Miura, the original supercar | Page 40 | FerrariChat
Buy

Miura, the original supercar

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by joe sackey, Dec 5, 2006.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

Page 40 of 821
  1. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    #976 2NA, May 27, 2007

    I was actually thinking more of things like bearings and seals than taillight lenses and door handles but I understand your frustration.

    I have a few taillight lenses and at least one amber/red. I'll look them over and let you know.
     
  2. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #977 joe sackey, May 27, 2007
    Right 2NA the mechanical stuff is what keeps the cars on the road, but the cosmetic stuff is also just hard to find in NOS 'as new' condition and therefore not inexpensive.
    We must also remember to keep things in perspective: these are Lamborghinis and ownership of them is never going to be inexpensive.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  3. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    #978 2NA, May 27, 2007

    I have a good used lens. No cracks or serious scratches should clean up well.
     
  4. shill288

    shill288 Formula Junior

    Feb 24, 2005
    900
    West Coast
    Full Name:
    Steve Hill
    #979 shill288, May 27, 2007
    I hope Lamborghini doesn't follow Ferrari's direction, but MBZ or Porsche's. When I can purchase a new production gearbox for a Gullwing for less than it costs to rebuild, that's my kind of program. (At least it was when I purchased it, I figure MBZ was going to figure out they priced that item too cheaply.)

    So everyone understands, Ferrari is not producing the parts for the vintage cars. It's companies like Sport Auto, Lunelli, etc. that are casting blocks, making the spare parts, etc. I don't know if Lamborghini will cast their own parts (which would be a step up from Ferrari's program) or whether they will just source them out.

    Lord knows that when I owned a Miura SV, Lamborghini could have cared less that spare parts were unobtainium. Ditto Ferrari.

    On the issue of getting things off of Fiats, etc. I've found going to recyclers and junk yards work great. I had to laugh when I found unobtainium Marelli fuel pumps for a Ferrari GTO on rusted out hulks of Maserati BiTurbos. I couldn't believe they used the exact same pump Ferrai wanted like $800 (each) for, if they had it. I purchased two working pumps, that are now on my GTO, for $50. Such a deal. And, I have correct Marelli pumps, not the Bosch pumps that most people modify to work when the GTO pump eventually gives up.

    I also raided a junk yard Alfa for a Ferrari Datyona unobtainium ribbed trunk gasket. No one makes reproductions of this. But, there it was, in good condition sitting in a wreck of a car. It's not any more.

    Steve


    Steve Hill
     
  5. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #980 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    Welcome to the Miura thread Steve. You were having Miura SV adventures when that variant was but a twinkle in some of our eyes.

    I am pretty certain Lamborghini will out-source parts remanufacture and in fact have found out they already have. With Lamborghini, as always, it depends who you are talking to. They also out-source their "factory restorations" too, even though a few years ago they made a big song-and-dance about in-house operations. However, I think the dedication by the factory to its "Museo Lamborghini" shows dyed-in-the-wool afficionados that they at least care about the heritage cars, even if they are not yet doing anything practical to help staunch enthusiasts keep them on the road.

    This has allowed certain restorers like Bobileff to create a sort of "Miura cottage industry" that covers rare parts stocked (for restoration customers only - their existence might be denied if you are not a customer!), parts re-manufacture, and full total restorations. I have been there when a call has come in from Italy looking for parts!

    Very cool 'junkyard' stories indeed, once again illustrating how committed and resourceful the owners of classic cars really are. I love hearing stories like that and they help to assure me that the lengths I have gone to find some rare Miura SV parts do not classify me as 'certifiable'. LOL.

    Im afraid that fate is conspiring against you (even as we write) to ensure that the use of past tense in stating "when I owned a Miura SV" is shortly to be properly rectified :)

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  6. phylotic

    phylotic Formula Junior
    BANNED

    May 20, 2007
    547
    US/EU
    Full Name:
    Gheorghe
    #981 phylotic, May 28, 2007
    Naturally, this is highly subjective, e.g., the Alfa 33 Stradale
    and LP400 would top the list for me (although the Miura interior
    is much nicer)
     
  7. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #982 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  8. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #983 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    Agreed. Even the title "Dream Cars" is a subjective topic. I can think of a half-dozen cars that should have been in that top ten list, 250 GTO and 288 GTO among them.

    BUt, I have to agree, the Miura SV as chosen by the premier classic car magazine worldwide, is number one...

