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330 GTC Ignition Problem

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by 67GTC, Apr 12, 2007.

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  1. 67GTC

    67GTC Karting

    Dec 30, 2003
    88
    Westchester, CA
    #1 67GTC, Apr 12, 2007
    I've got a situation where the ignition switch has power in all positions. I can start the car, but it continues to run in the "off" position. When the key is removed, the guages are still on, as are other electrical ancilleries.

    The consensus on Tom Yang's site is that the internal contacts within the switch are shorted.

    Has anyone here had a similar problem?

    Thanks,

    Chuck
     
  2. Bob Zambelli

    Bob Zambelli F1 Rookie
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    Nov 3, 2003
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    Robert G. Zambelli
    #2 Bob Zambelli, Apr 12, 2007
    When the switch is turned on, a relay closes. Many years ago, I replaced mine with a Bosche relay.

    As I recall, when the ignition switch closes, the relay is energized and power goes to the fuse block.

    In any case, check the relay first - it's located just below the fuse panel.
    and much easier to replace than the key switch.


    Bob Z.
     
  3. ArtS

    ArtS F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,265
    Central NJ
    #3 ArtS, Apr 12, 2007
    Chuck,

    Before I replaced mine, I got really good at hotwiring my 330. Try it, it's fun AND will lead to an interesting conversation with the arresting officer if you ever get pulled over...

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
  4. 67GTC

    67GTC Karting

    Dec 30, 2003
    88
    Westchester, CA
    #4 67GTC, Apr 12, 2007
    Hi Bob,

    You bet I'll check the relay... The switch is extremely expensive to replace.
    Can you tell me anything more about the Bosch relay you used; specs or part number?


    Hi Art,

    The car starts fine, it just doesn't want to turn off. For now I just disconnect the neg battery cable while it's sitting.

    BTW, I replaced the red top Optima battery with a deep cycle yellow top Optima. It will be interesting how it performs in the GTC.

    Thanks,

    Chuck
     
  5. shaughnessy

    shaughnessy Formula 3
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    #5 shaughnessy, Apr 12, 2007
    There is such a thing as an ohm meter, rather than sideliners from the comfort of their living rooms, shooting fish in a barrel, TAKE MEASUREMENTS!

    And Happy Thursday to you all!!
     
  6. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

    Nov 2, 2003
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    #6 410SA, Apr 12, 2007
    out of Prozac Tommy? :)
     
  7. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
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    Nov 11, 2003
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    Brian Brown
    #7 Motob, Apr 12, 2007
    The switch is actually pretty cheap. It is the same switch as a BMW 2002. I used to be able to get them for $20 wholesale, but I think the BMW retail price is around $95 or so.

    The BMW part # for the switch is 61-31-2-682-120
    Ferrari part #7000707
    SWF#800.040
     
  8. John Vardanian

    John Vardanian F1 Rookie

    Jul 1, 2004
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    #8 John Vardanian, Apr 13, 2007
    Good info. Thanks Brian.
     
  9. 67GTC

    67GTC Karting

    Dec 30, 2003
    88
    Westchester, CA
    #9 67GTC, Apr 13, 2007
    Thanks Brian,

    That's great information on the switch.

    Chuck
     
  10. bill365

    bill365 F1 Rookie

    Nov 3, 2003
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    #10 bill365, Apr 13, 2007
    Now Tommy,
    Don't go getting techincal on us, you're starting to scare me. :D
     
    Oengus likes this.
  11. dbcooper

    dbcooper Formula Junior

    Feb 7, 2005
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    Costa Mesa,Ca.
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    Tim Romero
    #11 dbcooper, Apr 14, 2007
    Mr.Shaughnessy is spot on. Check the various blades and wires for voltage and take it from there.
     
  12. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
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    Brian Brown
    #12 Motob, Apr 14, 2007
    As Bob Zambelli stated, When the switch is turned to the on position, it sends current to the CEAM ignition relay located on the lower left side of the fuse board. The relay then closes and supplies power to all of the switched consumers on the fuse block.

    The connections on the relay are kind of hard to access, so it is easier to first check for power coming out of the ignition switch. Terminal 30 on the switch is power in from the battery, terminal 15 is power out of the switch to the relay. If you have power at terminal 15 with the key in the off position, then the switch is bad. You should be able to unplug the wire, and hear the relay click off.

    If there is no power at terminal 15 and the ignition is still powered up, then the relay is stuck closed. I have never seen this condition, usually when the relay has problems, it fails to close or has burned contacts.

    The switches are kind of crappy and go bad fairly often.

    If you have trouble getting under the dash, you can take the steering wheel off in a couple of minutes as it is only held on with six nuts.
     
  13. 67GTC

    67GTC Karting

    Dec 30, 2003
    88
    Westchester, CA
    #13 67GTC, Apr 14, 2007
    Brian,

    You've been a great help, thanks for sharing your knowledge on this. I got a replacement Bosch back of the switch yesterday and plan to install it this afternoon. I also ordered the BMW part you mentioned as a back-up.

    Thanks,

    Chuck
     
  14. 67GTC

    67GTC Karting

    Dec 30, 2003
    88
    Westchester, CA
    #14 67GTC, Apr 23, 2007
    (Cross-posted on T. Yang's site)

    My ignition problem turned out to be with the switch itself. It is attached to the key/interlock assembly from the back and is held on by two screws. The upper screw was missing and the switch was somewhat loose. The screws are very difficult to remove and even harder to reinstall, so perhaps the upper one was left undone intentionally by the last guy. I replaced the switch with a known good one and everything is running fine now.

    As Brian Brown noted earlier in this thread, the BMW 2002 uses the same switch. I ordered the entire switch/interlock assembly for $130.00 and found that the switch is the same but no longer a Bosch part, at least on the unit I received. The keyed part of the switch also looks to be the same, but the metal casting/interlock assembly is totally different. So, if you need the electrical switch component on the back, or the keyed part of the switch, the BMW piece will do the trick.

    Thanks again to all who responded!

    Chuck
     
  15. fasthound

    fasthound Formula Junior
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    #15 fasthound, Oct 29, 2023
    Bringing back an old thread…..

    Is there a solid state relay replacement for the CEAM ignition relay (1967 330 GTC)? I just filed/sanded the points and cleaned the connectors on mine, but would really love to replace it with something modern.

    I did a search on here, but came up empty. I may have used incorrect search terms, so sorry if this has already been answered somewhere and I missed it.
     
  16. ArtS

    ArtS F1 World Champ
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    #16 ArtS, Oct 30, 2023
    Here's an old, general discussion on Tom Yang's site: http://www.tomyang.net/cars/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=3832

    While I don't know the specs of the original relay, I expect there is a modern equivalent, of much higher quality, available.

    Regards,

    Art S.
     
  17. fasthound

    fasthound Formula Junior
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    #17 fasthound, Oct 30, 2023
    Thanks, Art. I just cross posted to that thread…just in case. Someone in that thread mentioned a Bosch relay, but didn’t have specs/part number for it.
     
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