THE PRICES JUST KEEP FALLING DOWN ON 550 AND 575 CARS

I believe that the 575 and the 550 will continue to loose value, at least for the next few years, before they become real collectors cars. If you plan to hang on to them for long enough, eventually you will get your investment back....
Incidentally, I have replaced my 575 with a 599 and I have been asking myself if it was a smart decision.....

 

These are interesting times. The Billions in losses that some are sustaining do trickle down. Driving up A1A doesn't lead one to believe that it's a sellers market for Condo's. The first thing people tend to sell are toys.

IMO it's a hard wind that's going to blow and the prices of everything will come down except for the truly rare coveted by the truly rich.

 

As much as some might want modern production Ferraris to be something more than a "used car," that would be a fantasy. Like any other luxury, buying and owning a Ferrari is simply a choice. As I pointed out in another thread, based solely upon my experience, maintenance on a modern Ferrari comprises only 25% of the total cost of ownership; ignoring opportunity cost of course.

 

intresting thought and well said.

 

Fantastic automobils but to many made to be the collectible. Many jump out to the F599 as these are now the newstyle.

Yes, MSN financials revealed that is not only mortgages but consumers dept that will stop economicals.


The damage came from two directions: mortgage delinquencies and assets backed by mortgages. But the really scary news for the general economy is that the banks' problems aren't limited to mortgages and the housing market. They're starting to see rising delinquencies and charge-offs in their portfolios of auto loans and credit card debt.

Wells Fargo, for example, said that charge-offs on its credit card portfolio rose to $176 million from $161 million in the second quarter. At Washington Mutual, managed credit card delinquencies climbed to 5.73% of the bank's portfolio from 5.11% in the second quarter.

But the most stunning news -- and the most troubling indicator that credit problems aren't limited to the mortgage market anymore -- came from the credit card companies. Because these lenders have neither direct nor indirect exposure to the mortgage market, the trends here are an indicator of what's happening with consumer credit outside mortgages. And the news in the third quarter wasn't good.

 

It's just the normal depreciation cycle, as posted. It takes 20-30 years for a car to be sufficiently unavailable to start to be collectible. The Dino 246 is there, and the Boxer is following. As the OP pointed out, if you want a 'like new' 550/575M you can pretty much pick up the phone and buy one.

 

I was pretty sure the 550 was bottoming out earlier this year, but it's now clear it's not. Ah well, just got to keep driving mine for another 15 years then. What a hard life! I bought mine for a fair price in Holland in June, which means that it wasn't cheap, and if I need to sell during the next couple of years I will lose money on it (probably 20 - 25% of purchase price). But hey, that's a small price to pay for such a car.

Talking 550s: If you have the money, and you are in the Northern Hemisphere in a temperate climate, you will be entering winter soon, and then I recommend you wait a bit because prices will be lowest during the dark, cold, months. However, if you are not, just buy one now. Sure you may lose 10 grand or so compared to next year but it's like the stockmarket: if you really wait for the best margin, you will only find that you missed it!

They are dirt cheap now, go for it.

Talking 575s: these will still come down a lot during the next two/three years until they are (practically) at 550 level. One day, the 550 will appreciate more than the 575, I am convinced, but that is a long way away. If you want a more modern (up-to-date) interior, the 575 is nice, and you may like the F1 box. Personally, I love my stick-shift 550. There are a few 575s with stick but not too many.


Onno

 

i'd love a lead on that 575 car for $116,000 if it is a M (manual)

otherwise, i think pricing has held up well for 550s from what cars are offered at on ebay, etc, given the "aging" in model years and performance. i think the spread between 575 and 550 pricing will narrow as time passes.

 

not to mention all the other items you refer:

1. you sound like an un-aware, buyer, in a world that has interest for you, but you had no idea what a Ferrari was.
2. That's ok, IF
a. you love your car
b. you are NOT in this for an investment: cars unless they are rare and/or wanted a great deal are: NOT INVESTMENTS.
c. get to know your car, and what the items are called [ paddle shift ]...sounds like you have a VERY nice rendition.


if there was ANYTHING that attracted you to this car/ or Ferraris, then I'll be certain you'll find it again.

now cruise the site and discover the history you are missing [PS: NO I am not slamming you, this is decent advice. good luck and welcome]

 

Bad news for those who are long on 550's/575's. Good news for those of us who are short. January/February is also a good time to buy used because bonuses are being paid to those who will be buying a new 599 this year and they will be unloading their current ride. Since I live in CA, I can wait until February. Since I have specific features in mind, I'm also looking forward to an expanded inventory to select from. I almost want to say that I feel sorry for current owners, but you guys are having the times of your lives driving my dream car right now!

