Quick Question for you racers

Im going to Germany this summer and would really like to rent a car to drive on the 'Ring. So far Ive found numerous cars, mostly BMW E46 M3's, some track preeped VW race cars, a Porsche Caymen and a Lotus 7 with a 100hp+ ford motor in it. What would you guys pick? Im more of a straight line guy but I cant pass up the oppertunity to drive on a track like this.

Thanks,
Nate

 

the M3 will be the easiest car to drive, for someone with little experience, and still a blast to drive on the ring

 

Nate, what's your daily driver? What sort of cars do you have track experience with?

 

I would pick the Cayman with PSM.

 

I just have a ZX3 focus for now, I had a supercharged Cobalt that I drove quite a bit in the summer but its for sale now. I have never been on a road track but I might run down to Mid Ohio just to learn the basics. Im kinda leaning toward the Lotus 7 since it would basically be a giant go kart, fast yet forgiving. My friend told me that I should try to find a 997 C4 to drive since it has all the modern nannies.

 

i'd suppose if you're a fan of saloon cars the m3 but as an open car enthusiast i'd opt for the lotus.

 

A combination of zero exprience and the 'ring is difficult to prescribe. There's a lot to learn before you go whole hog at the 'ring. School is a good idea. If you intend to go, then a car with modern stability and traction systems is a good idea. A 997 is probably too powerful for you. A ceiling of 200 horsepower should see that you have fun and not get into too much trouble. Don't even consider the Lotus thing unless you have a death wish.

 

+1! Not much protection there. From your list id pick the Cayman.

 

+1

Listen to the man.

I came to stupid money cars from the motorcycle world. Do you know that something like 1 to 2 people a MONTH die on the Ring? I have never driven it, nor do I want to. This is a very weird German thing. For example, nobody jay walks in Germany. But, from what I have heard, you can see people drinking beer in the parking lot before they go out.

Keep in mind that people drive very fast on the Ring. Even if you are driving within your limits, they may decide to use you as a pool cushion.

Dale

 

First of all, if you've not seen them already, look in the 348/355 section for the videos of the 355 on the 'Ring. These show you just how long, twisting, and bumpy the 'Ring is. Second, you list front drive cars as your experience. Given this, I would not jump right into something as hard core as the Lotus. It'll snap on you faster than you'll realize (until it's too late) and you will be another 'Ring casualty.

Take a driver's school. Rent a more forgiving car (the Cayman and M3 with stability control on) and enjoy your Nurburgring experience. I'm jealous!

My 2 cents.

John

 

Take a driver's school. Rent a more forgiving car (the Cayman and M3 with stability control on) and enjoy your Nurburgring experience. I'm jealous!

+100

 

I have been to the 'Ring and can answer some of your questions. I'm curious - how do you intend to rent the car? What is the price?
I am purchasing a BMW 135i this year (European delivery) with the purpose of going to the 'ring. Have you considered this? It might cost less than the rental, and probably will be more fun.

There is no way on earth you should go to the 'ring for your first track event. That is stupid. I have been to many track events, but I almost had a heart attack my first lap out. On the weekends it is extremely packed. You would be a risk to others.

You may also want to make friends there and ride with someone experienced, or pay to ride in the M5 Ring-Taxi.

Also consider playing a driving simulator game to memorize the Ring (GT4, GTR2, rFactor, etc).

 

Born in Germany
Having lost lots of friends on "Der Ring"

for someone with not much experience it is a very VERY hard track to drive. Extremely long and many corners that you will not remember in a day driving there. To go drive the Ring in the first place is not the smartest idea since you have everything from tour buses to race cars going at it. You come flying through a corner only to see someone spun out in front of you and you whack him sideways. No corner workers, no yellow flags.

In one word, if you do it, do it in a regular rental don't look for HP, because HP will get you into trouble.

 

Great advice

 

This is the best way to go, at least for a really crazy fast lap! Might be fun to go out in a slow but fun to drive and forgiving rental car, but I would not push it at all and instead use a trip w/ the taxi service to enjoy some fast cornering. YMMV!

I did not make it out to the 'ring when I was in Germany back in 2000...wish I would have taken my Porsche there, but such is life...might should be glad I didn't! If it goes bad at the 'ring it can go very, VERY BAD!

 

Note, you must book Ring Taxi FAR (many months) in advance.
Info: http://ring-taxi.bmw-motorsport.com/01-B1245B3CA0A7B47897C26B3E1989499E/ring-taxi/en/meta/faq/faq.html

When you book it, you are booking the entire car for one lap. So if you are lucky, you can simply show up, find someone who is going out, and bribe them (maybe 50 EUR) for one of their three seats in the car, assuming they are not already full. Also note the Taxi usually only runs on weekends. During my weekend there it was completely booked (meaning all sessions and all seats were full).

