New evidence in Stepneygate

I am not an engineer, but if you really want to see if Ferrari technology is on the McCheater car, wouldn't the best thing to do be to let the SF engineers look at the McCheater cars very closely? The McCheaters already have the Ferrari details so turnaround is fair play. Of course, Ferrari would have to promise not to use any of the McCheater technology on their cars. LOL. Of course, it they did find something they would turn it owver to the FIA for review.

The only other option would be for Ferrari to attempt to train FIA engineers about all their technology and then those "trained" FIA engineers would look at the McCheater cars. sounds almost impossible to do.

Seems to me that having the McCheater drivers involved (at least Alonshole and de le Rossa) is even worse than having Ferrari technical pieces on the McCheater cars. My reasoning is that the drivers could say they knew nothing about it and weren't responsible. But by the drivers using the Ferrari set-up information they are more likely to be seen as benefitting unjustly and lose their points. Perhaps Lewis may dodge a bullet if he "didn't know" where the set-up information really came from.

What a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive. Couldn't be happening to a nicer bunch of guys.

 

Andreas....calma calma.....Dont get too excited....we should not jump to conclusions about all this hearsay and exagerated rumors. Lets just stay calm and think only about the race at hand this weekend. I know I will stay relaxed on the couch with my rope. BTW how high should the tree be and should we use a stool or a horse?

 

Andreas' comment is exactly the conlcusion that they are going to come to. The only defense McLaren will have is that the setup information referred to in the emails was gleaned from watching Ferrari at preseason testing and not the technical drawings. I still think they'll get zinged for about $20M.

When they are actually going to call Stepney to testify is what I am most interested. Somebody is waiting until the end of the season to hear what he has to say........................

 

Something smells. Immunity from what? FIA sanctions or loss of points? Isn't that the only thing they are capable of giving immunity for? They can't give immunity from criminal or civil prosecutions.

 

Immunity from the loss of their SuperLicense - basically their F1 career. How about the Italian Authorities impound the McLaren cars Sunday morning as evidence in an ongoing Industrial Espionage investigation?

 

Don't impound them. Boot them. It would be hilarious.......an humiliating.

 

I do not know whether this is posted already but this is the letter that the FIA wrote to all three McL drivers and has released.

"Dear Mr De La Rosa

As you will be aware, the FIA has recently investigated whether, how and to what extent McLaren was in possession of confidential Ferrari technical information. The FIA has subsequently been made aware of an allegation that one or more McLaren drivers may be in possession, or that such drivers have recently been in possession, of written evidence relevant to this investigation.

In the interests of the sport and the Championship it is important that the FIA as the regulator establishes unequivocally and rapidly whether or not this allegation has any basis in fact.

The FIA therefore formally requests that you produce copies of any relevant documents which may be in your possession or power of procurement and which may be relevant to this case. For these purposes “documents” includes all written materials such as emails, letters, electronic communications, text messages, notes, memoranda, drawings, diagrams, data,. or other material, stored in any physical, “hard copy” or electronic form. In particular (though without limiting the generality of this request), the FIA wishes to receive copies of any electronic communications (howsoever conveyed or stored) which may be relevant to this case and which make reference to Ferrari, Nigel Stepney or any technical or other information coming from or connected with either Ferrari or Mr Stepney.
In the event that you are aware of the existence or previous existence of any document falling within the above description but are not in a position to produce it, please describe the content of the document in question, the circumstances under which it came to your knowledge and the reasons why you are unable to produce it. In the event that you are unsure as to whether any document falls within the above description, kindly submit it (or a description of it) and the FIA will assist in making a determination.

You will appreciate that there is a duty on all competitors and Super Licence holders to ensure the fairness and legitimacy of the Formula One World Championship. It is therefore imperative that if you do have any such information, you make it available to us without delay. I can confirm, given the importance of this issue, that any information you may make available in response to this letter will not result in any proceedings against you under the International Sporting Code or the Formula One regulations. However, in the event that it later comes to light that you have withheld any potentially relevant information, serious consequences could follow.

