Don't know if anyone has posted this yet, but at the sake of being redundant - I got a mailer from Alpine Motorsports Club this past week. It's a 'members only' track in PA - about 75 miles from NYC. Looks pretty cool. I believe construction is supposed to be completed next year. Has anyone 'signed up' yet? Their website is www.alpinesignature.com Could be a nice addition to some of the runs in 2007 - roll out to this track in PA - track the cars for a couple of hours (we all pony up some $$ to have the track to ourselves that day) - then head back to NYC (or..uh..Edgewater)... I'm sure we could find some nice scenic routes for the ride down there and back up..
I'll believe it when I see it. Been seeing Alpine literature for about 5 years. :-/ Plus, there's about 3 track whores here.
I had gotten some information about that place a while ago and looked into it. It's not cheap. IIRC, it a "members only" arrangement. You buy into the place and then pay an annual fee to use the track. Fees vary based on how much track time you want. I don't recall them talking about renting the track to outside groups. But if you want to do track days, there are plenty of them at Lime Rock and Pocono. The Empire Region FCA runs a great event up at Lime Rock every summer, and several events out at Pocono. The best ones they run are up at Watkins Glen. But a bunch of other organizations, like PDA, SCCA, SCDA, Trackmasters, Porsche club, BMW clubs, Jaguar, Corvette, etc. all do events at LRP and Pocono. They are all "high performance driver ed" (HPDE) type events, not wheel to wheel racing, and most of them offer a novice group with both classroom and in-car instruction. This past summer, I could have been doing a track event just about every weekend, and a couple of days every week, if I didn't have to work for a living. You want the on-track experience of a lifetime? Come to the Empire Region FCA event at Watkins Glen early next May. Two days of extensive track time and classroom instruction, excellent in-car instructors, uncrowded track and plenty of opportunity to enjoy one of the truly great tracks in the world. And it's not limited to Ferraris. I take my Corvette to that one, and there are a bunch of Porsches, BMW's, Audi TTs, and other sportscars that are suitable for tracking, not to mention a pile of F-cars including a bunch of 355 and 360 Challenge cars. Ask Steve (Enjoythemusic). He was there in May and over Labor Day weekend with us. Loads of fun.
Sorry for the delay, was doing a search and found this thread. First off, there appears to be POSSIBLE scams all around the United States with 'new tracks' offering dreams, hopes, and a time of your life. Oooh, driving your car on the track. Yes it is fun, though there are so MANY oppertunites right now for low $$$ without the need for very high $$$ investement. Also, your high $$$ gives you NOTHING of solid monetary value IMO. ASK IF THEY HAVE ALL PERMITS ASK IF THEY HAVE LAID DOWN THE TARMAC No to either, run away!!!! IMO And i bet you the contract you dsign basically has so many open holes to screw you... you may as well bring the plastic glove and lubricant to make it feel easier when you get it you-know-where. Beware of fees and other variables. The ONLY track i see as possibly being a reality in the next 2 years would be the SCCA track, and interesting how as best i can tell they ARE NOT looking for 'members' to cough up $$$$. Frankly, i would bet dollars for donuts that ANY new track will NEED the income from clubs (FCA, SDCA, COMSCC, BMW, PCA, SCCA, etc) to survive. That means save your money and WAIT for the track to becoms a reality (which i doubt) and then pay a club for a club day, which in the long run wil be MUCH MUCH cheaper than being a 'exclusive member' or whatever terminology they choose to use nowadays. Selling hopes and dreams... and working on your emotional side... Trust me, get a lawyer as i am sure anyone will tell you to do before spending (as it IS NOT investing IMO) that high a dollar value. FCA/SCCD/PCA/etc club track days provide, as mentioned, classroom learning and other benefits not available if you just arrive and drive. Anywho, i joined a track years ago... and got nothing but a few shirts to date. They do not have all permits, no tarmac is being laid down, etc. Tell ya what, i got a bridge in Brooklyn for sale In the end i truly wish and hope ALL tracks are built and we all get to enjoy them. Problem is NONE OF THEM laying tarmac to date. Save your money, go have fun with club events. There are PLENTY out there. If you have a SCCA approved car, you could basically race/track every week from April to September... which i might actually do in 2007 COMMON SENSE ALERT!!! BUYER BEWARE and have your lawyer VERY CAREFULLY look over ANY contract before you sign it. Just wait until your lawyer tells you the reality of... Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
well put. Why join a track when you there are so many club events you can basically go whenever you want. Between all the clubs I am a part of (BMWCCA, ACNA, SCCA, PDA, etc) I have never found myself short of track days. It actually turns out cheaper if you dont buy a membership.
