Interesting set of precedent Prehaps you could share the relevant court details should we *gasp* need this precedent to refer to in the future Good job
I think we should have the same insurance. If so, look under risk details where your value is stated and it says "Insured's estimated market value". Then look at the attached terms under Section 1 "Loss or Damage" where it states : "The liability of the Company shall not exceed the ... The Company's maximum liability shall be limited to the prevailing market value of the Motor Vehicle at the time of the loss or damage but not exceeding the insured's estimate of market value stated in the schedule." So I don't think the lawyers can argue that the premium paid is for a specific sum insured.
Isn't it case by case basis ? For it to apply, I'd have to have a mondial having the same repairs and accident and other driver.
Ha ha get in line for replies by LTA .. No diff if no omv - same thing - value based on what a car trader (ha ha) will pay for your car - insurance co have departments and advisors who draw up all sorts of internal tariffs and tables so they have the data to calculate how to charge you. Yes, coupe and turbo are common basis for increasing premium. Others are sex (more for females), age (more for young and very old), profession (some professionals are charged less), whether there are named drivers (more for more drivers) and so on.
You have to be proactive with your insurance. Your garden variety broker usually knows squat about insurance but what do you expect ? Truly professional brokers will manage your insurance costs which means more than just shopping for the best prices. It means reviewing your premiums at renewal and not just reminding you to pay the same as last year or increasing it, your warranties, your excess, your risks, number of named drivers, even geographical reach and your estimated values (for insurers who underwrite with such caps).
SF - how about displaying your testa in your living room like this ? (last pic a bit squashed but can see better) Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
LTA replied to my question about the surcharge on cars older than 10 yrs. it is calculated based on when the car was FIRST registered(regardless of whether it was singapore or other foreign lands). It has nothing to do with when it was first registered in Singapore. Meaning they will like to bend you over as soon as they can. The idealogy of basing a surcharge on cars older than 10 yrs IN SINGAPORE makes sense. The surcharge on when it was must registered doesnt make sense...The LTA tried to make some stupid reference "If you were born in this year...your cost of living and its higher cost would be...regardless of where you live.." Dumbarse LTA gets milking award of the year
So they have a table for calculating how much the car is worth. They then create a preimum as to how much I should pay for insurance. If my car gets stolen tmw, how is the market value tabulated when there is no other similar model and there is little or no market value of the car? If I acquire a global/regional "body" value, would that be a far assessment of the car's value? Pertaining that, we come back to LTA, how would I be able reinstate a car acquired by such means and register it?
Its must be an extreme situation for there to be a car so unique that there is no ascertainable value. Is there such car in Singapore ? No market value ? You mean its junk ? or not saleable ? If not saleable, it means there is still value. It will be assumed that someone will buy it. If junk, then there is no hope. Car insurers normally insure without a survey. However, if your car is unique and they are willing to entertain you, then what they could do is arrange for a survey and valuation. And Yes, I do know that car valuers do use overseas sources like periodicals, etc like some chatters here do as well, to fix a value. If it is not possible to safely to fix a value, then insurers will normally decline comprehensive. If they can fix comprehensive then they probably have a value. In other words, there will always be a way to value a car no matter how unique if it is capable of being insured. Its simply a question of whether you are prepared to accept the insurer's valuation after its out. Not necessarily - a global value could be to your disadvantage - you could optimistically try to make a case to insurance that your car should be worth more than overseas because of restrictions on import and availability of such cars for eg you have a beloved 246 dino (like the one in the photo above !!!!!!! how come no one says its beautiful ? Ha ha) and it gets stolen (which may well happen as there is only one 246 here). What has one got to do with the other ? Insurance is not a contract to return you back the same type of car in Singapore esp when its one that cannot be replaced with an import. As to LTA, its not obliged to register an import as a coe car because your coe car was stolen. You could appeal to them at most. Finally, KingS1, photos of your dino please.
Err Shy...... Still not what I expect yet. Doing a hidden A/C. Soon Soon. 2 units in singapore. YEs.....
BTW, it is insured at "Agreeded Value" not Market Value. It is special policy. BTW Ferrari and Maserati cars can get special insurance if they get their policies form Hong Seh as they have special tie ups.
Oh CT, how come you are reading my mind & those pics look very familiar. I saw them somewhere few months ago in advertisements or some ID magazines. I have been dreaming about a glass house in Malaysia where I can possibly afford & Isk mentioned about his architect friend converting a nextdoor terrace to house his collection of cars. I'm thinking of a rotating elevator system while having breakfast this morning. Something like a revolving system like what we saw in Fast/Furious Tokyo & Japanese do have creative systems due to their tight space constraints. When the particular car reaches ground level, it lights up & the lift will have a voice system greeting you then announcing the model presented to you. How about that BTW, I spoke to an exotic car dealer in KL yesterday & poked about any nice classics. Seems that there are some but tough as the owners don't need money. Among them: Merc 500/540K, Gullwing, Porsche 964RS, TurboS, 993GT2, E type etc. but similar situation here. Tough to get loan on old cars so he deals mainly recent ones. I increased a few PSI on my front tyres & the steering effort improved dramatically with sharper turn-in Oh yes, I have bee preaching that the Dino IS a beautiful car. It moves my soul, if it doesn't move anyone's; he/she must be clinically dead.
