Opinions on this car

Miller Motors in Greenwich, CT has a blue '00 550 with 4500 miles. One owner, sold new there, all records, etc. Asking $135k plus $3.5k for Ferrari PT warranty.

http://ferrari.millermotorcars.com/preowned/

I'm going up tomorrow to check it out. I'll look for the 15k service, leaky cam seals and steering rack, shock actuators and the condition of the dash leather as well as the usual inspection. Anything else?

Assuming all is well, what should be my initial and final offers?

Thanks,
Mark

 

Good Luck dealing with Miller, they do not budge much on prices...If your looking for a great price you wont get it.but..They do have good cars BUT they are also difficult to deal with IMO.

 

Thanks. I don't mind paying something of a premium for a solid car. Bargain shopping is for lesser cars.

 

As you probably know, the trade-in price for such a 2000 Ferrari 550 with 4500 miles on it would be somewhere around $85k. So, instead of the usual $25k - $30k mark-up, you're looking at another $15k - $20k on top of that. However, because of the extra low miles, it could be worth it.

Also, the fact that it is eligible for the powertrain warranty, means that it has passed a 100-point-plus inspection (similar to a detailed PPI). So, that is, if nothing else, encouraging.

The key thing I would try to find out is how many miles were driven in the last 12 months. Hopefully there are service records every year, so check the mileage posted on one of those to verify the miles driven recently. My confidence in the car would go up if the car had been driven at least 750 - 1000 miles in the last 12 months. If almost no miles have been put on it, then there is the real potential for fairly large deferred maintenance bills during the first year of you driving it. Several $1k - $3k service items can show up on such an under-used car, e.g. servicing/recharging the freon in the a/c. But, if the car has been driven during the past 12 months, it is much more likely to be in prime shape when you take over. Even though it only has 4500 miles on it, it is still a 7.5 year old car.

Good luck.

Here is a pic of the car from the Miller website. I assume you're looking at this Nart Blue / Cuoio one, true?
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Yes, this is the car. Good point on the recent usage.

Mark

 

I'm sorry, no matter how nice the car is, $135k seems way too high.

However, if you love the car, go for it, its only money.

-dsd

 

I think it is $20K too high.

 

Have to agree, but it is coming from a reputable dealer and has that certified pre-owned status. It really depends on the new buyer's plans for the car.

If I were buying it, my plan would be to put 2000 to 3000 miles a year on it for around 5 years. So, that is 10k to 15k total miles on a 4500 mile car. So, in five years it would be approx. a 17,000 mile car. Paying the extra $20k would only be another $4000 per year in depreciation. That isn't too much in the grand scheme of things.

By the way, even though the current trade-in price is $85k, that type of car (that is, the Ferrari 550) is getting close to fully depreciated and that trade-in price won't likely go down much five years from now (even with another 12,000 miles on it). Five years from now, even with the extra miles on it, you'll be able to sell that car private-party for probably $95k - $105k.

Now, if you could talk them into a $125k to $130k selling price, all the better.

Good luck.

 

The truth is that it does seem like a lot of money for a 2000 550. The car should not sell for more then $110-$115K and that is top of the market.

There was a 2002 575 at the auction in West Palm last month that was bid up to $105K and the selling dealer wanted $125K. It was a Silver car with Dark Blue hydes...

They probably paid $100K for the car and are greedy pigs who can not be happy making $10K and need to make $25K....

My 02. cents worth...

Sam

 

I am not sure where you guys are buying your cars. I think the auction and wholesale only apply as guides for what dealers are paying. The retail market for the 550 you are looking at is somewhere from $115K-$125 based on miles and options.. Always pay a bit more for a car with options, records, and color.


I do not tend to see anyone selling nice 550's with or with out miles for under $100K. Maybe a 1997, but again rare. At least in CA

 

For what it's worth, here are average asking prices and mileage for all 12 550s listed in the most recent Ferrari Market Letter. They seem consistent with the prices in Dupont Registry etc (mostly the same cars anyway).

Averages
Year Asking Price Miles
1998 $119,000 12,800
1999 $120,600 17,646
2000 $121,750 13,200
2001 $141,625 9,152

All Years $127,667 13,308

I'll look over the car tomorrow. Thanks to all for your advice.

MB

 

Not to hijack the thread, but why is a 2001 worth $20000 more? There's a nice one at AutoGallery in LA with 6K miles and they are asking $149,900 which I thought was way high but is it?

 

I agree.

The 2000 and 2001 prices are pretty compressed. My model says the average good condition 2001 should be asking $132.75 with a transaction price of about $123K. A 2000 should transact at about $118K, give or take $5K for miles and current service, best color combinations. That is for a 2000, I think for $123K it would have to have low miles, the major service completed, great colors and you would have to absolutely love it.

But then go ahead.

 

Miller charges top dollar. I've always been treated well when I went in there but saw both very good, but surprisingly questionable cars in there as well, particularly for the money that they were asking.

You're paying through the nose for peace of mind- but that's not necessarily a bad thing to do, particularly if you are worried about repairs and it's your first Ferrari. A slew of unexpected, pricey repairs can definitely ruin the ownership experience for you and, after all, that's why you're getting the car; for the total ownership experience.

