Is Porsche overhyped?

I don't think anyone here is arguing that Boxsters and Caymans can't corner quickly, or that there's anything wrong with a mid-engine setup. Some are saying that they're boring to drive. That has very little to do with a car's performance. But everone has different preferenes, of course.

 

I wasn't really addressing those folks who say they are boring; people like what they like. Nothing to really debate. But I was responding to the "911s are the only Porsche worth having" sentiment that seemed to surface in a few responses.

 

I think the engineering department is good at making cars that average drivers can go very fast in, and in comfort. A lot of us have Ferrari as a reference point, which for most car buyers is too loud and too hardcore. For a daily driver - which is what Porsche wants to be (and Ferrari couldn't care less about...) - their cars seems like a good balance.

Porsche has actually been very savvy in how it designs/builds/sells cars. The profit probably stems from the Boxster/Cayman/911 sharing a ton of engineering and parts (and the Cayenne development costs having been absorbed in part by Volkswagen).

As far as the 996 cab, I drove a couple. Not a glory moment for Porsche.

But Porsche (at least on the Boxster and 911) clutches tend to be nice. I'd guess if the Cayman you had was a loaned car it might have had mechanical issues.

 

I started with Porsche in 1969 with a 911T Targa, new from dealer. I have a 993 now, (7th or 8th Porsche depending on how you count the one I traded for an airplane and then bought back from the guy). The 993 is a 1996 with 92,300 miles, my daily driver. I have not much of any inclination to change it for a 996 or 997, except maybe a little thing for a GT3.

So, I guess that I am an "air cooled are the only Porsche worth having" guy. Here I include such oddities as the 4cam 4cylinder models, the 9146, the 959, etc; but in general, the water-cooled or front-engine models leave me cold. Mid or rear, 911 or not, this does not a real Porsche make. The cooling fan does.

I think that both Ferrari & Porsche have the name they do because they have built it on a truly great past history of road cars and racing success. It is surely up to each make to not blow this great heritage in the future.

I personally do not think V8 SUV's badged up from a VW model, 4 door mini-sedans, and such enhance the Porsche reputation.

However, you could also make the point that the Caymen S is a lot closer to the old beautiful Dino 246 in concept and excecution than anything that Ferrari has yet leaked with its Maserati-based sketches...although I guess Porsche would tell you they were inspired by the old 904 racer.

Overhyped? Well all three - Ferrari, BMW, and Porsche sure get their share of the auto press.

James

 

I think this sentiment arises because the Boxster is a bit like a movie that doesn't live up to it's trailer. It wears the Porsche badge, but doesn't deliver like you'd expect.

And with Porsche expanding their line to SUVs which seems very un-Porsche-like no matter how much power they have, people are probably more drawn to the 911 because it's been around forever--and for the most part it hasn't changed too much. They're still reliable, fast, great at cornering and all around just fun to drive. People will buy what they know, and people know the 911.

 

I have owned BMW M6 ,Ferrari 308 ,and Porsche 911.
Of all the 911 was the most interesting and reliable.
If you want bang for the buck as in new. Get a Corvette.
The BMW was the most "overhyped".
I ended up with an NSX. Now thats the ticket.
PS; looking for a 993TT or GT3 as well.

 

james...i really like your comments as they are spot on! especially the dino comments. you are soooo correct on that count.

william h...yes...917...there is nor ever will be anything that even comes close!!!!!!!!!

 

The GT3 is the only 911 I would consider to replace my Boxster. But I would still miss the convertible aspect a lot; possibly too much.

 

That is so true. If you want a workout try taking a 930 around the track. If you really want to get a good feeling of the car I would suggest to try a GT3 out. I agree the clutch of a 996 Turbo is a little soft and not much feel, but it such a good all around car that won't get you physically tired.

 

I don't think Porsche is overhyped at all. IIRC Porsche has won more overall races than any other automotive manufacturer (yes even more than Ferrari).

As for modern Porsches being soft there is some truth to that but all you need to do is set them up right.

I own a 99 996 (the only year with LSD) that has JRZ 3 coilovers- Kinesis lightweight K28R's- SSK- PSE exhaust- Rear seats removed- GT-3 seats- Spare tire removed and a LWFW among other things.