 

Are you wondering if it was a smart decision just from a financial aspect or also on how the 599 drives compared to the 575?
I currently have a 575 and have a 599 on order. How do you compare the two cars from a driving enjoyment perspective? Is it noticeably better/faster etc? (I've really enjoyed the 575, so am concerned the 599 may not be a big enough improvement to warrant the huge spread in price).
Thanks
Joe

 

Your last sentence says it all. I am having the time of my life. I love the 575. My wife loves the 575. My Lusso, which I bought in 1970 and sold in 2000 paid for it and more. The 599 has a ways to go before I get excited. So, I guess we'll just put the 575 in the shop for a tire valve transplant and a good detail and wax and go off to Florida for two weeks in the throwaway ('04 T-Bird) and be done with it until Spring.

 

The 60msec paddle shift gear change is the big improvement in getting the power to the wheels. If you like the controversy design of the F599 then that is the fantastic one for you, pass on the 575!

 

I have a hunch that over the long term the stick shift Ferraris (all models) will be more desirable than the paddle-shift cars.

 

as much as i like the 550, the 575 with F1 being the 1st GT they built with it, plus being rather quick to shift sounds like a winner to me. To each there own i guess, but prices will sink further i think, for some reason the 12s scare the secondary market.

 

Hello Everyone:

Months ago, I posted a blurb that I called "economics lite." While I will try to keep the economic discussion to a minimum, this thread is about prices and prices are the result of economic circumstances.

I just finished my company's budget for FY 2008. In the beginning of that budget, I have a brief economic overview. Back a year ago, I used Teddy Roosevelt's quote about the "Man in the arena." I knew 2007 was going to be a bad year for real estate and this meant bad news for the broader economy in late 2007 and 2008. For this year, I used a quote by Ayn Rand.

This year, 2008, will be even more turbulent (OK, I borrowed that word from Alan Greenspan's new book) than 2007, with a difference. In 2007, property owners and consumers were hit in the gut with a storm of bad news and they just did not do much--unless they were forced to do something. Now that the pain of that gut-punch is over, the look at 2008 and see one of two things. Either (1) another shot in the gut or (2) sell the asset for a loss and move on.

If you sell now, you may sell for less than you wanted, but it will still be more than the price NEXT year.

In order to let this market hit an equilibrium, prices must fall by a big percentage.

I see 550 Barchettas for less than $150,000 in 6 months. Superamericas will be below $250,000 in 6 months. The coupe version of the 550 and 575 will fall another 20% or more this year.

People have told me that cars are luxury items which are bought by rich people who do not care about these things and who are immune from economic cycles. Maybe so, but the completion of that thought is that the people which are included in that thought are the Enzo owners--the FXX owners, the F-50 owners, etc. I know 2 peopel who own 599s who continue to work, BECAUSE THEY NEED TO WORK. I have a single friend who is 35 years old--a high tech company owner, who has a net worth of about $4 million, and he owns a 430 Spyder and a CS. He borrows money out the a** and he has over $80,000 per month in various payments (mortgage, taxes, insurance, car payments, boat maintenance). He owns many depreciating assets and if his company growth slows just a little bit, he will sell those cars so fast it will make you dizzy.

It's not all gloom and doom--it's just economic darwinism. Some people reached too far and are getting their hands slapped.

It's all a normal part of the cycle.

 

I have driven the 575 f1 and rode in the 599..no comparison...we are talking about an extra 100hp in a lighter, better, far more advanced car....the 599 is light years ahead in every aspect...alum. body, enzo engine, state of the art electronics and much better handling...the 599s in the US are currently selling for well over $100k over list....also, the 599 has a more flashy looks in person.....

 

its amazing how the front engine cars depreciate so much more than the mids. seems the fronts behave like a porsche in loosing 50% in 5 yrs while mids stay near original sticker. you can buy a same year 360 spider and 550 for equavlent $ when the 550 listed for extra $75k. really have to love the v12 to choose it over mid engine

 

Can't argue as I haven't driven either car. But Daytona coupes are a lot slower than either, only come with a manual, have no electronics, a plain steel body and are still on the way up. So tech is a weak rationale for long-term market prospects. (Hell, the Dino 246 has already passed the 575M...)

