Thinking About a Carbed 308

I am looking at getting a new toy in the spring, in addition to the Porsche, Porsche will stay as Daily Driver. So I am looking at getting another fun weekend/nice weather car I can enjoy and something I can put on say 5K per/year and be reliable too. One requirement is that it has to be old enough in to have history plates on it. In KY that is at least 25 years old, so I don't have to worry about registration renewal every year. So one of the cars on m is is a old Carbd 308 for a couple of reasons. One I have always wanted one, and another one is the 308 is not a fast car compared to todays cars, so all the injection and emissions things just choke the car out anyways so thats why I want a carbed car, plus they are more trouble free than the injected models or so I have heard. Having a Carbed car does not bother me as I work for Holley Performance in the carburetor division so I know my way around a carburetor. However what are some things I should look for on these cars? Are the Targa cars like the Porsche's as they can leak or are they pretty dry. And final question. My budget is 15K is that a realistic price for these cars or is that more Mondial territory?

Brandon J Zorn

 

With a budget of 15K, I don't know if you are in any territory.

The lower the purchase price, the higher the required initial maintenance to get it right (in my opinion)...and these are not inexpensive cars if they are in need. My sentiment is that you should always have $3-5K set aside...and more if you have purchased a $15K project car.

But we'll wait for the real experts to weigh in.

 

You'd better plan on $25k-$30K for a "decent" one, not great but a driver that needs restoration.
Then another $5-$10k for major service, fixing things that don't work and replacing broken or damaged parts, etc.
Cheap Ferraris are the most expensive ones that you can buy.

 

Agreed, you'll want to have $40K in the bank before you start looking for a 308. You might find a decent driver carb'ed 308 for $30K, and $10K should cover the initial major service plus give you an emergency fund.

Even in the Mondial range, you're probably looking at a tired Mondial 8 (all fuel-injected). Problem is, Ferrari parts prices are still ludicrous, so once you've bought your low-end driver Mondial you're paying the same stupid parts prices that 308/328 owners are paying for cars that cost 3x or 4x times what yours did. Bargain Ferraris tend to be a bad deal.

FWIW, I would disagree with your statement that 'carb'ed cars are more reliable than the injected cars.' Once you get past the '80-'82 8-valve cars, which are down on power, the '84'-85 Quattrovalvoles are generally considered the least temperamental of the 308 series. Bosch FI components are easy to source, and the FI cars pass smog tests without a lot of drama. The most desirable of the early 308s are the fibreglass cars of '76, but you won't touch one for $15K.

 

No offense, but a single holley on an American V8 and 4 Webers on a 308 are totally different beasts. Not that you can't learn the latter, but there is very little in common with the former, except of course that they are carbs.

$15K budget won't even approximate buying a Ferrari of any kind. Even non-running parts cars get that much on eBay. A decent carb 308 will set you back close to $30K minimum. And unless you are completely capable of doing ALL your own work on the car (like, including the major) you definitely can't afford a Ferrari even if you have $30K burning a hole in your pocket. The cost of buying the car is just the cost of entry. I'm not trying to sound like a snob or anything, I'm just speaking from experience. Just because you can buy a woman a nice steak dinner doesn't mean you can afford to date a supermodel!

Birdman

 

I agree with everything Jon has said except the above. The CIS stuff is getting harder to find all the time. That said, it is pretty darned reliable as long as nobody has messed with it and gotten it all out of whack, as one of our NE brothers discovered on his new 308. (PO messed it up and it was tricky getting it sorted out again).

Webers are tricky to set up right. Once they are set up though, you don't need to mess with them for a long time.

Birdman

 

CIS? mmmm.. like the old Porsche fuel injection? was it just as tempermental on the F-cars as on the P-cars?