I can tell you this car handles quite a bit better than my 355 and my brothers 360. It weighs 2700 lbs and has 325BHP it runs 0-60 in the mid to low 4's depending on how you launch it and will top out near 175 MPH.

If the motor frags a new motor installed is only $10 K, no timing belts and a bargain to maintain compared to a F-car.

Porsches are wonderful, robust, performance cars that you can beat on and not worry about them breaking.
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Well, that is nice to hear kind words. You would have to put on your kevlar shirt & pants to post my aircooled rant on the Porsche site I go to - they are about 10 to 1 or more 996 and 997. About like us with 360/430 vs. Testarossa.

However, it is interesting to see how many guys with a 997 Turbo on their avatar are coming over into the 993 column and asking about prices; "just to have something to get back to the old-time feeling".

But I am sort of taking the fifth on the "overhyped" point of this thread...the original poster seemed to be comparing the CaymanS to current M3 (he prefers the M3 and complains the mags like the Cayman)...and I haven't driven either. I don't think he meant "back into history", per se.

So, I may have been a little off topic.

 

After two M3s, 3 996's including a GT3, a 997S, a 360. . . I'm impatiently awaiting my new GT3.

The new 911 chassis is an engineering tour de force. The dimensions of the car make it much more personal or glove-like than my 360, yet has notably superior chassis feedback as you approach the limit. PAG outdid itself with it.

There's only one word to describe the Cayman: FUN. At first I was underwhelmed. When you test drive a car, most car nuts like myself tend to get caught up on power (or lack of). But when you live with one for a spell (I borrowed a friend's for 2 weekends), you realize the brilliance of the chassis. It turns in like a housefly. Elise like in reflexes w/o all the kit car compromises.

While today the 911 remains the best of breed in PAG's lineup, I'm not so foolish to think that one day the a Coxster-derivative will replace it. If there was a GT/RS version of it available today, I'd own two.

Ferraris are great, but the brilliance of the new 911 chassis brought me back to Porsche.

 

I think Porsches are very cool... I just personally have no desire to own one. For my next car I was going to get a 911, but now I think I would rather a BMW 650ci.... unless I could afford an AMV8.

 

Porche is the most successful car company in the world and for good reason, they produce cars that are very driver friendly, agile and powerful and by the way extremely stylish. I own a warmed over Boxster S and I drive it more than my 550 because its so much damned fun to drive. I have never driven a car that handles as good and I am so in love with this little car that I am going to buy the Cayman S and sell my Boxter to my son or daughter just so I can drive it once in a while. If I gave you the keys to my Boxster for a week, I would have to wrestle you for them back.
Now thats not hype, thats just pure customer satisfaction and going back for more.

 

Indeed. Boxster and Cayman are some of the most underrated sports cars on the planet. Porsche reliability, durability and heritage along with a mid-engine configuration. Tasty.

 

Probably the most moving story from a stand point of what it really means to have a true sports car .






PORSCHE PASSION




by Taryn Maxwell




Many current Porsche owners dreamt of owning this metal-and-fire power icon of engineering their entire lives. From the moment they saw the unmistakable curve of the body speeding down the street, they knew they would do anything to get behind the wheel of one of their own. For Geoff Roberts, executive vice president of Houston-based Centurion Exploration Co., it was never about Porsches, it was about Ferraris. Until the day he discovered he didn't fit.

“When I sold Houston-based advisory firm Madison Energy Advisors in October 2000, I decided one of the things I always wanted was a red Ferrari 360,” he says. “I had never been in one, I had just seen them driving down the road and read the reviews and it was my ultimate dream car. I went to the dealership, I found the Ferrari I always wanted, I asked the guy if I could get in it, he said sure, and I couldn't. I didn't fit.”



For the 6'4” Roberts, his first time behind the wheel of his dream Ferrari was a painful experience, not just physically, but also emotionally.



“My knees were banging against the steering wheel and my head was tilted to the side,” he says. “I walked out of there just heartbroken because that was my dream car. Although I'd never driven one, it was one of those pipe dreams.”



Roberts got behind the wheel of his first Porsche in 2000, soon after his Ferrari experience, with the purchase of a 2001 silver Porsche Twin Turbo. When he lowered himself into the seat of this dream car, Roberts found he fit beautifully.

