars to come via the internet, with no club affiliation. Pretty impressive.

Remember, this is coming from somebody who is not part of FCA right now, so I'm not promoting one side or the other.

 

Frank Frank Frank; grow UP!

As a member of the FOC board, I too know how things went.

Andreas has been the 'backbone' of the club; you asked him to be from the very beginning, and Andreas has done a great job!

Frank basically wanted the resurgence of the FOC to 'feather' his own hunger and need for importance; but wanted to lay back and let others do the footwork, so he could claim to be the one bringing the FOC back. Basically, Frank wanted no responsibility, but just the hope for glory if all went well.

All Frank has done was provide trophies for events, his expense for which he was reimbursed by the Club.

Yes......Frank wanted to have meetings, this has now become his 'nemeses'! And the fact that the rest of us felt that 'in-the-face' meetings were not needed at this time, has bruised his ego.

No doubt, Frank will respond to this post in his usual insultive, vindictive manner(it's the only way he knows) as he has always done in the past.

Bottom line is, Frank came up with the idea or rebuilding the FOC, but left the footwork to his 'lackeys'; Andreas, Dave and me !

Let the insults fly Frank, I'm sure in your mind you feel they're well deserved.

As a side note, I resent the remarks you made about Dave and Andreas!

They're two great guys and you chose to demean them; WHY??

Are you jealous????

Frank.......just go to your room and fade away quietly.........

Please, no more insults, you have nothing to gain!

 

Actually Frank did a lot more than that: He also organized most of the drives we had over the years.

I really don't like the tone of this whole conversation. We have had a good run for three years and did some cool events together. I don't see the need to cut each others throats. Neither in private nor in public.

I hope we can leave this threat alone now.

 

Hey, any chance we can get this thread back into something trying to improve the Geneva Concours instead of bickering over an F-car club??

Geesh - that's the reason I don't belong to any of those clubs (ok, I belong to PCA for some of the discounts, but will probably let that membership lapse as I turn my own wrenches & can source parts on the cheap).

I volunteered to spread the word about the Concours as broadly as I can if only they send me a reminder a few weeks prior to the next event. <--- There's a positive contribution - anybody else?

 

I belong to Sam's Club and to my recollection, have never had a confrontation there at all. Seriously guys, come on, let's take a deep breath and let this argument lie in the past. At this point we know where everyone stands and there is absolutely no point in beating this dead horse any further. All that will be accomplished is burning bridges.

 

I would imagine they set the date way in advance... so why not spread the word then? Not under your control, I understand, just asking...

 

I'm going to have bad dreams tonight..... Frank, Andreas, Skip, and Dave kissing.... (shiver.....) oh the humanity!

 

Sorry you missed it, David. Its been listed on the PCA calendar in the PCA Chicago's Chicago Scene and website since at least January, and there were full page ads in both the July and August editions also. As a past/present invitee/participant, I recieved a couple of emails and flyers in the mail as well.

It was, IMO a great event with some world class cars, including, as noted above, several past overall Pebble/Meadowbrook/Amelia winning cars. Sponsorship from Maserati and Porsche. Around 120 cars, by my count. A real IROC 911 and center seat RSK. Len Bernstein had his black Ghibli coupe there, and John Weinberger had his simply stunning alloy bodied, fly yellow 275 GTB there also.

My young daughter also got the opportunity to crawl around the cavernous back seat of a Maybach 62, which impressed her far more than the alloy 275. Kids these days. Go figure...

Fairly large crowds were present all day, but it sounds like they could have done a better job of getting the word out to spectators.

Lots of money raised for the MS Foundation as well. All in all, I think they're doing a pretty good job at building the event.

 

Thank you for that, Andreas. And this will be my last comment about this, as It's gotten WAY out of hand already.

And, Skip's comments' are, well, the true Skip coming out. Nice, huh?.... Skip, did you forget to take your meds or something?

But come on. In all fairness, Andreas, is that really true? I said right from the beginning that I did not want to be the President, ever. (and I have the E-Mails to prove it, BTW.) And, is it not fact that from that very first week that we decided to do this, that you said: "O.K., but as long as I am the President!". (be careful, now, I also saved those E-Mails....)

