McLaren Charged by FIA!

I predict it will get uglier before it's over. People tend to try to lie their way out of situations. the hotter it gets the more they try to lie.

Of course people with character don't tell you how much integrity they have. They tell the truth from the outset. They return stolen property to the owner and/pr authorities, they don't recommend destroying the incriminating evidence. They vow to punish the wrongdoers. They don't play games with words (it depends on what the definition of "is" is for example).

What did McL know and when did they know is, specifically Ron Dennis? I don't know the answer but Ron Dennis does.

Oh, what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.

 

Sounds like the Wacky Races with Dick Dastardly, Muttley, and Snidely Whiplash. Where are Dudley Do Right and Underdog when you really need them?

Seriously, this whole scene seems surreal. Ferrari and Mercedes battling for the Championship, cloak and daggar figures in the background, espionage, sabotage, finger pointing. Whats next, someone floating belly up in the Med? I absolutely cant believe this hasnt been broadcast on the national news. This is as big a story as the Lindberg baby. I hate cheaters. Mercedes, if found guilty should be completely banned. But its rediculous. You would think a multi billion dollar corporation would be smarter than this. At least when Ford went after Ferrari they played reasonably fair.

 

+10

 

Me too!!!

This is a MAJOR scandal, here in the states all we are hearing about is David Beckham and Michael Vick's dog fighting...

Go figure.

 

And Conrad Black....another cheater.

 

Its not major news here either ..funny you on about Beckham there is a program on TV about his vile wife in Hollywood Its vulger and pathetic sorry to burden your country with them..

 

Wow! - Don't hold back on your love for Victoria!

I guess I've seen references advertising the aforementioned "Posh in Hollywood" (or whetever it's called) show, but haven't seen it.

Becks OTOH I'm welcoming with open arms - He's still one of the best in the world IMO - His team just won what is generally acknowledged to be far and away the toughest tournament in soccer.

I'm really hoping he can do as much for football ("soccer" - argh) here in the States as the MLS suits seem to believe/hope/pray/put their cojones on the line for - Make no mistake, they've put the future of MLS on the line here and I wish 'em well.

Now back to normal screamin' matches involving aluminum hats etc....

Cheers,
Ian

 

Ian, yes maybe I am a bit OTT ..David Beckham brillant footballer sorry soccer player. Thats it as far as Iam concerned.. I just hate all the crap/fuss that goes with them.

Anyway like you said

back to normal screamin' matches involving aluminum hats etc....

Funny tho

Cheers steve

 

Michael Vick, didn't know his house and property were being used for dog fighting.

Ron Dennis, didn't know that Team McLaren personnel were pouring over Ferrari's plans, engineering and test data.

 

Okay before this gets out of hand , we are having a miss communication.

I did not mean "idea", simply how I coded something before, something specific like converting an array to a list. Thus has nothing to do with the functionality of the code I wrote but more the mechanics.

Now I cannot remember everything, thus it is handy to be able to go: Hmmm how did I do that last time?

I could also get the same information from public text books probably, but much easier to just have a look back ...
Pete

 

hahahaha too late , we have now moved on from Stepneygate to PSKgate

I can hear an Italian car pulling up outside your residence now

 

Er, sorry to burst your bubble but this is not a big story to 99% of the population. Most people could not give a toss about F1 and motorsport in general, and already see it as a giant waste of resources and money ... and all the cars look the same, so what's the big deal in looking at the oppositions designs.

Come on guys, real life stories get the news.

On top of this Bernie is in control and currently has renewed British interest in F1 (thus 1 out of 1000 people actually now probably know a F1 drivers name) thanks to LH and McLaren is now a British team.

AND again we do not know all the facts. I am pretty sure this is nothing more than these 2 guys preparing to leave their current employers with a large amount of information to accelerate their NEW employers F1 program so they look like heros ... and thus can add a couple of zeros to their pay cheque.

What you are all forgetting is that McLaren build GOOD F1 cars, and have for the last 30 years, on par to Ferraris usually. Now I could see Williams stealing ideas but not McLaren ... no point.

The other thing you are forgetting is that they could only use this information in designing NEXT years McLaren, or I guess for updates during this year (but that would be massive compromises for their current chassis), as they would already be doing wind tunnel tests, etc. for the 2008 car.

So McLaren have nothing to gain THIS year and winning THIS years WDC is what it is all about, not next years when you are leading this years one.

Now yes the tactical linformation would be useful, but **** McLaren and every other team would already have so much information on this they wouldn't need much else.

And as for the floor flexing ... they all know so much about THIS years cars somebody would have got upset sooner or later, RD is more vocal than others BECAUSE McLaren start every season with a real chance of winning ... unlike BMW, Honda, etc.