We are sending identical letters to Fernando Alonso and Lewis Hamilton. We look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience. Thank you very much for your co-operation.

Yours sincerely

Max Mosley"

 

I doubt that. The FIA wouldn't dream of banning Fernando or Lewis. That's like banning Schumi after 97, wouldn't even be considered an option, he's was too big.

 

+1...couldnt agree more

 

Why not carpet bomb woking while your at it..

The desperation on here for punishment/blood for a problem that arose because a rogue FERRARI staff member pissed with his team gives Data away is beyond me ..

If Mclaren's only way of winning is to use that data, then to be beaten with it would be the sweetest ferrari win ever which is possible .

To rid F1 of Mclaren would be a sad day

And yes I am a ferrari fan not a mind numbed blinkered one ..

 

I have always posted a lot in this section, but this whole thing goes in some wild circles and bores me. Does anybody think this is the first time for this stuff. Certainly Bernie has manipulated F1 to his liking ($$$$$$$) with no concern for the sport. Races to the highest bidder with no fans in the seats. Manipulating sponsors and teams to place drivers where HE thinks they should be. Possibly forcing MS's retirement. Is all this exposure a payback to Bernie?

And yes, it would be a sad day when McLaren was not in F1.

 

McLaren can stay in F1, with all new management and senior level employees. I don't think the pit guys had anything to do with it, they can stay, but all the seniors there are fruit from a poisonous tree.

 

+1

Yes I agree round in circles same old crap boring "oh but they stole the data thats why there winning" BS
Its all if and buts..engineers move take data knowledge with them all the time..Ie Ross brawn wheres he going to end up?
The fact that a team is losing and are so obsessed that its someone elses fault erks me..

 

Looks like the McCheater team is finished next Thursday..........


Zoom
Ongoing reports regarding de la Rosa emails

An Italian newspaper on Friday published excerpts of what it claims is the 'new evidence' that could cast a pall over Formula One and, particularly, Ron Dennis' McLaren team.

Following the FIA's confirmation that one or more of the team's drivers could be in possession of key evidence, La Gazzetta dello Sport quoted sections of an email exchange between test driver Pedro de la Rosa and his Spanish countryman, world champion Fernando Alonso.

"Do you know that I've found out how Ferrari is able to get its tires to work to perfection?" de la Rosa was quoted as writing to Alonso earlier this year.

He added: "Nigel Stepney told Mike Coughlan."

"I don't believe it," Alonso reportedly replied.


If de la Rosa is proved to have known not only about Coughlan's possession of the 780-page Ferrari dossier but also its contents, the ramifications could be grave for leading management of the Mercedes-powered team, another Italian newspaper claimed on Friday.

McLaren already faces the prospect of a two-season disqualification at next Thursday's extraordinary hearing of the World Motor Sport Council, and the newspaper La Repubblica said team boss Ron Dennis and seven others - including Coughlan and Nigel Stepney - could also be charged criminally and even jailed.

The Rome based daily said prosecutors in Modena believe 'senior figures within McLaren' have known about, used and withheld their knowledge about the Ferrari secrets since March.

McLaren stated today that they are unable to comment on the case.

Source GMM
CAPSIS International

 

I think it is a bit more than taking knowledge...

