Saw a 355 that had valve guides updated to silicon bronze- any good? | FerrariChat

Saw a 355 that had valve guides updated to silicon bronze- any good?

Discussion in '348/355' started by andrew911, Feb 18, 2007.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. andrew911

    andrew911 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 8, 2003
    2,894
    Northern NJ
    Most threads I've seen recommend upgrading bronze to steel...are "silicon bronze" valve guides as good as an update as steel?
    What about "Phosporus (spelling?) bronze"?

    Also, are there different steel valve guides used (i.e. "sintered" steel)? What are acceptabile compunds to give the greatest chance of a perminent fix?

    Thanks-
    Andrew
     
  2. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
    U.S.A.
    Full Name:
    goth
  3. andrew911

    andrew911 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 8, 2003
    2,894
    Northern NJ
    Thanks for the link....although it didn't say if silicon bronze was better than or as good as steel. Actually, the page shows an iron valve guide used by the factory which were better than the early bronze guides....but now I need a lesson in what is best:

    * Silicon Bronze: as the company in the site you linked me to uses to update cars
    * Phsosporous bronze: which I read about in other threads
    * Steel (and/or sintered steel): which I thought was the proper update
    * Iron guides: as mentioned on the linked site as being the improved guides used by the factory in later 355s and 360s

    I know to look for paperwork of the valve guide update on any prospective car, but am not sure of the differences in the above guides.

    Thanks-
    Andrew
     
  4. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
    U.S.A.
    Full Name:
    goth
    Silicon Bronze has been "the" choice in p-cars since as far as I can remember. Though they do cost more.

    The iron guides are very "old" technology.... That is the material used on my 50+ year old triumph motorcycles.

    Steel is the "cost effective" fix Which is a reason ferrari went that route.
     
  5. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    37,213
    Cowboy Capitol of the World
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Sintered iron guides like the material now provided by Ferrari is probably the best material offered by a small margin but the only guides made in that material are from Ferrari at a cost in excess of $50 each. Using my basic math skills for 40 guides that amounts to a pile of money. Then you have to consider that those are not all that well made and using them will mean compromises in the quality of the valve job. For a small fraction of the price of OE guides you can get top quality silicon/manganese/bronze. It is an outstanding material for the job.

    Valve guides are like hamburgers, you get what you pay for. Not all bronze guides are created equal.
     
  6. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways

    OK, I'm almost afraid to ask, but what was used for the 348 valve guides, and were they ever a systemic problem in that model for any particular reason?
     
  7. louthancomp

    louthancomp Karting

    Feb 9, 2007
    87
    Salem, Oregon
    Full Name:
    Robert Louthan
    speaking in terms of domestic heads I've done over the years, for example a 350 Chev, my guide of choice is the K-Liner which is a Phsosporous bronze liner. I've had heads come in for a freshen-up after 100K miles and the K-Liners I installed are still within tolerance. That's a good valve guide.
    In the standard replacement hard bronze guides the two common choices are silicon bronze and manganese bronze. It's been my experience that the silicon bronze is not near the quality material that the manganese is and the silicon bronze will not live as long. They look the same and machine the same, I wish I knew what the chemical difference is.
    No matter what guide you use, remember it is only as good as the guy putting it in. There are still shops out there using dull reamers and fitting them using the go-no-go method. Run the other way!!
     
  8. bayareaferrari

    bayareaferrari Formula Junior

    Dec 19, 2004
    672
    California
    What were your findings on Phsosporous bronze guides?
     
  9. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
    U.S.A.
    Full Name:
    goth
    Sounds like good info to me!!
     
  10. andrew911

    andrew911 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 8, 2003
    2,894
    Northern NJ
    Thanks Brian, Oz and others for the info. Guess the car I saw did have a good update with the silicon bronze guides (assuming properly installed of course).

    -Andrew
     

Share This Page