Anyway that is simply my opinion, and I'm betting that McLaren will only get a little smack on the hand to ensure the season remains interesting BECAUSE that is more important to the BUSINESS of F1 than telling McLaren off. Thus maybe both Alonso and LH will loose 10 or so points to make it a even fight for the rest of the season.

Even Ferrari do not want to make the cheating to open for the F1 TV audience because 50% of viewers will turn off ... and then Ferrari will loose pocket.

It's all about money now. Heck even when MS blatently cheated all they did is remove the points from the season he had ALREADY finished and already lost in. He should have been banned for the NEXT season, but ofcourse that would have removed the interest in F1.
Pete

 

It's going to be very interesting to watch the reaction *he* gets here in the States [She's a sideshow that I believe will fade away soon enough]

IMHO, he's not quite as anonymous as MS here in the States, but I reckon he could basically walk the mall of many MLS cities without being mobbed.

Purely by coincidence, it was announced today that San Jose (my home city) has just "obtained" a new MLS franchise - These guys are trying, and hopefully Becks really turns out to be worth the money (more than all the other players in the entire MLS combined btw....)

Aluminum hat replaced

Cheers,
Ian

 

This cant just be about these 2 guys. If it was then it was for them to get ahead on another team. Now they are going to squeel. Nobody want a sqeeler on their team so in effect they are done in F1.

Sure winning this years WDC is what its all about but you have to remember that Mclaren was nowhere near as fast as Ferrari in winter testing and if they as the FIA believe received the infor at the beginning of the season then no wonder they are having their best season in a long time and on tires that their chassis new nothing about. Tacticle info means a ton!

There is a big difference between MS banging someone on the track in this affair by FAR. You cant even begin to compare.

Mclaren building good F1 cars? If you call switching engine suppliers every decade...Yes then they are good. Imagine Ferrari with a Honda engine in its belly in the late 80s and early 90s. Or even the porche engine earlier on. Yes I can see Ferrari having won many more championships. Lets see how many championships Mclaren wins if they stay together with Mercedes for the next 25 year.

The Floor flexing thing is surely part of the documents that they had and the FIA is also wondering how they new about it and will be asking them next week.
I agree with you to a point that the punishment may not fit the crime but F1 may loose lots of credibility if they do as you suggest.

 

Oh most definitely these guys are completely done in F1. Even if Ron Dennis or Jean Todt, or even the Honda equivalent, set this up they are going to take the fall.

Stepney was done anyway IMO.

F1 has little credibility to the average person anyway. If you asked the next person you pass walking in the street about F1 or even motor racing integrity and I would imagine that they would not give a toss or consider they all cheat.
Pete
BTW: McLaren and Mercedes have already won a few WDC's ... and McLaren are a very successful race team, they just don't make their own engines. So what ... never did Lotus, Williams, etc. Heck if Ferrari had not made their own engines they probably would have MORE championships ... well maybe.

 

2 points here :

1. no respect to the garagisti for using other people's engines, much kudos to Honda, BMW, Toyota

2. Ferrari would have had the same amount of winnings (read NONE) as their chassis was rubbish and the V12 flat 12 did not lend itself to ground effects

 

I wish everyone would refer to the team as Mercedes, and NOT Mclaren. Mercedes owns McLaren outright and has full control of it, as well as its top managers.

Maybe by sticking a phony name on thier cars they distance themselves from negative publicity, but boy oh boy they sure pull out the banners when they win. If the media would actually use the Mercedes name, and publish this story as it effects Ferrari, I think it would be greatly accepted by Joe Armchair. Come on, who never wanted to hear a good espionage story?

 

Please get your facts right, easily available:

They do not own the team outright.

Pete

 

And your point was?

Definitely in the late 60's if they had dumped their piece of crap sportscar v12 and put in a Cosworth v8 they would have been better off, and there have been other lemon engines too.

Just because you can make them, does not always been they are the best on the grid. Same for chassis'.
Pete

 

go wash your mouth out with soap and water !!!!

they do not make lemon engines, the gearbox failed !!

 

Ahem...McLaren won 10 races two seasons ago...

 

If i'm not mistaken shouldn't it have been 11 had Kimi not had the suspension problem in Europe?

 

Okay, point taken, and applogies for not being duly informed. But they still have controlling interest, and thus final say over all parameters.

 

Sorry dude, but no they don't:

40% Daimler Chyrsler
30% Mumtalakat Holding Company
15% Ron Dennis
15% TAG Group (Holdings) SA.

None of these "control" the company alone, and thereby have a "controlling interest"...

 

LOL, classic

I just got sent a m/c motivation poster: "Ducati, making mechanics out of riders since 1946".

I'm still laughing
Pete
BTW: I think McLaren, in the RD days, have always had a large % owned by other companies, ie. TAG, etc.