New evidence in Stepneygate

I suspect it happens more often than we think.

 

OK, well it's either the tires are completely new and everyone was in the same boat, or....

In which case Bridgestone designed a tire that was based on information developed solely in conjunction with the Ferrari chassis that did virtually all the Bridgestone tire testing in 2006 that would, with no surprise, give Ferrari an automatic advantage.

Keep in mind that if McLaren loses all of its' constructor's points then that is a huge monetary loss since the money distributed by the FIA is based on the points scored. Besides, I'm sure if the drivers were penalized then the last few grands prix would scream bloody murder as the ticket sales plummet because there would be, in effect, a single team competing for the WDC.

 

Time to slap a huge * on this season's stats and winners

 

I dont think the newer Bridgestones were that much different to the 2006 tires. Ferrari had all the data on every type of compound used for the last ? many years. The compounds can only change so much infact I heard that Bridgestone let up on the research and was using older technology as they no longer had to compete with Michelen. The other big difference is the areodynamics of the tire. This is where Renault was having the biggest problem with the change. The Aerodynamics of the Bridgestone was allready known to Ferrari and it looks like McCheater knew as well.

 

There is no way on this earth that Ferrai is going to move either Massa or Kimi aside for either of the McCheaters drivers in the middle of a season. Ferrari would also loose much respect if they did that.

 

Just Imagine if Alonshole keeps his points and were to win the WDC this year. What a joke that would be. He has been whinning all season and puts down his partner constantly and even attempts to hold him back in the pits. Then we find out that he was benefiting more than Lewis Hamilton from the Ferrari technology and had the balls to tell everyone that he contributed all of the gain for the McCheater teams this year. Now he will testify with immunity against his own team(not that he has any choice) when he should have come out long ago and admitted that he had the info as well as the inside track. This guy is simply unbelievable and I would not have him babysit my children let alone have him on my team. Any team that would want this guy now is sort of in the same train of thought as Ron Dennise(Lucifer)

 

I don't think that anyone here is implying that Ferrari would do that this year.

Some people here are suggesting that McLaren may be out of the game for 2008, so the McLaren drivers could be hired to join a new team for the 2008 season, and Ferrari could hire one of them, maybe Hamilton.

~shahedc
.

 

Agreed.

Alonso and Hami only stand a chance continuing to fight for the title if they were in a Ferrari. So if Ferrari doesn't hire them for this year, their chances are over and Ferrari wins with one of their drivers regardless. Ferrari gains more from winning with one of their own than from importing a points loaded driver.

Todt doesn't like Alonso, so Unfairnando is off the table (goes to Renault anyhow). But Hami at Ferrari in 2008 sounds like a viable option.

 

Sounds good to me.......Arriva Lewis Hamilton!

 

Well, if the drivers of the team are just as dirty at the rest of the team through having the information - they should be punished. period. That's all I'm saying... If they were involved as well, why should their points be spared?

 

To get them to testify. Without their statements there is no case against McLaren.

 

If McCheater is banned next year, realistically what would his options be ? Back to GP2 ? Unlikely. Sit out the year ? Unlikely.
Prodrive ? Maybe. It would be nice to see what he can do in a car foreign to him.

Can't see Todt dumping Phil considering Phil's mgr. Can't see him dumping Kimi either. And it would cost them a fortune to buy out his contract.

Interesting times ahead. Personally I don't think the WMSC/FIA will ban McC for next year. Too damaging for F1. Love to see it though but I don't think so. But it would lead to some interesting senarios regarding the drivers and Prodrive for 08.

 

I guess letting the drivers off is the lesser of two evils... still, pisses me off... f*cking bush-league.

 

I think you are laying way too much of this on Fernando. I know you don't like the guy but if the testing and setup information purportedly came from Pedro based on information from Ferrari, then I would assume that both drivers were privy to it, and Lewis has been copying Fernando's setup at each race so Lewis has been benefitting from any ill-gotten gains that you attribute to Fernando. There are lots of teams that would like to have him as a driver because he certainly wasn't gifted his two WDCs despite your opinion to the contrary.

If the new evidence establishes wrongdoing by Mclaren they will get a huge fine, probably in the area of $20M as a warning to other teams.