I was thinking of setting up an FChat track day. Maybe ill start a new thread so we can plan a day at lime rock in the spring.
FYI: Deb from Alpine called me today to answer my inquiry. Seems they had all permits, but one was yanked. They have gone back and had a re-evaluation and will be sending it in. If that passes and everything is set they plan to lay tarmac in 2007 and open track in 2008. Club Motorsports still need some permit work and hope to be in full construction in 2007 as well. So 2008 we MIGHT see some tracks opening up... but only time will tell for sure. If it were me, wait for the tarmac to be laid, THEN decide. Still... i am being soured by past experience plus am wonderinf if any track can really survive without huge $$$ influx from members, if it stays a members only track. Still, look at all costs and decide for yourself. As for me, i'd get utterly bored of running the same track in various configs in short order. To each their own of course. As for renting a track, you can do that and plan on $20k on up for the day and reserve your days NOW as dates get booked up fast for the next year's worth of events/days.
Think again. First of all, virtually every available track day at LRP is booked. If there are any open dates, the Porsche club and BMW club generally grab them. Second, renting LRP is very expensive. It used to be a reasonably priced track, but since ol' Skippy took the place over, the price per day has gone through the roof. And he wants big money up front, non-refundable, and no "rain checks" (if it rains, you're screwed). IMHO, unless you can get 50 to 60 drivers to pony up the money, the per driver cost will be extremely high. You'd be much better off checking out the schedule, picking a date or dates and trying to get a group from here to sign up for that event. It's easier, cheaper and less hastle for you and everyone else.
Listen to Steve he knows where of he speaks. You guys are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy in over your heads. There's getting the date, insurance, corner workers, instructors, technical safety inspections. Yes, believe or not some of you will need instruction. Better yet, just go to a couple events and observe, talk with people. You will learn a lot doing that. Track people are very warm and helpful if you tell them what your thinking about doing. Just don't ask questions while they're busy prepping their car. Flying wrenches can hurt. As one person posted in this thread, there are already a lot of organized track days at the various local tracks. Go sign up for one of those. I strongly suggest you start at Pocono as it's the safest and least intimidating. Oh, and be prepared to break or damage your car. Everyone does at some point in time. That's why watching for a couple of days might be a good starting point. Tracking your car may not be for you. The second most dangerous thing about track days is the greenies at their first day of track. The single most dangerous thing is drivers that have just graduated to the next level their first time out in that group. As my wife constantly reminds me, they get their balls in the carburetor and logic is lost in the process. It's a hell of a lot of fun you just need to realize what you're getting into. Bob S.
