or Ferrari have been very, very clever and found a way to turn a poor season around by setting this all up. Conspiracy theoriotis (sp?) get your teeth into that one Personally I don't care what McLaren did ... the racing has been great, and this season is finally a battle. The only negative is LH has got a wee bit too much of a head start to make it a battle for the rest of the season, but I might be wrong and I think Alonso and Kimi have found that missing speed so that will push LH back a bit, especially if Massa gets involved too. I say lets get back to racing ... and Ferrari should buy a safe or something Pete
No matter what actually happened, I really HOPE that the FIA doesn't dock points or suspend McLaren from future races. That would RUIN one of the best F1 seasons in years... for Ferrari to win over technicalities would be really stupid. Let them race!
I can't believe you people that are saying there should be NO penalty for frigging cheating !!! are you lot off your dial ??!! or just bloody McL apologists, either way this makes me mad, nobody here has one misgiving if Ferrari was at fault, all ready to roll over and take it like a weasel but RD and his evil hordes have perpetrated some foul actions and because a few weekend warriors like watching races we forgive this evil bastard, well no way !! IF, they are at fault here like Honda was with the fuel tank for example, or Schumacher was at Benetton, or lots of other indiscretions by many others in the past, then the same applies to McL. Bugger this "let's see a good racing season" crap, the only reason they are looking goodis because they KNOW what Ferrari are going to do, if you knew your football opponent was going to throw long EVERYTIME they had the ball then you stack the long plays, these guys knew the end game, you call that fair ??!! Hopefully all the sponsorship people will take note and move to better fields (NOT FERRARI)
+1 If Ferrari win both championships because of Mcl getting hacked, I wouldn't feel like it's an underserving win at all, because if Mcl get's hacked it's because they CHEATED. I just hope after it's all set and done the FIA make public the extend to which Mcl broke the rules, so as to not leave any unanswered questions for the history books.
I would imagine if the allegations of any corporate complicity rather than limited individual actions is proven, the McL sponsors will impose the biggest penalty and walk as not to send the messsage of association. The FIA must be consistant in the magnitude of its reponse with what it has done to others in the past to maintain integrity and credibility - otherwise accusations of favoritism and pandering are indefensible, and they will lose audience. It is all about money and ego - and whatever you may think of him, Bernie's great strength is that he thinks long term and knows that it would be a strategic blunder to simply let this go for the sake of one season. I do not know what is going to happen, but I think McL reputation and value to sponsors and the sport has taken a tarnish.
I say if McLaren is guilty, then take off points from the team not the drivers. They did an absolutely great job this year and had nothing to do with this.
Nope! They are on the team. Team suffers including drivers points. Simple. I recomm 2 race ban like Honda had to endure and 10 pts per driver. They drove a car that was potentially enhanced via illegal means. That means drivers points should be included if Mac is found to be guilty.
FWIW the FIA didn't mince about with Toyota when they caught them cheating in the WRC in 1995; 12 month ban and all points for that season deleted (drivers & constructors). Max Mosley was "in the chair" for that episode too. If McL really have been cheating and are found guilty then they may well get a rude shock with the punishment. (PS. the drivers had nothing to do with the cheating at toyota but they still ended-up with their points wiped)
+1000000 Exactly. had McLaren not suspended him, these same aluminum-hat wearing knee-jerk reactionaries would be claiming that McLaren's reluctance to suspend Coughlan is proof that they were complicit. There is no way to win a logical argument with people whose heads are buried so far in the sand (or in an orifice) that they refuse to see the obvious.
OK Sen master, then by application of your self proclaimed, supreme powers of logic, justice and timing... The FIA, should have already banned McLaren for the season. LOL !!!
Yeah i dont care as well. If it proves that they cheated , then let it be..Next race , also let Ferrari enter a tank and run over the whole field..
Are you privy to some secret information that no one else has?? Do you have specific evidence that McLaren in any way possessed or used this information? Or are you so blinded by your partisanship that you refuse to accept facts? Judging by your description of Ron Dennis and McLaren, I think we all know the answer to that. I am only concerned with known facts, not irrational and ridiculous leaps of logic. And the facts are that the documents were discovered in Coughlan's possession in his home, NOT in his office at McLaren, NOT in his computer at McLaren, and NOWHERE else in the McLaren organization. The facts are that Coughlan and Stepney approached Honda with this information, not McLaren. The facts are that Ron Dennis has made available to the FIA ALL technical information regarding the design and development of the McLaren race car during and preceding this entire time period PROVING that no Ferrari information is being used on the car. These are FACTS. The rest is the rumblings of you and your aluminum-hat wearing brethren. You better spend more time worrying about space aliens reading your thoughts than blowing off insipid speculative drivel like this.
I see your point...they probably use very technologically advanced and expensive toilet paper ... but I wasn't speaking about just a few million dollar fine. I meant a very large monetary number where Mac would definitely feel it. If a fine isn't a viable punishment then pick another suitable punishment in another form. I would just would rather see the FIA choose another punishment instead of docking them points. Whatever happens, if Mac is found guilty, then the team should absolutely be punished accordingly. At any rate, it's just a real tarnish on the season.
I would have to agree, expecially when you consider that if McLaren did cheat and they go unpunished then they will probably win both the WCC and WDC. Its not so much that I want Ferrari to win, although I wouldn't complain, but its that I could not respect the sport of F1 ever again if they allowed McLaren to win the championship after they had been proven to break the rules. If the allegations against them are true then McLaren deserves nothing short of points docking, suspension, and a temporary ban on testing and development.
I guess that the season is not really tarnished if the Macs are only fined and then win the Drivers and Constructors championship after stealing Ferraris plans for their 2007 season and car. What if after the season was over the FIA discovered that the Macs were actually Ferraris painted black and silver with a few updates from the Mercedes factory. Would you still think that the FIA should let the season stand? Oh yes but it was great racing.....You sound like the Nascar people.....Give me a beer, a race and my sister and its all good. lol
I see he does not answer you on that one. His bio shows that he does not own or want a Ferrari. This is a Ferrari chat site.....hmmmmm
I'm still waiting for someone to ask Ron Dennis how he knew the Ferrari had moving floorboards at Australia, yet you cannot see them move on video.
go to hell. I own a 355, which I suspect is more than you do, unless you count the Revell model in your bedroom of your parents' basement.
And you know what? - I am proud to be a Ferrari supporter, but - I actually like McLaren a lot, as much for their great history and past cars as anything. Those Can_AM cars can never be forgotten. I wonder what the real Bruce McLaren (or the great Denny Hulme) would have to say about RD and this mess if they were with us today.
