When is it gonna stop?

Nissan's website lists the lightest Z350 at 3339 lbs. Still looks to be a porker to me. Even the base US Lotus Elise is just under 2100 lbs at 1984.

Now give me a 400 hp Elise & maintain that weight...drool!

 

The HP wars will not end till car manufacturers come to a tacit or explicit agreement.

And even that probably won't last. The best model of this sort of agreement was found in the Japanese market - their "gentleman's agreement" limited HP (or PS, as they would call it) to 300. Still, after a while, manufacturers started cheating, with some deliberately understating their power claims to pay lip service. Now, the agreement is pretty much over with, with JDM manufacturers openly making cars with more than 300 hp (the new Evo X will have 320 hp and the new version of the Nissan GTR will definitely have more than 400 hp). Top speeds are still electronically limited to 180 km/hr, but circumventing that's easy.

The main problem with the unchecked growth in engine output in production models is the concomitant nanny-features needed to allow the average driver to control the car. *That's* what takes the fun away.

 

It will stop when it becomes unfashionable.! It's already happening with the marketing of "Green" in all aspects of our lives' From hybrid cars to organically grown foods to Al Gores B.S. on global warming.
When you buy a vehicle of any type, be it automobile, motorcycle, etc. you are simply buying an extension of the persona you want to project as an individual, i.e.: "Hey look at me I'm different, I'm powerful or conservative, humble, sporty, tough, beautiful," etc. It's no different than fashion and the clothes you wear to send signals to others of what you want them to believe you are.
If you drive a powerful or energy consuming vehicle when there is an energy crisis or perceived crisis you will be labeled a selfish, pretentious, over consuming 'A'hole, not a comfortable or fashionable situation to be in when out in public. Just as if you were being driven by your chauffeur in a Rolls or Bentley during times of recession or depression.
Look to the past to see the future, the automobile has and always will follow economic conditions and fads of the day.
The (trend) of powerful will go the way of all trends, it will fade away only to return another day with a new face and the changing winds of time, the cycle will repeat it'self.
The next trend of power will be measured in volts and wattage not horsepower.

 

What I'm about to say is entirely sacreligious given the venue, but for the money, I think it's hard to beat a 2001 BMW M Coupe / Roadster for a driver's car. Light, responsive, 325 BHP, 353 Nm (261 ft-lbf) of torque and a 0-60 somewhere in the 4.5-4.7 second range depending where you look. Not Ferrari numbers, but then again, this is something you can purchase for 22k and never have to dump any serious money into it. A fun little 2-seater, restricted to about 130 mph (unless you upgrade software), and you can really run through the gears (5 speed manual only) without having the problem of driving 180 mph to get to 5th gear.

 

Actually, if they're accurate, those are Ferrari numbers until you get to the modern (360/430) cars. The sound a bit optimistic, though.

 

Good question what did happen with motorcycles? They had their HP war mid 80's thru mid 90's. They had 2 valves per cylinder, 3 valves, 4 valves, 5 valves. You had to buy a new bike every season to keep up with technology, then it just seemed to end. I remember Honda advertising 0-60 speeds of less than 2 seconds and Suzuki advertising better power to wieght ratios than an F-15.

 

It didn't, you just stopped looking at them.
The new 1000cc bikes put out 150 to 170 HP, and it does not take much to get them to put out 180 at the rear wheel. (basically, a pipe and a chip)

 

Even Clios now have 200hp..

 

Anyone else think it's still fun to have a slower-midrange car on the street? You actually get to run it up to redline in a few gears w/o being arrested. lol Something like a slightly modded Mini Cooper S or elise or boxster.

 

What's with all the retarded threads lately?

You can drive a 1,000 hp car safely and if you pay $250,000 for it, it's most likely built very well.

You can also drive a 125 hp car safely and if you pay $20,000 for it, it's most likely built very poorly.

Take both cars to 200 kph and guess which one I would rather be in for a crash???

This thread blows. Someone else who gets a hint of "the future" or "leading edge" and just has to post. These questions have been asked and answered 30+ years ago.