“It was a supercar, but it was also practical,” he says. “It had luggage space and you could actually go on a trip in it with more than a briefcase. You could drive it every day. It fit like a glove. It was beautiful. Germans are bigger people, so they make their cars for bigger people. There was plenty of head room, plenty of shoulder room, plenty of hip room and it was a done deal.”




Following Roberts' first Turbo purchase, he realized he had committed a crime in sports-car driving: he had purchased a Porsche with automatic transmission.

“Porsche's automatic transmission is called Tiptronic, and it uses pushbuttons on the steering wheel, much like Formula 1 racers (and most Ferraris),” he says. “It's a very cool technology, allowing for lightning fast shifts while driving hard. I tried it for a year, but it just isn't as much fun as ‘rowing your own' with a stick.”

Believing a sports car without a stick was “a crime against nature,” Roberts trekked back to the dealership and requested his exact same Porsche Turbo with a manual transmission. After driving this Turbo for less than a year, Roberts took it in for service and discovered the Porsche Boxster.



“When I took the Turbo in for service, they gave me a cheap little Boxster to drive,” he says. “It wasn't even a Boxster S. In five minutes of driving that thing out of the dealership on my way home, I had more fun than I'd ever had in my Turbos. The Boxster is a little, perfectly handling car with a convertible top that is perfectly balanced. It handles like a dream and it's light and it's quick, and it's just a total blast to drive. It's like a toy that goes like hell.”



Roberts found he had to take his Turbo on special trips where he could get it up to 140 miles per hour before he could really appreciate all it had to offer. But just driving around Houston in the Boxster going 60 or 70 miles per hour, he discovered he was having a blast.



“I went home and thought, ‘Can my ego withstand getting rid of a killer twin turbo monster car and getting a silly little Boxster, even though it's more fun to drive and that's all I want the car for is to take on fun drives?'” Roberts says. “Eventually I just said, ‘Screw my ego, the whole idea here is to have fun driving a car.' It was a little bit challenging to take such a big step down in price and prestige and testosterone, but the Boxster is so much more fun to drive.”



Roberts' unexpected love for the baby of the Porsche family led him to trade in his Turbo, for which he received a big check and a 2001 red Boxster S, a car he kept for three years, which amounted to a personal record. He only traded that Boxster in when his wife began to go on driving trips with him and he discovered having both parents of his three kids in the same car going 130 miles per hour made him a little nervous.



“If I went alone and did something stupid, my wife would still be there to take care of the kids,” he says. “Now that we were both going to be in the car, it kind of changed the rules. So we traded in the red Boxster S for a brand-new, seal grey Boxster S, which is the same basic car with extra safety features.”

Now Roberts gets to enjoy one of his favorite things in life with his wife—his annual tour of the Ozarks he takes each November with a large group of Porsche drivers. The trip is designed to give the drivers the opportunity to drive like maniacs for six days through Arkansas and Missouri . To avoid trouble with the authorities, the drivers make a strategic yearly donation.

“We donate $5,000 to $10,000 per year to the Arkansas state police,” Roberts says. “Then, we call them a couple of days ahead of time and say, ‘We're coming, just thought you'd like to know.' They leave us alone as much as they can. But if we do something really stupid or really blatant, we still get to the next town and find a cop waiting for us.”



After taking his Porsches on a couple of Ozark trips, Roberts found himself perusing the Porsche Club website when he ran across Boxstoberfest, a yearly trip taken by Porsche Boxster owners to Fredericksburg and through the winding roads of the Texas Hill Country, a region Roberts says boasts the most superb driving opportunities in Texas. Roberts hopped in his own Porsche Boxster and sped off to Fredericksburg , marking his entrée into the Houston chapter of the Porsche Club, a club he is heavily involved with today. Though he says he enjoyed his first Boxstoberfest, it wasn't long before Roberts found a way to customize the event for his own driving style.




The Porsche Boxster



“Two years ago, a bunch of us were sitting around the first night of Boxstoberfest, drinking beer and talking about what a shame it was we had to go slow through these beautiful roads,” he says. “So I decided we would make the morning drive with everyone else, then for the afternoon drive, we would break off and find our own way and go as fast as we wanted to. Two of the four of us crashed that year (not me), but ever since, I've led a high-speed group.”



Often, the biggest problem Roberts and his wife run into in the high-speed group is other wives.



