There have been several threads over the last 6 months about 355 race exhaust, but they all seem to just fizzle out? I know there are some beautiful systems out there, but I haven't been able to find a source or any hard data on how they acutally perform. I emailed with GuppeM, whose system looks great, but the dyno results never came. I'm ready to do something on headers, ECU, intake etc.... Anyone have any insight on who in the USA would be the authority on this subject? Thanks for any help. Mark
I'd love to be the guinea pig, and do detailed before and after dyno runs with different Exhaust/ECU/Intake combinations. Surely there's someone out there experienced with these motors that really understands all of the issues invloved with 355 engines. The "Challenge" is that there are so many fewer of these being raced than there are Ford/Chevy or even Porsche motors. It seems like a lot of the 355 tweaking has been done in Japan or Europe. Anybody know who to call? Thanks, Mark
Don't give up.......it takes time to develope and produce a system that is worth the money you pay for it. A full race system is just that, a "system", which headers are only a part of. The 5.2 Motronic is still a problem unless someone like John or ND can unlock the protocols. 4-2-1 tri-y headers are for low to mid range and 4-1 is for top end, but suffer greatly at high revs(what about the 4-3-1?? Most people don't even have a clue about this design). If a 4-1 system is designed properly it can pick up some mid, but never the low end. There are some tricks to the intake that can help, and one of the biggest increases will come from lowering the intake air and fuel temps. The 355 underhood temps are unacceptable, it is almost painful to open the fuel flap after these cars have been run hard because of the heat. To my knowledge there is only about 3 mfgs' of race systems and they are all in Asia. NONE OF THEM have ever furnished any dyno data...why?? I don't have a clue. As for street headers THE PRIMARY concern is with longevity and reduced underhood temps and that is about all. If you think you are going to see significant increases in hp/torque(low-mid) with no mods to the intake or ecu, you are in fantasy land. Maybe someone needs to start a thread with mods that they have done to in increase the 355 performance levels. As for factual data of any mods done in the past, well there's not much to go on, and what is out there is not standardized...even from the biggies such as TUBI or GruppeM.
Hi Bruce, I'm not giving up on you, I'm just anxious to get moving on something! Somebody has to have some hard data and a source for this stuff. I don't think anyone is under the impression that Ferrari left a lot of HP on the table and there are any easy boltons to magically unlock power. Remember, as a 1995 I have 2.7. I think I was told that factory Challenge cars continued with 2.7 even after 1995? Do you have any dyno data from your new systems? Thanks very much. Mark
Hi Mark. I wasn't ignoring your PM's, it is just that with all the race work right now it is very difficult to find time for this project. I have also been censored by the site owners from talking about these headers becuase sponsers were getting mad. Yes, the 2.7 Motronic was used on all CH type cars. These cars(due to stringent rules) had just a little better hp numbers over street version. Dyno data is forthcoming as soon as we can free up the dyno. There are alot of things that can be done to increase performance, most of which appear to be small but the cumulative effect is large. The only problem is the $$$$, which most owners either do not want to spend or can not afford.
OK, let me know when you have more data. Honest question, is there a sponsor here with similar headers? If so, who? Thanks, Mark
Nope!!!! Most people who sell there goods don't have a clue as to the design/build process, or the performance characteristics. So far the only mfg dyno data that I've seen was from NAPerformance concerning their street car headers.
Nope!!!! Most people who sell there goods don't have a clue as to the design/build process, or the performance characteristics. So far the only mfg dyno data that I've seen was from NAPerformance concerning their street car headers.
Bruce, I can't wait to see the numbers on your headers ! BTW speaking of header designs I started a thread on the differences from the 348 thru the 430. I don't know if you have seen it! I will dig it up from the grave!! Check it out !!
Here it is!! I posted alot of entertainment pics because no one was responding !! http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?p=136916179#post136916179
Hey Bruce, Any news on the header front? Surely if someone asks directly, you're not censored from sharing groundbreaking discoveries in exhausting 355s. I'm anxious to see what you find. Thanks for any update. Mark
Hi Mark, thanks for your interest and patience. It is still a work in progress. Even though I do not agree with this forums censorship, nevertheless I will abide by it. There will possibly be some great header input from one of the FChat consultants, who will also be working on a muffler design/build. Hopefully this non by-pass system with a special muffler will be a top choice for those wanting the ultimate in performance. When this gets into the build stage I will let the FChat consultant do the presentation so as not to upset any sponsers.
