308 V12 conversion begins | Page 8 | FerrariChat

308 V12 conversion begins

Discussion in '308/328' started by mk e, Oct 9, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 30, 2003
    18,079
    Savannah
    i love this thread............
     
  2. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
    Consultant Owner

    May 5, 2001
    7,022
    Groton, MA
    Full Name:
    Verell Boaen
    The problem is the corrosion is along the length of the stud, a couple of inches or so, thus penetration & loosening could take months...

    Here's some history about what it can take to pull a stuck head off:

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/256120/164733.html

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/256120/247.html

    It's too bad the pix for these & a lot of other old fchat threads were lost in the infamous hard drive crash a few years back.

    Pizzaman, when are you going to start your engine work thread so we don't have to derail this one?
     
  3. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

    Mar 13, 2005
    3,919
    New Hampshire
    Full Name:
    Pizzaman Chris
    I will start new thread for "my big project" soon. :)


     
  4. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    #179 mk e, Nov 18, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I cleaned some parts a bit today, which wasn't particularly fun. Wifey has a strick no solvents in the basement rule, so I has to go outside and finish everything off with soap and water before bring them back in. By the time I finished a couple hours later the light rain had turned to light snow....time for a drink or 2 to warm up.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  5. Pizzaman Chris

    Pizzaman Chris F1 Rookie

    Mar 13, 2005
    3,919
    New Hampshire
    Full Name:
    Pizzaman Chris
    Mark, slow down, i have not gotten MY heads off yet. LOL!






    Oooh, nice Husqy. That's one of those zero turn ones right? I likey those alot.:)
     
  6. bert308

    bert308 Formula 3

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,776
    Roermond Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Bert Kanters
    Seeing that picture without it's context one might think he's putting a V12 in the lawnmower.
     
  7. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
    Consultant Owner

    May 5, 2001
    7,022
    Groton, MA
    Full Name:
    Verell Boaen
    Umm, that's mk e, don't go giving him ideas, he might just do that. Wouldn't it be a great project for ToolTime...
     
  8. Iain

    Iain F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2005
    3,326
    UK
    I believe he has a 308QV engine going spare now :D
     
  9. atlantaman

    atlantaman Formula 3

    Mar 31, 2002
    1,726
    Roswell, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Charles
    <<<<<< sits back with a cigar and cold beer to watch those try to re-trace my steps........


    ps- a drop of battery acid does a great job at killing off the old buildup on block studs.... ps--replace them all if you take them out.
     
  10. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    ok, ok, you were right.

    you don't happen to know the stud pattern on the SOHC block do you? I'm wondering is the right way to build this engine is a SOHC 364 block, 400 crank and TR heads :)
     
  11. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,489
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    Just get a set of cheap daytona heads and presto, correct intake port location, chain drive. :)
     
  12. atlantaman

    atlantaman Formula 3

    Mar 31, 2002
    1,726
    Roswell, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Charles
    Mike you sound like you are ordering a family meal...
    1 item from part A
    1 item from part B
    1 item from part C

    Do you have CAD? I think my head gasket from 330 in in cad...... BUT 365 is different.

    I would bet that all dealerships keep old crushed gaskets for test fittings and you could take measurements from them....
     
  13. atlantaman

    atlantaman Formula 3

    Mar 31, 2002
    1,726
    Roswell, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Charles
    just catch a cheep flight to atlanta one weekend and come learn a few things
     
  14. 246tasman

    246tasman Formula 3

    Jun 21, 2007
    1,448
    UK
    Full Name:
    Will Tomkins
    Cheap Daytona heads???
    I'll take 6 pairs too thankyou...
     
  15. 246tasman

    246tasman Formula 3

    Jun 21, 2007
    1,448
    UK
    Full Name:
    Will Tomkins
    In what way(s) do you think the 2 cam block would be easier/better?
     
  16. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    I don't want any models to feel left out of the fun.


    I do, a cad file would be great!
     
  17. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    It looks like the studs were move on the 400 block to get them out from under the exhaust cam, the SOHC engine wouldn't have that concern. Knowing how much engineers like symmetry, I’ve got to believe they rows would be straight at least and maybe is a useful placed.

    This stud issue is really bothering me….I’m just not in love with any of the options I’ve got to fix them. I ordered taps, dies, and material to make plugs, but I’m ¾ leaning toward welding them shut at the moment.

    It I weld them I could order from column D and get 348 liners and have a 5.3 liter or get the 89mm liners form the 4.0 liter 308 project and have a 5.8 liter. That’s close enough to 6 I think to call it a 6 liter. Oh, or it’s close to 5.7, I could tell people I put a 350 in it:)
     
  18. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,489
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    It would be easier to put a chev in it, lol and sadly it might make as much or more power! No it wouldnt have the 12 cyl sound and you would be banished from f-chat :)
     
  19. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    Time to back up and look at the "Big Picture" before you end up with a bunch of modified parts that don't fit anything anymore.
     
  20. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,489
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    I agree, but if Mark is determined to have a V12 308 the block will probably need something cut off of it like the colombo engined 308's. I say remove the trunk section and go flat 12 ala boxer/TR.
     
  21. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    I know.......but I just keep seeing the big picture through my rose colored glasses including a big v12 :)
     
  22. atlantaman

    atlantaman Formula 3

    Mar 31, 2002
    1,726
    Roswell, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Charles
    if we could just get our hands on a cmm coordinate measurement machine this would be EASY
     
  23. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    Then I could just go buy a TR that comes with TR heads, my wife reminds me of that every other day or so. There is going to be a lot more modifying here then I would have preferred but at this point I can still say I’ve had worse and it’s still no Fiadilac (500ci caddy engine in a fiat X1/9 I did years ago).

    When I do stuff like this there are a few rules and this doesn’t break any yet.

    1) Don’t ever under any circumstances modify a normal where item.
    2) No bodywork required because I s*ck at that.
    3) Don’t modify 2 parts when 1 will do.


    Now on this project unfortunately, it looks like I need to modify a lot:

    1) The block needs the studs and oil holes moved and it may be best to alter the mount flange, which might save modifying the bell housing.

    2) The heads will need the one end altered to clear the timing chain and mat with the chain cover

    3) The cam covers need to be altered to mate with the chain cover, probably narrow them and certainly add a “Ferrari” to them.

    4) The timing chain cover has numerous protrusions on the front that are of no use to me and just get in the way, so they will be cut off. Also the spacing of the holes for the cams is wrong and will need correcting.

    5) The trans casting needs the oil sump part modified to match the new engine.

    6) The Trans/engine end cover needs to be altered to fit the engine and move the idler gear, see 7.

    7) The trans input gear will need to be extended. I am planning to swap the engine and trans gears to get a better drive ratio for the high torque engine, and that means moving the idler gear a bit.

    8) Modify the drop gear cover the move the idler gear bearing and add an outer bearing to support the trans input gear.

    9) All new exhaust.
     
  24. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    13,751
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    Help me get this thing finished! https://gofund.me/39def36c
    We can. I've been using the DRO on the mill because I have it at home and know how to use it, but I do have access to a CMM at work if required....I'd just have to get a a lesson or help to run it.
     
  25. 350HPMondial

    350HPMondial F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 1, 2002
    5,326
    18 mi from the surf,, close to Pismo, CA
    Full Name:
    Edwardo
    CNC programming a CMM is all auto now,,, down to Technician level..
    You will fall asleep doing it. (yawn)
    Gone are the good old days,,, (thank God)
     

Share This Page