Miura, the original supercar | Page 11 | FerrariChat

Miura, the original supercar

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by joe sackey, Dec 5, 2006.

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  1. lambomiura

    lambomiura Formula Junior

    May 18, 2006
    646
    Canada
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    Philippe Muratori
    Hello Joe,

    That is good news about your book. I am surely looking forward to buy a copy! Do you have so far a hint about the format, no of pages, etc...?

    Best regards,

    Philippe
     
  2. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    Bull Publishing will release details in a few months...
     
  3. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    #253 joe sackey, Jan 15, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Ok, so here is Miles in a well-known image running errands in one of the Ferraris....the Miuras were for rather less sedate activity :)

    Joe
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  4. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 27, 2005
    535
    east coast
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    Craig
    #254 P400, Jan 15, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Joe, What build was the Miura to first wear the Lamborghini script on the tail? What prompted the addition? Of course many have been retrofitted with this script as well as many retrofitted with the front rivited (near fuel pump)chassis number plate.
    Put me down for a signed copy or 2 of the book.
    Miura madness
    Craig
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  5. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Craig, youre right, as the book will show, the early P400 did NOT have the Lamborghini badge to the right side of the driver-side tailight. Fortunately, some of them remain unmolested and still show that way today. What build was the FIRST Miura to wear that Lamborghini badge? Craig, cmon, that would be like asking an Italian how many hot plates of pasta hes had in his sweet life! LOL. Miura production trivia is rather less definitive than some might like it to be.
    As far as the chassis plates are concerned, my research shows that even the prototype cars (starting with a "0" chassis number) had ID plates, BUT, once again, nothing is definitive with Lamborghini. Maybe Luigi the ID-plate-installer was off the day the car was delivered - who knows? Ive seen a few early cars lately (0706, 0979, 1006, 1021, 1024 & 1045) and to my recollection I have images of all their chassis ID plates, retrofitted or otherwise.
    Joe
    www.lamborghiniregistry.com
     
  6. alberto

    alberto Formula 3

    Aug 25, 2001
    2,404
    San Diego
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    Alberto
    1021 was retrofitted. That was Gary's and my bad as we both thought all cars came with the plate. After looking at pictures of the Marriott car, and a few others, and that there is no evidence that the car ever had that plate (no holes filled, etc.) I have come to the conclusion that my car never had the ID plate near the fuel pump. I intend to remove it whenever I get around to redoing the paint on the car. To be fair, Gary's been used to working on SV's and some S's. Given the significant price rise in recent years of all Miura's, he's starting to see more P-400's. Also, the fact that mine is the earliest car he had ever worked on until that time, there were a few items that threw him off. Now that he has seen my car and the car immediately before it and a few other early cars, he's beinning to see that things which may have seem odd or not original to my car, are indeed normal for the early cars and in fact original.

    Alberto
     
  7. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    #257 joe sackey, Jan 15, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    So it looks like a case of owners seeing later cars and feeling something was missing. Very interesting....I must say the images of all the ID plates of the early cars Ive recorded all look different, and that explains it.
    The later cars have ID plates that are all uniform and the plates were in fact manufactured for Automobili Lamborghini by a firm called 'Pelloni' in Bologna. Gary makes exact duplicates for restoration purposes fastened by copper rivets (see image), but when he restored my 4884, in the spirit of authenticity, I elected to have him re-use the original ID plate as it remained perfectly preserved and corrosion-free.

    Joe

    Joe
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  8. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    Its worth pointing out that the Miura book is being published as a first edition. This allows for additional received wisdom to be included in a 2nd edition at future printings, and so on into the future.
    I was advised to ascribe to this by veteran author Karl Ludvigsen whose "PORSCHE - Excellence was expected" has gone through this very evolution over the past 20 years, turning it into a definitive work based on the collective input of Porschephiles everywhere.

    Joe

    BTW - Karl supplied me with never-before-seen images of the Miuras coming down the 'line at Sant Agata from his 1967 visit there. Thanks Karl.
     
  9. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
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    Mar 27, 2005
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    Craig
    This is not fair to place all the burden of trivia that should have been answered 40 years ago on Joe Sackey, so this is directed please to all Miura fans worldwide.
    in 1968 Bertone added 100 to the build numbers of Miura.

    Example would be #182 is stamped as #182 such in places as Miura are stamped.
    Example would be #202 is stamped #302 in such places.

    What Miura was the first Miura to be a 100+ build number?

    we think we know pretty close, but the 100+ numbers may not be based on production sequence but some other factor like date of manufacture.

    Miura #341 (241) does not have a Lamborghini tail script.
    neither does 322(222).

    good site for some reference is
    http://www.lamborghinimiura.com/PAGE1/chassis_plate.HTM

    Miura madness
    Craig
     
  10. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
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    Mar 27, 2005
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    Craig
    IMHO this photo does not appear to be an OEM stamped plate, but very nicely done. Besides looking like a new stamping, the font looks too big on the numbers to be OEM. This is just my opinion based on my own research. IMHO looks a little too smooth as well.
     