 

I think we maybe over looking the true ring master of the current new issues & information.
Although I hate the guy ( Alonso ) His own get out of jail free card so to speak. He gets paid but does not lose face to losing his title to Hamilton (the Rookie)and Because McCheat are found to be cheating etc he does not really lose his title so to speak because of his team under handed tactics. The guys laughing all the way to the bank saying Mc Cheat robbed me of my Title.

 

The two spanish McL drivers, Fernando Alonso and Pedro De la Rosa, had all along the Ferrari info which was in Mike Coughlan's possesion.

It appears that Del a Rosa obtained the info of the stolen Ferrari file from Mike Coughlan and then by email informed his teammate Alonso just a short time after the beginning of the year. These emails of course represent official documents and may be what caused the FIA to decide to cancel the appeal and reconvene again September 13, 2007.
This fact would complicate Ron Dennis's defense because it shows that many persons within the McL organization were aware of the 780 page stolen documents.
De la Rosa knew Coughlan from the time back in the Arrows team.

But if this is not all, Alonso may have attempted to use this info to denounce the McL team to the FIA if they did not release him from his contract when his relations within the team were deteriorating. However the spaniard changed his mind after the first FIA ruling in which no penalties were assessed against McL.

This is a real saga...but unfortunately turbid.

 

Whoever wins it now it will be a non event with this farce.

 

I read about this earlyer today !

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=40534


This is getting crazy now !!!!!!!

 

Hmm, the whole thing seems to be shining a light on F1. And, we know that sunlight is the best sanitizer

 

Ferrari has been with Bridgestone since Goodyear's departure from the F1 in the late 90's. IIRC, McLaren and Williams even stated openly about joining forces on developing Michellin tires to fight against Ferrari back in 2000(?). It wasn't Ferrari or Bridgestone's fault that Michellin messed up at Indy in 2005, which lead many to believe to be the reason Michellin missed out on being the chosen spec tire supplier. And it isn't Ferrari or Bridgestone's fault that any of the other top teams chose not to switched to Bridgestone earlier, as in 2006. Had Michellin been chosen instead of Bridgestone, Ferrari would be in the very same situation and struggle at the start of the season just as well. Remember, the days of unlimited testing has been over for 2 years now, it is hard enough to play catch up let along leap frog another team as if they were standing still. Blame FIA, Michellin or whoever, but trying to pin this one on Ferrari or Bridgestone is extremly unfair.

 

Yeah, having a couple of cars able to win the championship nearing the end of the season is one thing but betting on cars coming out of winter testing being "neck and neck" is risky.

 

I'm not trying to pin it on anyone; if McLaren cheated then they should be punished. My problem is that I really don't think Bridgestone provided all the teams the same level of technical information regarding the tire design since I believe that Ferrari did have a tire designed specifically for their car over the past several seasons that both Ferrari and Bridgestone know affected the tire design in a manner that benefitted Ferrari by virtue of all the technical information that they had that, if Bridgestone was sincere in not wanting to give any team a head start, should have given equally to all teams. At least if Michelin had been chosen to supply tires for F1 we would have had more teams doing better since the Michelin tires were designed with at least 4 different chassis in mind rather than Bridgestone's one. I just honestly believe that there has been some collusion between Ferrari and Bridgestone to give Ferrari the benefit of their longstanding relationship to the detriment of all the other teams. I am not condoning McLaren in the slightest if they are penalized for cheating, but understand that I think there is a lot more going on here than just one team acquiring technical data from the other.

 

Well if thats not trying to pin it on anyone then I would hate to see you when you want to pin it on someone. lol

 

What a thread, can't wait to read the official report from the hearing on the 13th. If all the speculation in here is true, heck if even half of it is true McLaren should be excluded from the season. I still think it's a thin line with regards to stripping the drivers of their points, but if they were racing in an illegal car and then using Ferrari setup information to benefit themselves it has to be done. Either way the season has been tainted and I for one am looking forward to next year when hopefully this debacle won't repeat itself. If Ferrari wins because McLaren are disqualified the victory seems hallow, if McLaren wins they did so by cheating and Lewis will be remember as the rookie who won the championship by being a cheater. So far I haven't heard any outcomes that sound perfect other than us pulling ahead in the remaining races and winning both titles and then McLaren being found guilty and punished accordingly.

 

Spot on. I don't see Massa doing it, so Kimi better get going.