 

It will end when no one can afford it, Al Gore stops selling "carbon credits," hollywood stops its hypocrisy; or, you and I stop talking about it.

 

Good point...The drivers test here is a joke compared to Italy (and maybe Europe in general). Driver age is higher, therefore, less tenage arrogance/bad judgement on the road, etc. Also, 90% of Italians drive a manual shift, automatics are relegated to the disabled/elderly, etc, so the driver is more connected with the road, not the cell phone/donut/coffee/etc.

 

Yeah, but this can go around up to a point. Then, we still had , say, abundant petro (crude), the scare was as a result of collusion between the opec players. Now, we are 30 yrs later, and consuming petro at record levels....we ARE running out (uh oh, am I gonna get in trouble(smiling)?) There are no more easily accessible petro fields left, the world's oil fields are at or near capacity, and, look at China (did I scare you now?). Yup, scaaaaaaaary. Why, even the UAE is trying to phase out of the oil business cuz THEY KNOW!

Hey, this is just what I hear/read. I wish gas were 95 cents again.

 

I agree, you can drive any hp car safely. It's up to the driver.

 

Bugatti Veyron hit the magic 1000bhp but many believe this will never be repeated in a production car (political incorrectness, cost (I think they lost around 2million Euro per car in R&D costs), and just because now that milestone's been reached there's not much point anymore.

 

The hp race is in fact getting stupid, faster cars and more congestion, higher and denser populations. There is also a weight issue. My 360 feels light on it's feet, the newer Ferraris (599 for example) border on MBenz weight. Sure they are fast but with all the microchips and sheer weight I think Ferrari is heading down a dark path. Engine, brakes, 6speed and light weight is what makes these cars great. Ferrari should enroll in a Jenny Craig program then they wouldn't need 650hp to push these cars. Just my humble opinion.

 

I suspect it will come to an end when the insurance companies simply stop insuring them. As I recall, that was one of the factors (along with emission standards) that helped end the muscle car era.
John

 

If the GAS prices keep rising this high powered motor vehicles might set their standards to a lower limits of power.

 

I think there will always be sports car guys willing to pay for horsies, although I'm looking for a more economical daily driver this summer.

 

I like this post.

 

Exactly, I sold my last street bike because it was just stupid quick (06 GSXR 1000) with a pipe we had over 170bhp, and it weight was less than 400lbs.
On hard accel you could not hold on, it was trying to pull itself out of your hands, while I would be all over the front trying deperatly to keep the front from looping out. Stupid.
As for the cars, at some point a nanny-state government will impose a BHP limit for road cars. Germany did it with bikes a few years ago (100bhp), but i think that has now gone. The speed limit thing didnt work in the Farther land either, Benz, BMW, Audi etc all signed on for 155mph limit, Porsche said F*@# that and still did what they do.
As has been said, free market forces will take care of the problem, I cannot wait for a 1000hp mass production hybred street car

 

I love the horsepower wars.

I love high power cars. We're living in a golden age of performance right now. It's a great time to be a car enthusiast.

I know quite a few people with 1000+ hp cars. If you're careful and treat them with respect, they can be a lot of fun.

As for safety issues, I'm a lot more afraid of the soccer mom in the minivan yakkng on her cell phone than I am of the sports car enthusiast driving an "overpowered" car.
99% of traffic safety issues could be solved if people would stop thinking of driving as something you do while you're also doing something else. Multi-tasking is great if you're sitting in your office or home. It's got no place behind the wheel of a car.

 

I agree with this. I missed out on the muscles car era and had to grow up in the 80's and 90's with no horsepower. I'm glad the horespower craze is here because if I choose I can go get a 600 hp Benz! I can't wait, in about 5-10 yrs there will be alot of 5-600hp cars to play with for a measly 10-15K. Probally about that time the Government will have taken over and all the new cars will be limited to 400 hp like Japan did for a while(276hp).

 

I was recently the recipient of a track day ride in an F355. I was gobsmacked at the speed at which the racing driver was driving it! When I asked him what modifications had been done to the car, he replied "bone stock". And that was a ten year old design!