“When we get back from the high-speed trip, there are always a couple of wives that relented and allowed their husbands to drive with us,” he says. “By the end of the trip, those wives are furious. They're mad at their husbands first and then they're mad at me. They'll even get mad at my wife because she's condoning it, sitting there very calmly running at twice the speed limit.”



Roberts and his wife take several trips with the Porsche Club every year, including Boxstoberfest and the Spring Tour, which Roberts and his wife coordinate, and various weekend and day trips, some of which the Robertses coordinate as well.

“This year, we went to Marble Falls , Texas , and we toured around Highland Lakes ,” he says. “It was a blast. My wife and I coordinated it, which means we picked the hotel, we picked the restaurants, we picked the route and we decided when we were leaving, coming back and how we were getting there. It's a lot of responsibility, but it's a lot of fun. When we lead the ride, we get to dictate the speed. If you want something done right, do it yourself, but I work really closely with guys in the club that have coordinated rides for many years because I don't want to do anything that's going to be unpopular with the group.”


When Roberts is not driving his Porsche around Texas with other members of the Porsche Club, he satisfies the cooped-up feeling he gets from driving the speed limit for weeks on end by jumping in his Porsche and getting out on the open road.

“After two or three weeks of driving the speed limit, I have to go out,” he says. “There's just an adrenaline rush and the pure excitement of pushing something to the edge. It's an athletic effort combined with the limits of the machinery. There's a reason for the tired, old phrase, ‘The need for speed,' has been used so often. Some people just have to go fast.”

 

Wow, a story very close to my own. Had an 01 BoxS, eventually got an 02 TT, traded in both for a RUF Boxster. Okay, I wanted a LITTLE more power than stock. lol But still the same brilliant chassis. And it isn't even close to being worked hard by my 360+'ish HP.

But obviously no one car is all things to all people. Hence this thread (although I suspect the gent that commented about car guys keying on power when test driving is a large part of the answer).

 

Forget the Chickster, that guy should have just traded his Turbo in for a Miata. The pussification of the American male continues.....

 

Spoken like a true example of the sub-species of the American male for whom the vast majority of their self-worth is determined by their car. lol

 

Adrift, totally insightful response designed to counter excessive excreations of falate expression.

 

Beat me; kick me; hurt me. I thought this was about Porsche, not the battle of the sexes. May we attempt at least some condescending return to the subject at hand? Thanks in advance.

 

Leaving aside the marketing hype, the water-cooled business and the entry into the SUV and sedan markets, I think your experience is colored by your expectations. If you wanted kick you back in your seat acceleration, I don't think you'd find that in the Cayman/Boxster S. What those cars do have is a lovely balance. I recently had a Boxster S for a week on the PCH, navigating the twists between Moro Bay and Carmel- I could not have been happier. It was the perfect car for the road, lithe, tossable, and what it lacked in sheer torque was more than made up for in balance and size.
I had a 996 GT2- was an animal that would give you the thrills, like the older Turbos. But, still a bit sterile for such a high priced car, and some of the interior bits were downright cheap. But, in terms of acceleration, and braking, it was a blast.

I have driven the 997S and the Carrera GT at the Barber track in Alabama. THe 997S was no slouch, but the Carrera GT was probably the best car I have ever driven.
I currently have a 993 and find it extremely involving to drive. It is not 'fast' in the drag-racing sense, but the steering inputs, and overall character of the car, make it a true pleasure to drive on the twisties. I would think a 993 turbo would be a hoot.
Now, I have other cars- for sheer stupidity, the 6.0 Diablo is an event to drive, and once you get it rolling, it will accelerate in an impressive way. And, I have had a clutch of Ferraris, older and newer. All fine, fun cars. But, it is hard to find a better car that you can beat the **** out of, drive to the city, and have a blast on the twisties, and still not be out more significant dollars. Granted, it may not have the panache of some of the more exotic marques, but honestly, once you get over that, and you are not just looking for **** your pants acceleration, I think you start to appreciate just how good these cars are.
FWIW, the 993 replaced an M3, which while faster, was not as involving to drive.

 

What the heck does "condescending return to the subject at hand" mean? lol

And I hope you see the irony in your post.

RussianM3 Dude, you obviously have very strong opinions and preferences on the subject of Porsches, and consider the brand doomed based on a short drive of a Cayman, so forgive me if this is starting to sound like you just wanted a thread to bash Porsches, as opposed to discuss them.