And, I don't even know how that even became an issue. It never was with me, and everyone knows it. And, yes, you did E-Mail me just yesterday telling me that I could be the president. That is true, but how is it relevant? As I resigned from the FOC Board, and the postion of V.P. over a MONTH ago? I told you then that I was through being on the board. And, as far as being president. You know as well as I do that I NEVER, EVER wanted anything like that. I told you that I was happy with being the V.P., and that it didn't really matter anyway because I was going to be moving out of state in a few years. Right? "Being the President" as Dave & Skip seem to be so hung up about was never even an issue with me. Was it. I just would have liked for the Board to actually sit down together once in awhile to discuss the goings on and future plans of the club. So what the hell is so wrong with that? And that the other members could also particpate, as they are dues paying members, too, and should be allowed to have some say as to what and how things go on with "their Club", too. Right? And if anyone thinks that is wrong, well I don't care, really.

All I ever wanted was to make a nice club for the folks that were interested. Nothing more. Nothing less. And, yes, from the start, I kept asking to have a sit down type meeting, at least Once in awhile. But I was snubbed. But, then I shut up about it, didn't I? I never pressed the issue again. Did I? I just "went with the flow", and did everything like the rest of the board wanted. Right? Am I not telling the truth here?

Only when I started getting other members and potential members ask me why there aren't ever any kind of Club meetings, or Elections did I start questioning everything.

So, this whole thing has been blown totally out of proportion. But, I said all that I'm gonna say. And anyone can take it however they want to. (Peronally, unless I know all of the details of something, I keep my mouth shut. But hey, that's just me.... ) But, before you do....Please READ it thoroughly and see what I was trying to say.

 

I was going to take my Mangusta, but they called me and asked me to bring the Dino, as there were fewer Ferraris than normal due to the conflict with the Italian Village event. I really think this is turning into one of the best midwest shows. Don't forget, it's still relatively new and they are continuously improving. It's a quality event benefitting a worthy cause. Since attendance was high it's hard to criticize their promotion.

 

Daryl, is that your Dino at the Geneva Show? (I saw it in the photos that were posted.) Those cars are absolutely gorgeous! Man, I too wish I would have known that the show was going on that day. I would have definitely went.

BTW...Do you happen to know who this may be? (Picture below) Last Summer, I was driving Eastbound along Ogden Av. in Hinsdale, and was right along side of, then in front of this beautiful Dino as we passed Continental. Then, I turned North by Wolf Rd.and we parted ways....

(Note: Apologies for the somewhat fuzzy photo. It was taken with a disposable Camera, just held out the window, backwards while doing 40MPH.... )
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Daryl,

Sorry I missed seeing your Dino, but your Espada was a thrill last year!

I'll admit the event is new & probably having growing pains, but I'd be surprised if the crowds you saw were much bigger than the typical bunch of shoppers on 3rd street over a weekend

 

In response to an earlier thread let me clarify one point: In the FCA, cars win awards on their own MERITS--the owner does not have to "kiss our ass" to win. I don't know that anyone ever had to kiss mine.

Mr. Bendl's automobile stands on it's own and certainly needs no excuses to win. It's a nice car. Period.

As for Dave himself, (and many others,thank you) they have all WORKED very hard at our events. "Work" does not translate to "ass-kissing."

I'm sure our Director, Mike and his President, Pete would welcome any FOC menbers who come their way. Be it support,work,or just showing-up -- it will be appreciated.

 

I hate to jump in on this..but as I had mentioned earlier I am looking to join FOC/FCA to be a more active participant in events. Is this what you guys are really about? If so, count me out..back to the cars please.

 

I love Dave's car, and he pretty much puts the rest of us to shame....
wrenching that beauty himself, restoring the interior himself, then driving it all the way to the east coast and back...

I recently washed mine, took it to the Italian Village event... oh, and went to Home Depot... who is the real Tifosi?

DAVE: When do I get a ride, BTW?????

 

I've been here for a few years... this is the first I've "heard" or seen about this... I've had a lot of fun at the various events. This bickering is just background noise. FOC has had some cool events and we have had good fun. FCA has great events with great cars (FOC just does not get F40s, 275s, etc at the events, FCA does).