308 V12 conversion begins

It turns out there's a nap on my watch

It seemed to go in pretty well. During tomorrow's nap I'll see what the bell housing is going to look like in there.....if I can get it in there.
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Thanks.

There's nothing like making the engine 8" or 10" inches longer to eat up engine bay room. There is a little over 1" of clearance to the gas tank on the passenger side, so that's ok I think. I'm not sure yet on the drivers side with the bell housing and drop gears, I'll have a look at that tonight.

I'm a little worried about where the heck am I going to run the front header out. May up where there is a notch in the gas tank where the AC compressor was??? Maybe over the bell housing? Maybe both

I'm honesty not concerned about the change to the CG with the new engine. It's no heavier than the V8 with the supercharger was, it fact I think it's lighter and I know the weight sits a lower particularly since I just lowered crankshaft about 2.5". Moving the engine 3” forward can hurt either. I don’t think I’ll have to move the fuel tanks.

 

Oh man, I am so glad Lana NEVER looks at f-chat. You guys would have me in SOOOO much trouble......

 

I figure 15 to maybe 20 minutes at full throttle and the tanks will be dry.

 

Yeah, I want this to look stock even to a trainer observer.

It was a popular mod on the old Triumph motorcycles because the intake ports were way too small and the exhaust ports way too big. The solution was to mount the head on the engine backwards.

I had that thought for the 400 heads to get the intakes into the V by mounting the heads backwards, but decided it wouldn't help and it would cause a lot of problems. Most any head designed in the last 30 years has intake ports that are higher and straighter than the exhaust ports. The intake valves are much bigger than the exhaust valves and there's not enough metal to open up the exhaust valves to an appropriate size. The intake ports don’t normally have adequate cooling to deal with the heat of the exhaust flow. Problems like that.

If an F1 car is doing it (I think there was an old Ferrari that did it too) they would have a casting designed for it. They most likely also figure that the aerodynamic packaging is improved enough to compensate for reduced hp flowing up hill into the cylinder would cause.

 

Like a Vee drive? I hadn't thought of it, but I guess in theory it's possible. The TR trans kind of does that, I suppose you could put a v engine on that if you wanted…or just use the TR engine and save having to do any custom work except a little frame clean-up to get it in.

I don’t really have any preference for which way the engine gets mounted. It’s easier to make the frame strong I think with a longitudinal mount, and in the case of the 12 cylinder, easier to sit the engine low in the chassis but thoughs are the only things that come to mind. Transverse should be better for acceleration as the reaction loads to the engine torque distribute the load evenly to both rear tires and traction out of a right hand turn is the same as a left hand for the same reason. I think it’s all about packaging.

Don’t worry about the other question, the average person doesn’t get any part of it right and I have no idea how long it was told before it came to me and got the south pole part added to the answer. It’s any thing but obvious and you're the only one that even tried.

 

The good news is the passenger side looks pretty good and there should be 1/2" clearance to the frame when it's all done.

The drivers side....well it is a tad tight to the gas tank. I think it will go will a little bit of work on the bell housing that I was planning to do anyway....if not as Hans pointed out 15 minutes of gas is probably way too much anyway so no harm reworking the tank for the required clearance.
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Lana always had a plan for 2, but I'm pretty sure one has cured her of that. We love him, but the Chinese have it right, one is enough. Now we just need to get the rest of the world on board and there will not only be time for the Ferrari but there will still be gas available when I finally finish the thing

 

Don't be like that man......he actually just graduated to jail this past weekend. Not quite walking yet, but crawling surprisingly fast, standing and walking while holding the wall, sofa and such then falling and screaming.....and clearly understanding "NO" only means "NO" if you are within arms length of him. Lana came home Saturday with a big playpen to lock him up in.

 

The picture doesn't show it that well, it's really hard to take a picture the shows what you can see looking at it, something always seems to be lost.

I think I'm OK with the water/oil pump. It clears the gas tank by over an inch. I was a little concerned about frame clearancefor the oil pan, but I think I'm ok there too. On the stock 400 pan there is about a 1/4" step up right behind the flange and if I build mine the same way I get about 1/2 clearance to the frame.

What's been going through my mind is actuall sliding the engine another 1/2" to the right to make more room for the bell housing. I still have to add flanges on both ends or the rails I just made, so a small shift wouldn't add any work I don't think. I'll have a look at the tonight.

 

Yes the pan need to be different. With the extra length the oil starvation issue should get much worse so I will be converting to a dry sump.

In frame clearance problem area the only purpose a step in the pan could serve is to trap a little oil near the chain, and I would still need that so just copying or even slightly increasing the step should be a good thing....I think.....