Further proof testarossa's should skyrocket in value... :).

What auctions are these at? I have ties to the automotive industry and I have never seen a Testarossa in person or on record that sold at any auction for less than the low 40's. I also remember reading on here that Jim's Testarossa did sell for less than 30k, but its frame was rotted and it had ~110k miles on it.

I honestly don't believe TR prices will fall much further than they currently are. The reason is I cant see people paying more retail dollars for 308/328s (ABS 328's aside) than a clean Testarossa... nothing against the 3X8 cars but the TR is a V12. I also think as guys who are now in their early 30's are coming into the age where they have some expendable cash, they will buy cars that were on posters when they were kids... those being the Testrarossa, 930 Porsches, and the Lamborghini Countach.

 

I don't see why anyone should be concerned or expect a Ferrari to appreciate in value unless 7 figure classic models, I have said before I don't ever see the Tr appreciating much the main reason they made too many of them, the same goes for the 308 series especially as well, a TR would have a greater chance of appreciating than a 308 IMO.

The same goes for my 355 I have no delusions about it ever being worth a considerable sum by collectors as they made too many of them as well, it is regarded by Ferrari as one of theri greatest cars of the last Century as well but the numbers are too great.

Just enjoy the cars for what they are IMO as some of the greatest cars ever made.

 

One common problem is that it's easy to say "if I could find a running TR for $30k I'd buy it!" but then, when presented with an actual, running TR for mid-30s, warts and all, to end up saying "But it would cost a fortune to make that car as nice as I would want! Much cheaper to buy a nice one and pay more up front!"

No one is saying you're going to get a great TR for mid-30s, although it may be possible to get one. The TR you're going to get in that price range is a car with no service history, paintwork, high miles, etc.

Exhibit A, s/n 72081: white, sold at a collector auction (NOT a dealer auction) 2/25/06 for $42k. 80k miles, and the following SCM description:

"This one is showing signs of use and mileage. Paint is OK at ten feet, but up close it's crazing and chipped. Driver's seat is worn, with cracked leather, and the carpets are tired. That said, the car does appear to have been well-maintained."

I'm not bashing on TRs at all-- I think they're neat cars. I don't think you should buy ANY car as an investment, however-- buy it because you like to drive it, or like to look at it, or whatever, but not to make money.

 

I certainly did not buy my TR as an investment. With that being said, I dont think you can discount the fact that it is an 80's icon with very unique styling. On those grounds alone, the car will eventually creep up past the 100k mark, but yes it will take some time.

 

I think the auction data should be the focus. I see the August RM auction had a BBi sell for 88K and a Testa for 71.5K. Seems spot on to what I have seen in various mags. For example- Hemmings had a few Testa's for 65 - 80K and a few BBI's all under 100K. About a 15-20K spread in asking price.

I do not want to get into a pissing match, but I believe we have already begun to see the Testa's moving up in price because my generation is entering the market. Two completely different market forces here.....the BBi price will be driven by the knowledgable Ferrari collector and the Testa's will be driven by its status as a generation's icon.

I continue to see that people think 7,177 cars is a lot- how many of us 'memory-lane' buyers do you think there are?

That said, I would like to hear from folks who have been around longer than I have- just how many of the 7,177 cars came to America and are likely to still be around after accidents and parting out.

Bill

 

I am still lost on the 7k plus TR's made being "too many". Production volume hasnt stopped the classic american car market from going through the roof. Ferrari in general is always a low production car manufacturer compared to everyone else. The bottom line is that every pre 90's Ferrari is going to go up in value in the next few years, even the 308gt4-not great styling but one of the most funn F-cars to drive, that alone is driving the price of that car up slowly. In the TR's case, it is 12cyl and exotic styling, love it or hate it , it definitely has its place in the future collector line up. One other intersting point to note, is that alot of Ferrari collectors that have large Ferrari collections, all seem to have a Testarossa in it, whether it is a 512tr or an early single mirror car, that is saying something right there.

 

I don't really have an opinion as to any TR market, because, frankly I never really cared about it that much. It always seemed to overblown. I liked the Boxer, the 308, and many of the older cars, just was never crazy about the TR. But there are some big holes, IMO, that I think many do not consider.