"Newspaper quotes from de la Rosa-Alonso email regarding spy-game
An Italian newspaper on Friday published excerpts of what it claims is the 'new evidence' that could cast a pall over formula one and, particularly, Ron Dennis' McLaren team. Following the FIA's confirmation that one or more of the team's drivers could be in possession of key evidence, La Gazzetta dello Sport quoted sections of an email exchange between test driver Pedro de la Rosa and his Spanish countryman, world champion Fernando Alonso. "Do you know that I've found out how Ferrari is able to get its tires to work to perfection?" de la Rosa, 36, was quoted as writing to Alonso earlier this year. He added: "Nigel Stepney told Mike Coughlan." "I don't believe it," Alonso reportedly replied. If de la Rosa is proved to have known not only about Coughlan's possession of the 780-page Ferrari dossier but also its contents, the ramifications could be grave for leading management of the Mercedes-powered team, another Italian newspaper claimed on Friday. McLaren already faces the prospect of a two-season disqualification at next Thursday's extraordinary hearing of the World Motor Sport Council, and the newspaper La Repubblica said team boss Ron Dennis and seven others - including Coughlan and Nigel Stepney - could also be charged criminally and even jailed. The Rome based daily said prosecutors in Modena believe "senior figures within McLaren" have known about, used and withheld their knowledge about the Ferrari secrets since March."

 

...OH MY...if any of this has the slightest shade of true, we are in for a shamefull ending of a season...and maybe a shamefull end to a dear enemy...

...I wonder what will Weeping Ron will have to say about this in court...any media is to be present?...WE DESERVE TO KNOW!

 

Dont you think its weird that this new information comes out while Mclaren is in Italy for Monza ?
All of a sudden one of the drivers had a conscience this much later.
And the FIA issuing a blanket statement to all drivers looks like one saw an opportunity to rat out his employer for gain and contacted the FIA. I smell an Alonshole and its stinky.

One further thought if indeed Ferrari had the magic tire setup info at the start of the season, then why is Mclaren leading both WDC and WCC. Cant Ferrari do anything right ?

 

:-flamesuit function activated-:

...NOW THE LETTER FROM MAX makes sense...


...deep in the bottom of my heart, and being a Die Hard Tifosi since I can remember, I wish this was all a big missunderstanding, and a pair of rough employees trying to take the best for themselves out of secret data, and that your worthy enemy plays with the same passion and determination as you do...I mean, the greater the enemy, the worthier the champion RIGHT?

...and having two forces on the F1 clearly distinguished and settled, in this buy/sell/mid-table teams world of banners with wheels is just something F1 cant afford to do without..and we watchers and followers demand to have.

...but I can start to see through what MADMAX did with that letter addressed to the 3 McLiaren Drivers, that letter is the last oportunity they have of not damaging their careers...forever, given there is hard and irrefutable evidence been found?

it will be ugly...very ugly...

 

Mclaren , or any top team , is much more important than 3 drivers. Drivers come and go. Top teams make Formula One.
Make no mistake.

 

Maybe because MCL had in a way two teams collecting data, especially concerning the tires (the only parts which are the same on both cars) - they had their own knowledge and Ferrari's, given to them by Stepney.

Edit: Another thought, there were talks that Stepney and Coughland wanted to join another team with all the information they gatherd, along with some yet unidentified members of their teams. What if de la Rosa and Alonso were those guys?

 

Florian I doubt Honda would have taken the chance .

Alonso seems to be a handfull at the best of times with or without data.

Its seems alot of damage has been done this season.

I hope it can be sorted without turning the sport into a total utter farce.

 

...I do THINK that TOO...drivers are stages, come and go, survived, sufered, gone...

...but remember Sir Hamilton (the British full time Diva now that Diana is gone and beckham is hurt) is on that boat, the world reigning champion is on that boat too...

some sort of last chance for the drivers since their employer is going down in flames no matter what?...

thats why I see sense in MADMAX letter...and believe me I dont like it...that will confirm the tons of MAD threads about this, and all those even written by myself, being MAD, or moking and pointing McLiaren...

I remember back on 2004, when this guy...what was his name...eh...er..technical director of Williams-BMW was quoted as saying..."this season is a shame for all the rest of the teams, Ferrari is winning in F1...all the rest of us barely compete in F2"...

I guess McLiaren was as desperate as it seems and did the unthinkable?
after a season where they had 10 DNF due to ENGINE FAILURES and finished 5th in the WCC?
after 7 years of not winning the WCC?

 

An Italian newspaper makes the allegation?!?

I'll wait for the FIA hearing.