Many thanks and yes guys, i lost only $2k last year trying my hand at that. There were sponsors lined up, etc too. Agreed, as some guys do not properly prep their car. Am amazed when i asked various guys what brake fluid they are using (and when it was last changed) and they had no idea. And brake fluid/change is VERY basic stuff. It can be BUT a proper organization will have an instructor who keeps the driver in check. Still, things can happen if you are a green (newbie), a white (almost newbie), a blue (fairly experienced), od red (expert). Have seen Red guys do all sorts of stuff a bit over the top, and yup, have seen the outcome of their actions. GENERALLY. i have found FCA, SCDA and other gentleman track events to be very friendly and a great way to learn. We all started somewhere and one of the reasons i felt it was time to bail from my track event was that NHIS was probably not the best track for a newbie in a very high HP/TQ car. The potential for running out of talent was too high. Red haze. Will fully admit have been there. It was during a four consecutive day events at WGI. On the third day i sat back a bit and even sat out a run group. On day four out of four runs i did only two. It reminded me of being 90 days clean and sober.... one gets this false sense of well-being and overconfidence. Amen. Filed under 'Keeping It Real," just remember guys that any car you put on the track you must be fully willing to write off in full. It is a rare, but possible circumstance. This is where properly prepping the car and LOTS OF SAFETY EQUIPMENT and trained track personnel come into play. No matter what the car is just a car, it is YOU that is the most valuable thing. That grey matter between your ears... use it. For me, track driving it about German precision in knowing brake points, pedal pressure, vehicle dynamics, etc. Those stupid early years of whoopee-do street driving IS NOT track driving. Serious track driving, for me, is about knowing the lines, entry and exit speeds, shifting, etc. Once a track is familiar, it all falls into a repetitive rethym that is tweaked here and there is SMALL increments to find the very limit. Sometimes when finding the limit, said limit gets passed and one might find themselves off the track. F1 drivers do this, especially during practice sessions. Even the great Schumacher has had MANY track offs. It is calculated risk management. obviously turns with plenty of runoff you can play with the edge more than a turn where there is no room to 'play' if you have an off. Tracking is VERY serious... and for me one of the most exciting things in my life. If you are serious about starting a track event feel free to contact Bob Coates of FCA, he is a great guy who knows his stuff. If i can help in any way feel free to let me know. In the end PLEASE track your car if you feel the desire for learning your car's, and your, capabilities. The track is a MUCH safer place than on public roadways. Odds are, the more you track your car the more you realize that driving illegally on public roads is stupid.
And we are all going in the same direction. No one is peeling out of a driveway or parking lot (although not paying attention coming out of the pits is begging for trouble). Even blind corners usually have flaggers to wave the yellow if there is trouble ahead. I've never seen a corner worker on a busy suburban street where the risk of a collision is higher and the potential losses much greater. OT: Hey Steve, congrats on the new ride. After you win some contingency money maybe you'll restore the 308! Ron
Why not just do a driving school? If you get really serious with the racing bug I would roll that money into a tow vehicle, a cheapo little racetoy that you don't mind smacking into a wall, tires, and as many track sessions as you can squeeze in. This would seem like a much more economical way to do things.
Many thanks and LOL about contingency funds. Heck, am just trying to go faster and keep costs down. Tracking a Ferrari often IS NOT the way to keep costs at a resonable level. Restore the 308... think you mean more mods by adding a Supercharger as all other mods are done
Hey Steve -- Long time no speak my friend I remember when we first met maaaannnny years ago the picture of you wearing nothing but a hat at Woodstock was fresh in my mind -- lol! I also remember how absurdly loud your 308 was! It made little V8 sounds like a Prius! In any case, it's great to see that the racing bug has really gotten a hold of you and hopefully I will see you on-track in the coming season (I've since upgraded from a C5 Z to a black C6 Z). As always, Steve is the voice of reason (and I am sure nobody is more suprised then him to learn this - lol)! Happy holidays! -N
LOL! Oh yeah, i kinda, sorta, in a watercolor way remember those daze, er, um, days <looks around, real innocent-like... but not fooling anyone with the innocent look> Why officver, this is the way i got the car. Really, it is. AWESOME CAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you attend SCCA or other sanctioned events? Plan to do SCCA, maybe MAARS, and other events. Frankly, my trailer will be my second home (literally). (Said in good humor) Dude, put down the hooka pipe a s-l-o-w-l-y walk away. Seriously, am just trying to be the best i can and have fun. Am about to leave home right now to pick up my new, custom Cargopro Series 3000 enclosed alu trailer. Think my <cough> hobby <cough> is getting deep. You too my friend. Look very much forward to seeing you at the track
