Wanted to share my lessons learned with the Brotherhood. After 4 hours of frustration, I had an epiphany. The Wrong Way: I approached bleeding the clutch as I have bled brakes in the past: 1. One person pumps and then holds the pedal down. 2. Other person opens the valve, gets coated with brake fluid, closes the valve before the pressure runs out. 1 quart of Dot4 Synthetic later... ZERO clutch pressure. The Better Way: Went and got a clear hose, as instructed by other threads. Once attached, I repeated the first process. It was clear that there was little to no movement of fluid. The Way That Worked: Threw caution to the wind, topped off the reivoir, put the other end of the hose in a container and elevated it even or higher than the master cylinder. I then let my lovely wife pump the everloving heck out of the pedal while I left the valve open... wide open. After about 10 pumps I saw the fluid start to move, then tons of air came out. I heard the slave cylinder fill with fluid and there was pedal resistance. I just left the valve open until I saw a fairly steady stream then shut it again. The reason? Here's my theory: I suspect opening the valve and pumping vigoroursly gave enough flow CFM to prevent air bubbles from migrating back up the the crests of the tube. They rise slowly due to the viscous fluid, and if you can pump fluid out faster than they rise, the air comes out like crazy. Checked the resivoir, repeated the wild pumping. After about 3 pumping sessions, the big air bubbles were reduced to frothy fluid. At this point, I reverted to the pump, hold and bleed approach with the tube still on. After about 5 of those, the froth vanished and I have perfect pedal, engaging hard within about 3 degrees of rotation from pedal rest. I know the348.com recommends barely cracking the valve open, but I wanted to share my experience to help others, in case they have the zero pressure headache I had (due to slave cylinder seal failure). Had I used the hose, fast pumping and a wide open valve first technique, I'm convinced this would have been a 5-10 minute job. Your results may vary- I'm not a mechanic, I just play one in my garage.
Sounds like you had fun, I've just done mine and have got to recommend purchasing an ez-bleed kit, must be the best £15 ever spent, no hassle, air was out in no time with a good clutch peddle feel. One good tip I did get was to jack the rear of the car up around 11 inches, apparently it prevents airlocks somewhere. Also because it uses air to pressure up the system you only need one person.
Right on John! Thanks for the tip of leaving the valve open. I have bled my clutch and it was a PAIN! It does make it easier with the long clear tube, because you can see the air traveling through the fluid. With out the tube you're just guessing if all the air is out. Thanks again for the tip.
wonder if any one has tried to use an "ez bleed" kit to bleed the system on a Ferrari. I've used them on other cars and it seemed to be a really easy one man job. i kind of pressurizes the master cyclinder.
I use the $50 Motive power bleeder (pressurizes the systems and delivers new brake fluid into the reservoir) on all of my cars. Works like a charm. I change/bleed the fluid out of the clutch on my 355s whenever I do the brakes. Ridiculously easy - just attach the motive to the reservoir, fill with new fluid, pump it up. Then go to each caliper, attach the drain tube, open up the bleed screw, and all of the old fluid comes flowing right out. Same with the clutch. I can now do all four calipers and the clutch, including jacking the car up and removing the wheels, in about 20 minutes. vty, --Dennis
You guys are doing this the hard way. Just remove the front carpet in the boot, find the clutch MASTER have sombody pump the clutch a few times, bleed the master first by just cracking the line to remove the air. Once you have a nice steady stream, head on back to the slave and bleed as normal. 20 minutes and shes done.
I can see me accidentally kicking the line loose and power-spraying brake fluid all over my poor 348. Bleeding at master is interesting, since it is a high point. Is there a separate valve there? On a related note, what is the secret to removing the front carpet? I tried to remove it once while fixing my horn, but it was to no avail. Even with all the visible screws loose, the carpet held firm.
Can't understand why people have problems bleeding the 348 clutch. The method I have always used for bleeding is:- 1.Top up fluid tank 2.Pump clutch pedal with bleed nipple closed 10 times then hold pedal to floor. 3.Second person open's nipple, pump pedal another 10 times, pedal to the floor on last pump, close nipple. 4.Check pedal feel, repeat if required. Easy
You know, I wonder which of these methods would work the fastest. I still say you need the long clear tube connected to the nipple no matter what method you choose.
My friend and I tried for quite a while to bleed the clutch tonight. Finally resorted to this method which didn't work until we figured out to do it a certain way. Just pumping the clutch with this cracked just pushes air and sucks it right back in. While slowly pushing clutch crack this, when clutch is down close it. Let clutch up and repeat. After a couple hours this is what worked for us finally.
My mechanic had a hell of a time with this until we phoned Daniel at Ricambi to ask for solution which helped tremendously, we were not bleeding the system enough even though it appeared to be clear fluid no air there was still some air locks, we had to repeat vigorously to Finlay get it.
I just used the Motive Pressure Bleeder as many recommended here. The "European" model was recommended, and it seems to have worked out fine. If you have plenty of fluid, and suspect there still may be some air, you could keep bleeding until you're sure. I just used the bleeder as a pressure source, and kept the system reservoir topped up.
Two weeks and a 1/2 gallon of fluid later using the MOTIVE pump, the pedal finally came alive using your method. I can't believe how much air came out of the nipple. I am going to drive the car for a few days and then try your method again and see how much better it gets. Thank you so much for your suggestion and I wished I had seen your post earlier.
Dead head, staring on post #46, on page #2 of this thread https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/348-throwout-bearing-removal.372483/ Why not use a pressure bleeder, don't need any of the clutch pumping 2 person bleeding thing.
Being alone without a helper and using the Motive Power Bleeder, I attached the Motive to the resiviour @ 15psi, pumped the pedal, then held the pedal down with a rod and rubber block then opened the valve (with tube) watching for bubbles. The trick I found was to pinch off the power bleeder hose at the resiviour before releasing pressure so as not to introduce air back into the master cylinder.
I had some help with my daughter pumping the clutch pedal. I got a plastic hose, connected it to the nipple and ran it behind the car up into a container. I had her pump the clutch a few times and then open the reservoir all the way and Had her pump it about 100 times. At first they were bubbles and then slowly the bubbles when away, but when I closed the nipple, we still had no pressure on the clutch pedal. We did this about 10 times.
I just did an engine out service and it worked fine prior to the removal of the engine. I don’t see any leaks. There is legitimately no pressure on the pedal. New master cylinder?
Wrap a towel around the clutch master cylinder and bleed the master first by loosening the outlet fitting. Have a helper pump the pedal slowly a few times till you get the air out and re tighten the fitting. This worked for me as I had the same experience after my engine out maintenance. I'm sure a pressure bleeder would work great, but I didn't have one.....
Motive pressure bleeder at the reservoir. I have never had any problem with the clutch using that. 5 minutes is all she takes.