Dodge built some 200,000 Challengers IIRC. Of those, the 1970 models are worth the most. But from the day those cars hit the streets, they were beat to death, rolled, smashed, driven through winter salt, and crushed. I recall seeing 440 R/T's with rust up to the door handles getting crushed in salvage yards. Z/28's, Cudas, TransAms. I highly doubt more than 10% of those cars exist today except as Ford Focus's and Toyotas. Perhaps the truly good cars are less than 1%. The 308 wasnt really treated a whole lot better. It was the throw away Ferrari it seemed for a while. Abused, neglected, many burned, more rusted. Many are gone. How many I dont know, but I still think it would be hard to locate 25% of the originals.

But the TR is, and always has been different. Its like the Indy pace car Corvette, or the Delorean. The people who have bought and owned them have for the most part taken very good care of them, kept mileage low, or made them look like it, and the prices have held. But I wouldnt ever want one. No offense, its a pretty car, but its to, I dunno. To much. But also, there has been a lot I have read about problems with it, and they are expensive. $30K repair bills are going to scare people off, especially when there are other Ferrari models that dont break like that. I think if you could fix the gearbox and make it more bulletproof, you might get a lot farther someday. But as to what the market will do? Flip a coin. NK keeps blowing up nukes and nothing will go up in value except fear.

 

I think the total production count isn't as important as the number of running examples still on the road. A lot of American muscle was made which promptly rusted and was junked by 1980, leaving only a bunch of good copies which in fact do command a premium now.

The number of running examples coupled with sales turnover keeps the TR market low. If all you TR guys simply stopped selling your cars, you'd see a 20% jump in price immediately. "Remove" a couple hundred of them and now you're talking!

 

I recall my dad getting a new TR in 1986 and the retail was $105,000 when he ordered it.
BT

 

Not rare at all for a Ferrari 12cyl...but fairly rare compared to a lot of other makes. Only "specialized" american cars of that era had these kind of numbers... What was Viper production during its first years when 512TR and 512M were being made? 1993 to 1995 total ZR1 production was 448 cars each of those three years, the last years they were made.

Again, was this just US, or total? Thanks...

 

The answer to the "would you buy a $30K TR?" is pretty simple...YES. Would I then try to polish a turd? NO, I'd part it out. The sum value of the parts is worth more than the car itself. As more cars are used as parts cars the value will be pushed higher...simple supply & demand economics.

 

3x - 5x original price for something that was made in the 60's doesn't beat inflation.

Our family owns a house in an historic district that was purchased in the mid '60s. It was appraised for taxes last year for approximately 12.5x the original purchase price.

Yes, prices go up, but at the end of the day, 5x over 40 years is still a pretty $hitty return...

 

i do not think Testarossa. will sky rocket too much further.. It will stay about where it its in todays market.. If you check the market value. all testarossa from 1984-1995 have gained slightly, but will stay. it will not go any further.
owners of testarossa are getting out. its to costly to maintain. newer cars from Audi and Lamborghini, are more reliable. its not worth holding on to a testarossa or 512tr or f512m to much longer. Audi is killing ferrari...
john

 

The cars from the eighties will gain in value only because the people desperate to get into the muscle car scene that cant afford the high roller cars will turn to the "lesser" vehicles in thier price range but that wont make an 81 camaro change hands for $300K in anyones life time.

 

Let's recap, according to the non-Testarossa owners the following was mentioned time and time again:

1) There are plenty of Testarossas selling at $30K range. We all agree that their conditions are questionable at best.

Now, take a potential buyer's POV for a minute here, will someone buy a $30K car knowing perfectly well that it will require a lot of work? It is not like this is a Ford of Chevy that you can buy parts cheap and from just about any auto parts store. Case in point, most people shopping for a Ferrari does not want to buy a poorly kept Ferrari so they can spend another $5K let along $20-$30K and the time to get it back to a respectable condition. In other words, these cars will either be parted out or remain unsold and continue to drop. They should not be part of the equation in determining Testarossa's market value.

2) Too many were made thus the car is worthless to a collector.

Let us focus on the US market only as this website is populated mostly by North Americans. I think it is safe to say that on average, there were about 200 or so Testarossas imported in each production year. For this discussion, we will only focus on the Testarossas, which there were ~1,400 of them came in as US cars. If case #1 above is true, then there are a lot less than 1,400 examples left, not to mention the cars that had been mutaliate into either a targa or a convertible, as these car's values are questionable as well, unless they were done by the factory. Honestly tho, I have no idea how many Testarossas in respectable shapes are left, but I think it is safe to say that the number is a lot smaller than most people seems to think. What does this mean, I have no idea to a collector, I have no idea.