What the 599 has is that right now it is the new thing, whereas the 550/575M can be had by anyone with some money (and good taste in cars). In a couple of years, the 599 won't be the hot thing anymore, and there will be no premium as people realize there's no one left to gouge. Then it will stand or fall on its own merits vis-a-vis the 575M. We've all seen it before. This isn't a 288 GTO or Enzo where only a few hundred will ever exist. It's a great car that will be produced until the market is saturated or something better comes along. Take that $100K premium with a grain of salt.

As far as looks, it's all subjective and has been discussed to death. I think it's a competent design, but maybe the least flashy Ferrari I've seen since the 456. I wouldn't pay a premium for its looks. However I respect its performance.

 

I've noticed that too about the twelves. What was MSRP on the 456? Maybe part of it is the real/perceived maintenance costs.

How are 512TRs doing? Those seem to be holding up fairly well in the secondary market.

 

Actually, this is right on the money. You should expect any modern Ferrari to eventually depreciate to about around 40% of sticker. (Yes, this includes 360s, which I predict will eventually fall to about $60k or so, just as the 355s will eventually float down to $50k or so. It will just take longer for them than the V12s.) MSRP for a 1999 550 was about $215k. So $84K is just about right. Will this car go lower in the short run? Who knows? That is like trying to call a market bottom. The point is that the early 550s are getting close to being fully depreciated.

This also means that the later 550s and 575s still have a ways to go. I think that MSRP for a 2001 550 was about $235K, so I would guess that the bottom is around $90k. MSRP on the 575s was closer to $250k, so again the bottom should be around $100k.

Super Americas stickered for, what, $300k? Thus, the bottom here should be around $120k. However, there were so few SAs made that I'm thinking that the bottom (in ten years) will be around $150,000.

Of course, the real point is none of this matters, does it? There are only two good reasons for buying a Ferrari: 1. Because you can, and 2. Because you want to.

Anything else is bs. The only people making money in this game are the pros. The rest of us get to pay, and pay, and pay, and pay.

Dale

 

Just curious, Jim. I agree with you that the suburban home/condo market is gonna be bloody in 2008. The last shoe has not dropped on that one, not by a long shot.

Thus, anything associated with the non-high end luxury home bidness is gonna hurt, right down to Wally World and Home Depot.

However, the job market still looks good. (Admittedly, the losses in the illegal worker market are not being reported because, well, they are illegal.) People are still going to work, spending money, getting sick, and so forth and so on. So, at least for where I sit (In the great country of Tejas), things don't look that bad.

At any rate, I doesn't really matter to me because I'm sitting up in the peanut gallery, and I don't have any skin in the game. I was just curious.

Dale

 

Both, if I analyze my 599 experience, the car is excellent in everything: acceleration, speed, quality of craftmanship, etc. But, when I put everything together, blaaah... Not sporty enough not a direct feeling for the road, in other words a Mercedes on steroids, not a real Ferrari

 

Having personally had a lot of Ferraris, mostly 12's, you're not driving it hard enough. It is far more direct than any 12 I've had, and as much as I dearly loved my Maranellos, my 4cam, my 250's, it puts them to shame. Turn in, recovery, transitions, ALL are far more lithe than other FE 12's, and quite frankly, steering approaches if not surpasses the 360-430. Feel is not quite as direct, but they have a 12 sitting on them. Mercedes are nothing like the 599. A hard driven 599 can and will scare the crap out of you, even with reasonable skills. Other than a prodigious appetite for fuel when generous throttle settings used, nothing covers ground faster. Doesn't matter pavement, weather, or load. Comfortable and practical yes, styling to one's taste, yes, but as a whole, a deeply satisfying and emotional drive. On roads where various other cars of mine were near their limits, the 599 blows right by those. I'm still relearning the edge, incrementally, as I'd prefer not to kill myself in a bout of ill conceived bravura.
Go take a course, and use it as it should, or sell it and buy something else. But you are truly misguided if that is your impression of the 599. FWIW.
PS, I work for a living, car is paid for, and I bought it to drive, not as an investment. No time for old cars, and "been there, done that". Still love 'em, but jaded. Could easily have bought a 288/F40/etc, but can't use it all the time. To some of us, they're cars. I specc'ed mine quite personally, and I can see myself keeping it a long time. Could have kept Maranello a long time too, should have kept the others. Friend has a 4cam with IIRC 320k km on it, perhaps more, bottom end never apart. You want investments, call Jim. You want fun, drive a Ferrari. Hard. Child seats fit fine too.