  11. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Youre too kind for relieving me of that enormous burden. LOL. But seriously, you are quite right on the basis of physical inspection. Please collate some of these pearls of wisdom and e-mail to me at [email protected] so I may cross-reference them with my findings. The book will always err on the side of caution and never make a declaration that such-and-such is so unless I have seen such or it can be proven beyond doubt by someone.
    Joe
     
  12. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Agreed. Exactly the reason I retained my ORIGINAL Chassis ID plate in the restoration.
    However if you are familiar with the ID plates of many SVs in particular, Gary's reproduction is damned close. Most of the Miuras he restores are SVs, although that picture is slowly changing. He is now booked 2 years in advance....

    Joe
     
  13. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    You will have to contact www.bullpublishing.com direct.

    Joe
     
  14. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
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    Mar 27, 2005
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    Craig
    How many Miura S models were produced with the "paddle" style rear body release system as opposed to the more common pin style?

    What Miura chassis was the first to have the additional bracing at the front cowl? did this coincide with the split flow prow addition or were they different chassis?

    What P400 was the first to have the later door panels fitted as opposed to the early circular window wind area?

    How many SV were fitted with Savara vapor control canisters?

    How many Miura were produced with BP products, how many with Agip?

    How many split sump Miura were produced from the factory?

    When did Pirelli produce its first CN12 series tire?

    Can anybody help with this ?

    Craig
     
  15. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Why do I get the feeling that at school you were the teachers pet showing off constantly with clever questions? Now the answers to all the questions your heart desires as set forth here would begin to make the purpose of a good book a little redundant, wouldnt it? One could be forgiven for thinking that perhaps youre doing dilligent research for a good book. LOL...In an attempt to satisfy your insatiable quest for Miura trivia, I couldnt resist answering at least one of your questions as I dont want to leave you hanging.

    How many P400SV were fitted with Savara vapor control cannisters? Answer = 21.

    Craig, my man, please be patient. The book will be out later this year in the format that we have decided to put it out. There will be an updated version in the future to include the pearls of wisdom learned and bestowed upon us by the likes of yourself, and others.
    However, the publisher and I doubt that most will want to read to determine on which specific day in 1969 was the very first air-conditioning unit installed in a Miura at Sant Agata, by whom, and why? Or, who at Bertone SpA made the determination what color the wheels & sills should be painted and which was the very first car to receive the aforementioned in gold?..... the book will be kept realistic.

    By the way, all your questions beg a question of their own...can YOU answer any of the questions youve posed on this thread? Now that would be being helpful, not least for the purpose of cross-referencing and because enquiring minds want to know. (Note: ask any 2 Miura experts a series of questions and youll always get some different answers) If you cant answer them here, theres always room for another good Miura book...

    Joe
    www.lamborghiniregistry
     
  16. omgjon

    omgjon F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 13, 2005
    3,569
    Spicewood, Texas
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    Jon Gunderson
    I just got back from 2 days at Barrett-Jackson. I don't think I could of taken another day of the American muscle cars. The highlight was a trip to GT Parts as I had personally never met him (only spent a fortune) and then to Bob Wallace's place. I got to talk to him about all the upgrades he does to he engine to make them safer, more reliable, perform better and last longer. He agreed to accept my engine in mid april. I hadn't planned on really starting anything yet as my hands are full with the Dino. But seeing I had the little fire in the carbs and can't drive it I thought I would do a few things. It's going to Bobileff's the first of Feb. to have the correct headlight put on, they currently are fixed. I got Bob to sign my Miura book and got to hear a few stories of the Miura development.
     
  17. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    He actually signed your book! Thats a first...
    Youre working with the right people.

    Joe
     
  18. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    #268 joe sackey, Jan 16, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  19. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,989
    Joe, as a fashion photographer and free-lance Art Director I say: nice, but not too much flashy!

    A cover is like a billboard: it has to "jump" on you! There are some photos from the 60ies/70ies that would perfectly fit for the cover of your book better than that one! Take a more radical one with a better grafical input!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  20. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    Walter dear,
    WHERE are your reading glasses?
    Did you see that I wrote: "This is NOT what the final production cover will feature" ......??
    Did you also read that this is just a "Promo Ad"....??
    Anyway, I suspect you will approve of the actual cover :)
    Joe
     
  21. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 27, 2005
    535
    east coast
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    Craig
    Joe, i am looking forward to the book. Most likely the best document on Miura since Coltrin/Marchet. It is is wonderful to have an actual long time owner, but better yet Joe Sackey Miura enthusiast, historian, restorer take on this book challenge and achieve it!
    Best regards
    Craig
     
  22. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,989
    Okeydokey....! It has to become gooooooooooooood!!!!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  23. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    I promise....
     
  24. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    Joe Sackey
    I am already getting a lot of messages for the Miura book. If anybody has an interest in getting a copy of the book, simply contact the publisher directly at www.bullpublishing.com and let them know what you wish and they will make sure it is supplied to you when it is produced late in the year.

    Thanks indeed.

    Joe
    www.lamborghiniregistry.com
     
  25. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    Thank you Craig, youre too kind by half.

    Joe
     

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