Very good insight on auto insurance here. My agent do make his round everytime I renew the premium but "grey" when it comes to "True insured value", I doubt any insurance company will want to commit in writing towards an agreed value that is of course unless we're willing to pay an extremely profitable premium to their pockets. Few years ago, in a morning, my classmate woke up & discovered his precious classic British green-father-owned-since-new MG Roadster stolen from his HDB carpark. I think it was on 3rd party insurance so there's nothing to claim & LTA only refunded his remaining COE. His car was subsequently found few years later in a junkyard in JB & it was dismantled for parts when the police raided that area. It cannot be returned to Singapore because LTA said it was deregistered so he rebuilt it & sold to a Malaysian for few thousand ringgit. Sad. KingS1, how much do you pay for the premium on the Dino & what is the agreed value? The company please or shall we contact HS office?
yes, my insurance was arranged through HS as well and its not for an agreed value. Does it mean that if your car is insured under such a special policy for say $600,000 then they will pay $600,000 even if a similar age and condition car is on the market for $300,000 by the time of the total loss ? Does not make sense but if like that can, then I surely want that insurance. Which insurer are you referring to ? AXA ?
hidden air con ? - that means you modifying some part of the car ? no choice I guess since so hot .. but not original anymore 2 units - sell one la ..
wa you can uh ? rotating elevator ..... actually idea of car in home is not new but pics I posted show how it can be well done. I not so big time - just thinking about putting a glass partition to replace wall between living room and porch so that can see car from living room like in the pic and doing up the porch ie change to wooden flooring, add arty lights, air con, etc but no revolving car lift and voice system.
Car trader & king1sg, I see your points but that was not my concern. I have no quams that values should be dimishing as cars are mostly deperciating assets. My concern is when you have car which has been coe renewed or lack of parf value(little or no paper value esp with today's low PQP). How do you prevent a situation in which the insurance company writing off you car at deemed paper value when one is invovled in a accident. Basically, my car has $10,000 in paper left, when coe is newed next year, it will still have $10,000 of there abouts of paper value when PQP is newed. If I get invovled in an accident where damage is <$10,000, how do I determine that my car is worth more than $10,000. The insurance company will attempt to write my car off, I know that one can appeal and not allow the write off. The question is what is insurance for at this point. If comprehensive and first party, how is the value or write off point determined? If the paper value is it, then shouldnt the premium be based on paper value than car? I know its a very daunting and "grey" area, but it should be discussed and questions need to be raised and answered. "We'll see" or "We'll have a way later" isnt good enough any more.
Actually, diminshing values was not my main point. Your question of how the value is determined was answered but it seems that your not willing to accept it. What you want to do is to challenge the insurance company's right to write off your car. You want them to pay for the repairs even though it looks like its not worth repairing. Well then you need to assemble a lawyer and professional valuer but ultimately the cost of the exercise is probably more than its worthwhile.
Alamak Fong, just keep people away from your car & vice versa lah ;( Perhaps, you must really speak to the underwriters of the Auto department. NTUC is hungry for sales but there's their Star Auto coverage deal which may hamper repairs. This will be a more serious question for those people who forgo their high parf & renew COE. Eg. F355s, Aston Martins, 996s etc. Even if they do get a compensation based on valuation from international market for the body, they will still lose the +/- $100K parf, something which is only unique to Singapore.
No, I think once again it is misunderstood. What I dont want the insurance to do is deem the paper value as "value" of the car. I dont want them to write off the car once damage is more than my paper value. Your answer determined cars which had market value determined by other cars on the market. This I accept and I have done so in the past by insurance companies. And frankly, the insurance company did little. My question is how do insurance companies determine value for my car which is one of its kind in Singapore. The cost of determining the value of the car now is being undertaken by my underwriter. This is their determinination as they have to assess the car's value. In short, the insurance premium payable is drawn upon by the tables which you described. However, due to lacking in statistics of similar vehicles and the little amount of paper value left, my car's chance of getting written off at any slight incident is very high, thus I raise the question. A recent fender bender cost <$5,000 at the cost of the other party. I have at no point challenged the insurance company, I am only asking for an explaination for what is the standard procedure in a non-standard situation here. The question here is that the insurance company is unable to provide a value detemination for a policy in which they have choosen to undertake. I would be very happy to take on a 2nd or 3rd party insurance but as they choose to push the comprehensive polices has me asking qquestions. My previous COE cars all had 3rd party insurance which was very cheap and thus I raised no issues.