 

Birdman, et al, are the voices of experience...read & heed. The only thing I'd add is in reference to your "leaky" question: The early F-cars didn't have rustproofing (started in mid '80's, I think)...most folks I know don't worry about waterproof seals so much since they don't get put out in the rain/snow. I had one 9 yrs...didn't get it out in the rain, but as a weekend car I drove it as often as I could when weather permitted.

If you're still interested, there's lots of info available on this site about buying an F-car, too. (Mechanics, inspections, what to look for, ...)

 

well true, I firgured most ferrari's aren't driven in the rain. I came from Seattle where I did see them out in rainy weather every now and then. So I figure I might drive it in the rain once in a while out here in KY

 

oh yeah, What all is included in a Major service? I have done the major 30K mile service on my P-car. Waterpump, timing belt all front engine oil seals, etc.

Brandon J

 

The biggest parts of the major are the timing belts, tensioner pulleys and the water pump. The other stuff is basically replacing cam seals, checking valve clearances, etc. It can be done with the engine in the car.

Aaron

 

cool I have done all that stuff before...well not the valve clearance but Im sure thats easy to learn if somebody showed me, what about a clutch job on these cars, are they pretty involved or straight forward. On my 944S2 I have to remove the exhaust, rear transaxle, rear suspension and toque tube. A clutch job on a 308 that be that hard is it?

 

Maybe I've just been lucky so far.

 

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/car/454910350.html

Not my car. I don't know anything about it, but $25k is pretty cheap for a carb'd 308. Hope you like yellow.

Aaron

 

I agree with this with the exception that I think it is actually more difficult to check valve clearances than to replace timing belts. Getting the valve covers back on without oil leaks can be a little tricky, which is why a lot of people skip the valve clearance on a major!

 

Ok do the valves have to be adjusted or is it okay not to do it?

 

to get to a 308 clutch you remove drivers side wheel and wheel arch protection and its quite simple. To change belts just take off the passenger side wheel and wheel arch protection.
Quite straight foward for a mechanic!


For valve clearence regulating ,the side which is closest to rear is easy to work with,The other side near drivers cabin ,its better to remove the engine bonet.Which is a little annoying!

 

cool, regarding the water pump. can I apply the same rule as Porsche's watercooled front engine cars. change the pump everyother belt change(30K) or is it every belt change(15K)?

 

rebuild every other is what I was told...

 

cool, so what is the cost of parts to do a complete major?

 

Thats like asking how high is up. The costs to sort out a 30 year old car are balanced entirely on its previous care or lack there of. If your thinking your going to buy a 308 for under $20K, the costs to sort it out into a decent looking reliable machine could well exceed $15K or more depending on whos doing the work and the overall condition of the car. There are no cheap Ferrari's.

 

I was doing a little more thinking today and I think I am going to up my budget to 25K I should be able to find a decent driver for that huh? Since I am only 25 years old I am going to take out a loan on some of it. I plan to have 6-10K to put down on the car and finance the rest. I shouldn't finance old cars but I did it with my First Porsche but I figure since I am keeping the Porsche for many years to come and plan to keep the F-car as well I don't see a problem with it. Your thoughts. ANd yes I know there are no cheap Ferrari's I am a Porsche factory trained parts specialist and I had people come in all the time and tell me they bought a Porsche Cheap and now have more money in it then what they paid for it. I just the market on these' cars will contiune to go up. I remeber seeing a Mondial last year for sale I believe so somewhere around 15K

 

Budget $25-30k to get a decent car. My '76 has 80k miles on it, and I would not think of selling of for less than $30k (not that it is for sale ). I think it is that nice of an original example, and several others feel the same way about their cars. Those are usually the best and most well kept cars you won't get hosed on. Just gotta find one for sale.

 

Take a look here http://emelbon.tripod.com/eugeniosferrariservice.htm and you will get an idea of the costs for service. Good luck

 

Re rainwater entry - targa top doesn't leak and with roof off, as long as you keep speed at around 100k you can drive in quite heavy rain without getting wet

PS And carbs rule!