So, if the price doesn't bother you, even though you know that you could probably get as good a car for 10-25K less if you really went hunting and bought from a knowledgeable and conscientious owner, and you love the car, go ahead. What's important is that you do what feels right TO YOU.

Be aware of what the warrantee actually covers: it's important to know that there are many, many things that it does not!

Good luck and enjoy whatever car you end up with!

 

I can't comment on US pricing, but it looks like a nice car. Not sure about the blue leather on the dash and it's a shame it doesn't have the Scuderia shields. The 250GT stitching is a plus, though, and the piping is nice (same as in my car - a subtle but neat enhancement). It doesn't have the Daytona seats but those are the same as in my car and they are very comfortable.


Onno

 

Looked over and drove the car this morning. Very nice example. NART blue pretty with lots of metal flake. Cuiuo interior with dark blue dash and carpets very elegant.

Big service just completed including a/c recharge, belts and seals, 4 new tires, etc. etc. Front bumper repainted (I understand this is common) and repair to right quarter panel (unspecified damage)--all appear to be top quality work (inspected in strong sunlight). Drives very nicely--tight, tracks well, quiet w/ factory exhaust, clutch lighter than other 550s I have driven. Interior perfect including dash, airbag covers, hvac panel. All books, tools, battery tender, and service records back to purchase, but no car cover (said they'd find me one). No front plate bracket (does anyone put a front plate on a 550? NJ requires one).

Dealer very friendly even gave my 11 year old son a 10 minute spin to his delight.

Best price $132.5 plus cost of Ferrari warranty. Dealer provides 60 days/3k warranty.

The price doesn't bug me--the repair to the quarter panel is a concern however. I am going to ask for more details. Any opinions on a clear bra esp. after a repaint?

MB

 

No front plate bracket (does anyone put a front plate on a 550? NJ requires one)

"Honestly, officer, I bought one at the dealer but it's back-ordered from the factory. They make them by hand, you know."

I've always been treated well at Miller even though I haven't bought from them. I doubt their reputation is worth making a couple of bucks on a dodgy car. And anything Werner doesn't know about Ferrari isn't worth knowing. Best of luck.

 

How many of those miles were in the last 12 months?

Are you considering a PPI - perhaps a "yes, deal - subject to PPI", shows commitment to dealer but also gives leverage to you if find anything - meantime quietly check out 1/4 panel et al

If dealer denies PPI ? - & what about 120 day / 5k dealer warranty.

Many knowledgable 550 owners could tell you more by knowing exactly what was done on major?

Sounds good, but I ALWAYS prefer higher mileage cars or ones that have been recently driven & sorted...

Enjoy...

 

The car went through a Ferrari warranty inspection which included a compression test and looking through the service records on the major it seemed very thorough. I do want an independent inspection of the quarter panel work and I like the idea of negotiating a longer dealer warranty.

Thanks,

MB

 

Welcome.... - & it would be great if you could find out who the last owner was & have a chat - but I doubt the dealer would relish the idea of that one at all!!!

As for price, one thing to be born in mind is 203 area code I presume, is hardly the worst real estate / per capita GDP et al.

As a matter of course I'd always check the Better Business Bureau for any complaints on the dealer before handing over the cheque & V12 ing it away...

Good luck & let us know how it goes....

 

too much money considering the color combo , year and the mileage. you can buy an 02 575 F1 1800 miles including the major service done by an authorize ferrari dealer for $160K. plus the fact that the 575 is a much better all around car

 

This is a highly polarised opinion that plenty of people would disagree with, including myself. The 575, particularly in '02 before the Fiorano pack came out, is a softer car than the 550 and in my opinion certainly not a "much better allround car". I personally prefer the stick shift above the F1 as well and so would always choose a 2001 550 over a 2002 575 F1. The 160k price you quote for an example with 1800 miles only is very low, though. I haven't seen them for that price but if you can get one it is certainly a great car for the money. Just not as good as a similar 550 for less money, and depreciation will be more on the 575 as well.


Onno

 

Having just bought a 575, I can say the prices are between $140 and $165 for Manual or F1, non-gtc.

-dsd

 

Upon a second inspection, I found a 1/4" gap in the fit between the passenger door (the door stuck out) and the quarter panel undoubtedly from the quarter panel repair. Too bad, otherwise it was a terrific car.

I'll keep looking. BTW, they dropped the price to $130k.

MB

 

This is what gets me. How can Miller charge top dollar and put the car on the market in less than optimal condition?

As I mentioned in one of my previous posts, I was surprised, considering their reputation and the prices at which they post their cars, at the condition of some of the cars on their lot.

It seems they want Neiman-Marcus prices for a WalMart presentation. I mean really, how much trouble would it be for them to have set that car right? Surely they have arrangements with competent body shops.

It just goes to show you that in the Ferrari world, you don't always get what (someone wants you to) pay for!

Caveat emptor. I think someone's best bet in Ferrari-land is to buy a well cared for car from someone who they can trust- preferably from someone with a history on this Board. A fair price for a good car with a documented history -and the colors you want.