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  9. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #984 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    According to recently published numbers by factory-appointed historian Stefano Pasini, Miura production broke down as follows:

    P400 - 275
    P400S - 338
    P400SV - 150

    The SV number includes 2 of the same car remanufactured so the real number is 148. Only 762 production numbers exist so these numbers are very close, although not spot-on accurate. This means that the P400S is the most common variant and the P400 not as abundant as once thought.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  10. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    #985 2NA, May 28, 2007
    These numbers do seem to depart from what we previously had been told. My understanding was that the P400S is the rarest variety.
     
  11. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #986 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    Let me say: I have NO way of verifying the P400 and P400S numbers and Pasini/the factory came up with them. I am simply parroting what the factory wants to tell you. I too thought just 140 P400S and I saw these numbers posted again yesterday (they were originally released at the 40th anniversary). This is factory's 'official' position.
    Note too that the 140-count for P400S comes from the Coltrin/Marchet book - renowned for its mistakes and inaccuracies....

    BUT, I do have in my possession the original factory SV production register and I can tell you counting down the list that there were 148 cars, about 8 of which the works subsequently modified to SVJ spec, leaving about 140 standard SVs. Even the 148 cars includes a few P400 and P400S cars upgraded to SV spec and assigned new production numbers by the factory.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  12. phylotic

    phylotic Formula Junior
    BANNED

    May 20, 2007
    547
    US/EU
    Full Name:
    Gheorghe
    #987 phylotic, May 28, 2007
    I think this is true of practically all Lamborghini designs vis a vis Ferrari's.

    Ferrari exudes 'racing' / 'exotic' yet rooted in reality
    Lamborghini exudes 'design' / 'fantasy' / almost a dream.

    Complements quite well the men's (e + f) personalities.
     
  13. ApexOversteer

    ApexOversteer F1 Veteran

    Feb 15, 2007
    5,968
    Smoky Mountains, TN
    Full Name:
    T.A. Bell
    #988 ApexOversteer, May 28, 2007

    Comparing the styling of a competition car built in 1963 to the styling of a nearly avant-garde road car of half a decade later just isn't fair.

    It can be argued that there just isn't anything to compare to the Miura. It was daring to the point of being ludicrous, bold to the point of being outrageous, almost obnoxious in it's visual impact. The car just assaults your eyes with it's shape. In 1967 the car must have seemed like a UFO coming at the uneducated. I have no problem imagining people actually being made uncomfortable with the car, upon seeing it in their rear view mirror at a stop light. There isn't one car made before the Miura, or even many made after it, that have the same ability to stun a viewer with it's styling.

    On the flip side of the coin, the 250GTO was nothing new, nothing special in 1963. The E-Type Jaguar was already two years old, and while similar in basic shape, is more beautiful, IMO. The 1963 Split Window Corvette comes out the same year and makes the 250GTO look almost chubby by comparison. Go back to 1955 and look at the Mercedes 300SL Gullwing and suddenly the 250GTO is pedestrian in it's styling before it was even designed.

    That is not to say the 250GTO is not a gorgeous car, just that it has a different kind of beauty, the beauty of purpose. There is nothing about the car, styling-wise, that isn't put there for a distinct and singular reason. The car was made for one thing and one thing only, to be raced. It was not intended to be beautiful, and as such it can never dream of being the aesthetic beauty that are cars designed to be visually striking.
     
  14. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #989 joe sackey, May 28, 2007
    Excellent review on the subject matter.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  15. Miura Jota

    Miura Jota F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2004
    3,632
    Toluca , Mexico
    Full Name:
    Martin
    #990 Miura Jota, May 28, 2007
    That reminds me of a Commendatore's quote :

    when the Old Man first saw the Jaguar E-Type he exclaimed :
    that's the world's most beatiful car !!!

    hence 2 years later the GTO resembled the E-type
     
  16. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #991 joe sackey, May 29, 2007
    He had not seen the Miura yet :)

    Which reminds me of what Gianni Agnelli said to his men at the Geneva Salon in 1966 when he dragged them over to the Lamborghini stand to look at the show-stopping Miura: "THIS is what we should be thinking about!!" he chastized.

    I think there was much gnashing of teeth in the halowed hallways at Maranello that year...


    Joe
    www.joesackey
     
  17. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #992 joe sackey, May 29, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  18. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #993 joe sackey, May 29, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  19. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #994 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  20. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #995 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  21. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #996 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  22. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #997 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  23. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #998 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  24. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #999 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  25. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #1000 joe sackey, May 30, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
Page 40 of 821

Share This Page