 

Well, I just crossed driving the Ring off my to-do list. Damn!

 

Actually it's pretty bad advice, because in real life the track goes down and up like no other. You may be the champ on Gran Turismo 4 (which I assume has the most realistic stimulation and track re-imaging) but it will scare the life out of 99.99% of us. This is a fact.
---

Want good advice? Here you go: Don't even CONSIDER or THINK ABOUT taking ANY lap time the first 150-200 laps! That's a really, really stupid idea. Ones you do, you'll try harder after a few laps and BAM! you're screwed, paralyzed or dead.

The 'ring is one in a lifetime experience, try it to experience it - but drive it slowly and with all of your sences wide open because luck won't save you if a 'ring driver doesn't see you at 100 mph around the corner you've just finished. You need to use your rear mirror as much as looking ahead. Bikers shouldn't even be aloud there! Most of the time they loose the hit and take most of the damage

The scariest stuff is in the rain when people drive and spin of right after a corner with tens of cars coming right behind them and they desperately try to re-gain straight course...


Don't care if a 65 year old drives by you in his Civic, I've seen 911's being taken over by 1.6 liter vans... Some people know the track - most of the people don't...
Trying to keep up with the others is also a very, very stupid idea.



I would enjoy it and do it just for "been there done that". Don't miss the oppurtunity, you only live once.

 

What is it about the Ring and Germans? Here is a culture where NOBODY even so much as jaywalks, and then you have the Ring. I have never been, but know some biker buddies who have. They talk about people drinking beer in the staging area and then going full bore.

What a country!

Dale

 

You can't take laptimes. You enter the track at the end of a long straight, do your lap and coming back, you have to leave the track at that straight and enter the queue to drive again. Taking stopwatches with you will get you a VERY long ban from driving there, a friend of mine had a wrist watch capable of stopping times and one of the guys at the gate took it from him and only gave it back when my friend left the track later.

I haven't been there personally, but I can't imagine that anyone drinking beer there will be allowed to drive if the personnel is aware of it. And if they even notice people's watches, they'll surely notice drunks. But as I said, no personal experience here...

 

Hm..... ok. I meant in terms of memorization. I completely memorized the track by playing it in GT4 for a year. I downloaded and watched as many on-board videos I could and joined the Ringers Forum http://forum.ringersforum.com/

By the time I went to the ring, I had it memorized to the point where I could completely play it back in my head. I showed up in person, and timed it on my first lap (and every lap). It was surreal being there, because I knew it inside out, yet had never actually been there. I took my first lap extra slow. 11 minutes. My goal was to break 10 minutes that weekend. I did that on my second lap. By my 7th lap, I had broken 9 minutes. I wasn't going faster because I was timing it, BTW. It was just simply to measure what was going to be happening either way.

Had I not played GT4, I think it would have been much more dangerous - for me! I played GT4 with the steering wheel with rumble. In my opinion, GT4 has even mapped out 90% of the bumpy parts of the ring correctly.

 

I agree with Tom here. Simulation is a very, very good training tool. The latest iteration of Forza 2 on Microsoft's XBox 360 is superb, even better than the GT4 version, and can replicate not only altitude and camber changes, but even pavement grip changes. There are a number of online guides that are good too, such as the Auto Motor und Sport guide. I'll post a link when I find it.

I've had many, many friends and colleagues go over for the BMWCCA sponsored schools and other experiences and, as everywhere else, if you drive sensibly and more importantly, do your homework, you'll be fine. Yes, people get hurt and worse, but that's true on public roads. It's a fantastic course, perhaps the greatest ever. You owe yourself the trip!

 

Very interesting post.

I'm actually planning on tackling the Ring myself this year with a rental car. Not to set a particular laptime, but just to have done it once in my lifetime. I also plan on driving it on GT4 until I know it by heard. Not that difficult really, I've done it before.

I remember driving the USGP track and how puzzled I was about the car in front of me (we weren't allowed to pass) who took a very erratic line around the track. To me it all felt like an old shoe, then it dawned on me: I had played the track so many times in my F1 game, that the ideal line was a given for me, but probably not for the guy ahead.

 

Make sure that its allowed with a rental. I picked up a new car in Germany last spring and was told that cars with export plates weren't allowed on the Ring. There is a "Ring Taxi" though. BTW the Montreal GP course is open to all comers. You just have to dodge the joggers and bicyclists.

 

AFAIK you can't tell from a Euro license plate whether the car is a rental or not.

I would never do the Ring Taxi. I don't see the point in that at all. Just as I think 2 seater F1 are totally useless.