3) Cost of ownership is very high on these cars.

Compare to other exotics of its era or even after its era, this statement is false. For example, the 550 and the 355 are getting up there with age as well, the electronics are not cheap to replace by any mean. We shall wait and see.

I do agree that there is no point in worring about what will happen to the market value of the Testarossa. Anyone that buys a relatively modern car as an investment needs a refreshment course in Business 101, unless these are extremly rare as in the case of the P4/P5. Just enjoy the car while you own it. There is no point in perserving the car for someone else. If I have a 250 Testa Rossa, I can assure you that it will not sit in the garage only as I will be running the car without fear on a weekly basis at least.

PS: If someone can find me a Testarossa in similar shape as mine for $30K, please PM me as I will be more than happy to look into buying it. To start, the car is: 1991, US version, <30K on the dial, owned since new, all service records kept, all recalls done, last major service performed in 2004. No modifications done other than the addition of a stereo and alarm system.

 

Everything made sense until the final paragraph. Nobody claimed you could get a low km 91TR for $30K, just that you can get a TR.

There are people out ther that would buy a dirt cheap TR to get into the game and live the dream, also spend as much time as needed to get it back up to snuff rather than part it out.

 

During that time period about 1/3 of total producton was coming to NA. During that period the gray market was going full swing. Since TR's were so much in demand they were a big gray market item. I would say that a substantial percentage of the other TR's came here in that way. I would GUESS that the number of cars that got here one way or the other is closer to 4000 cars out of the total of just under 10k.


I disagree that maint and repairs on a 550 will rise to the level of the TR. The TR was costlier than the 550 from day one and that trend will not reverse. It's depreciation to a level not that much higher than the TR I see as a major factor in TR's future.

 

I would imagine that these shoppers are in the minority, and an even smaller precentage of these people can actually do so. Which as a result of a failed re-storation attemp, these Testarossa will then re-appear on the market with even worse reputation and more nightmare stories to tell. I just simply find it hard to believe that someone will spend $30K on a used car with plans to spend another $30K to re-store it. I think most people would simply chose to find a better example around $60K range and not deal with the potential headachs. That's just my opinion.

 

Many do it yourselfers new to Ferrari grossly underestimate the repair costs even when the labor is free. Happens to late models wrecks at auction frequently.

 

Interesting perspective, I wonder what the real number is for the Testarossas here in the States.

Regarding cost, so you feel that the overall cost of ownership for a 20 year old 550 will be less than the cost to upkeep a 20 year old Testarossa for an average owner? Needless to say that you know a lot more about these things than I do, but I do find it hard to believe that the electronics are that cheap to replace if they should go bad on the 550. You are the expert here, thanks for the info.

 

When a 550 is 20 years old the TR will be 30+. The 550 will never catch up. TR parts are being discontinued and if alternatives are offered or we start fabricating or recycling and rebuilding more that will just drive the costs higher.

Forgetting the age difference for the time being, yes a 550 will be less costly. The car was designed from the outset to be less labor intensive. Labor cost is the majority of expense in keeping them going and will get worse as time goes by and even less people are qualified to work on them. As I referred to earlier a 3 year old TR cost more to look after than a 3 year old 550 and that will just snowball as time goes on.

A 550 is not too bad as far as being heavily laden with electronics. The very next generation however was. The 575 is a few magnitudes worse. One thing about electronics in the 550 + generation cars. They are for the most part Bosch which is far better supported than MM which the TR + prior cars have. Even when those are discontinued I expect a cottage industry to spring up to support them in much the same way it is springing up to support the CIS equipment.

I love the TR and have every expectation of leaving ours in a will but I also look at it as a real commitment and a potentially expensive one.

 

I spent a little under $20k on a car that I know will take an additional $40k to make perfect if that's what I want. But then again, I'm a stupid idiot.

But the problem is, the average guy that wants in at $30k probably can't swing $60k.

These cars are not for everyone and there is a small pool of people that want a TR, have the resources, and don't yet have a car in the garage. Right now, the supply is higher than the number of potential buyers, so if anything, the market is flat to declining.

 

You tryin to say sumthin? Spit it out.