This is easy Bruce. And you hit it right on the nose. They have no clue of the whole process. They dont furnish dynos so often cause there is no actual performance gain. They go for the sound in Asia. As you all know I have the GruppeM racing manifolds and exhaust. I have come to realize something. Bruce, correct me if I am wrong. If you are looking for the "F1 Sound" a full racing setup is not for you. You can tune the note only so much on a full straight pipe system. Then you just have the raw noise that it produces. My car is actually very low at idle and from 2K to 3K I get this very angry transition from low to a higher note. When I am at 5K and up, the "F1 sound" makes it's debut. F1 cars make an F1 sound because....they are F1 cars. I think the companies here in Japan just look to make the sound cause that is what sells to the Japanese. GruppeM has F3 cars, GT cars and other that have done very well in the past so this is why I went with them. To be honest I was not impressed with the note of the car, but when you hit the gas.....very impressive. We are looking to get my car on the dyno pac tomorrow. If time permits but eventually I will get a dyno. Some pics for you guys. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Xavior!!!!! Your 355 is sooooo awesome...... I can barely stand it..... !!!! Make sure you get print outs of your dyno charts . Will you guys be doing any chip tunning at the same time??
The chip has already been done. I think the dyno tune will iron out the kinks. I will defiantly let you know. Thank you for the compliments. Here is the finished product for you. lol X Image Unavailable, Please Login
Redcar, stay away from a race system. I don't think you will enjoy the sound. In my biased opinion I will always say GruppeM due to the fact that they have done wonders with my car and have the track time to back it up. If your as serious as I am for, here is the key word, "racing" your car then I think Bruce can point you in all kind of proper directions. But if you are going for track days and overall sound and feeling, then any of the leading dealers can help. In my eyes, GruppeM *biased* Then hands down, Capristo. I am very anti Tubi and Kreissieg. Again, my own opinions. If you are looking at the Japanese ones out there, GruppeM is one but they are international and are allot bigger then the Kreissiegs and MS racings. In house Japan would be MS in my opinion. Sacclam is a little over priced IMHO. GruppeM will stand by their installations and should anything happen to my car, they will take care of everything. Kriessieg will not, nor the others.
Xavior, what were your first impression driving your car ? Only other sound or did you feel any +hp? Andi
Xavior, You are the first person I've found who actually has the GruppeM system I've been looking for. I'm dying to see dyno results. It is a beautiful system, but the $10k question is does it make more HP? I am most interested in HP, without loosing midrange torque. My second priority is weight loss, did you calculate the weight savings over the factory "octopus"? The sound and appearance are not as important, but I would like to hear the system, obviously it looks fabulous. Please give us all the details you can on the exhaust, ECU and air intakes! Here's a picture of my car, which is only used for racing. Thanks! Mark Image Unavailable, Please Login
Hi Andi, Like I said, I went for the whole package. There was a massive performance gain. Throttle response was allot more acute, the raw power of the car was tapped into. Ferrari knows what they are doing, lol. Put it this way, The car was ready to go on the auction in Kobe last friday due to the fact that I did some impulse buying on a 430 and still looking to get a CS in October as originally planned. But after I took the 355 for a spin with all the work done, add the 355 to the garage and the auctions are out of the picture. It was literally night and day.
The HP gains were very good actually. Like I said, I will try to get it on the dyno today and check it out. If the dynopak can not do it, i will get a print out from Super Autobacs. To be honest, mid range is allot more noticeable. Low end, well... I did not see an increase but there was no noticeable loss either. My home track is suzuka so I tend to stay in the higher RPMs. You will be very impressed with weight loss. The Intake alone is staggeringly lighter. Exhaust manifolds are lighter then stock but not like what you would expect from say, a DC Sports for a Honda over stock. The manifolds are made pretty sturdy. I would be very hesitant to put extremely light manifolds on. Muffler itself is a trip. Very light and the two canisters make the car sound just right with your share of nice flames if you so should desire. I will make a video on the wangan soon. I am sorry guys, a GruppeM 355 is where it is at in Japan. There is no question.
