Driver etiquette question... your opinion?

Ok everyone, I have one of those "what should I have done" questions.

It has been a while since I've had the 308 out, so yesterday being a beautiful day, I took a little ride. It was a rural road drive, south of Denver, where ALOT of motorcycles cruise. Because it was warm, everyone was out, including the motorcycles. (BTW I'm a motorcycle owner/driver too, but I've been spending more time on the 308 for the last 6 months or so.)

I had been about 1 hour in on my "cruising loop" and I ended up behind 4 harleys on a 2 lane rural highway. All were going a pretty good speed, 70 to 75 or so in a 65, and I wasn't "racing" so I was comfortable just staying behind them. I stayed behind for maybe 10 miles or so, maybe 20. Then, the last harley waved me by, he pulled right and clearly waved me by. I didnt really need nor want to pass them as they would end up following me closely because I wasnt going to go faster than thier rate of speed. But because he was waving me by, I drop it down a gear (since they were going faster than posted to begin with) and passed him.

Here's the problem, as I passed him, I really didnt have enough room to clear all 4 bikes, so after passing 3 of the 4, I had to "dive back in" to the right lane behind the 1st lead bike. After topping the hill, I dropped it down and passed the last one.

So, I get in front of them, going faster than I really wanted to, and ended up stopping at a stoplight and the guys on the harleys caught up with me and were kinda yelling and revving thier engines, like I did something wrong, maybe the "dive in" was too close?

I wanted to get out of the car and apologize to the bikers, didnt mean to cut them off, I was perfectly happy following them and the only reason I did was because i was waved by. All of them were "yuppie" harley riders (no offense to owners here as I own a BMW yuppie bike) so I knew I wouldnt have been in a overly risky confrontation, but I was still not willing to get out of the car.

Whats your opinion?
A) I shouldnt have passed regardless of the 4th bike waving me by.
B) I passed and the "dive in" was unavoidable, so since I was waved by, it wasnt my fault.
C) I should have only passed 1 bike at a time and not worried about offending the bikers
D) Regardless of pass/no pass, I should have followed the bikers to a gas station or stop and apologized to them as a fellow biker.
E) Other suggestions?

James in Denver

 

As a Duc rider I don't think I would've minded a kindred Italian diving into my formation

I'm going with (A). If you didn't feel you could've made a safe complete pass you should've waited until you judged it safe to do so, regardless of what the trailing rider was 'telling' you. If you simply misjudged all you can do is try to communicate acknowledgement with a wave - rare is the verbal exchange after a rider feels affronted that the offending cager is not berated, regardless of position! Often leads to escalation.

 

James,

This may be a case where your overanalyzing it all anyhow. I don't see how you did anything that would cause an uproar so I am thinking that perhaps they were just horse playing because you were in a Ferrari, and after all we all get that kind of attention (it comes along with Ferrari ownership). So maybe they were just revving & giving you sh*t just because you were in a 308. Plus I would bet that later in the ride the last rider will have told the rest of the "gang" he had waived you by earlier. So now they know.

And on a personal note: No offense meant but now & then we people think we cause more of a reaction then we actually do. We just assume people are all worked up over something we did, but in reality we are just not that big of a deal in other peoples lives.

BTW, I ride a BMW bike. And I am always barkn' about the way 308 drivers drive when I see them too!

 

Survey sayz..................."A"

 

A, E

However, I don't really understand the physical description of the situation.

What do you mean you didn't have enough room to clear all bikes? What do you mean that you HAD to dive back in? I don't get it. Was there a stone wall in the left lane preventing you from continuing on? What is it that really forced you to sort of cut off the biker?

In other words, where was each of the four bikes, and where were you, at the very beginning when you were behind? Were there two bikes in the left lane next to each other, two in the right lane next to each other, with each set of bikes directly next to each other in separate lanes? Or were the two sets of bikes in different latitudinal locations? Or was each of the four bikes in a different location on the highway with no bike next to him either in his own lane or the lane to the side? There are about a hundred possible permutations, so I would need clarification in order to understand where everyone was.

I say A and E because, first, you didn't really want to pass to begin with; and secondly, since you did pass, you might have just waited in the left lane until everyone moved over so that you could safely pass the whole crowd.

I can relate to your situation a little bit because I find that the Harley guys much of the time are rude and unfriendly. I don't mean to say all, but many. They sort of think they own the road and that they have a monopoly on driving ability and etiquette. I feel like they feel that drivers around them are frequently doing something wrong. I've been yelled at by Harley guys, and I frequently see them yelling at other drivers. Again, I am not putting all Harley guys into this category, but there is something about the typical Harley guy. And hey, I am a rider with a bike license, so I'm not a bike hater. On the other hand, I acknowledge that motorcycles are the fastest vehicles on the road, and they surely can maneuver however they wish to ensure their own safety. If they are blocking a lane, they ought to just speed up or move out of the way. If they don't, they shouldn't get angry when a guy passes them closely.

 

I've run into stuff like this before. I always recall what my dad told me. "Just drive your car[sic], and let the other guy drive his". If you didn't want to pass, just wave back and shake your head. Once started, do what you gotta do.

 

James, its probably one of those damned if ya do, damned if ya dont kind of deals. I look upon a group of Harleys simular as I would a funeral procession. Dont pass, dont cut in, and dont get in thier way.

I mean no offense to the good guys who ride Harleys, and there are many of you out there, but there are quite a few you would rather not meet. And if you see anyone in a pack wearing any kind of colors, assume the worse.

I would have stayed back, pulled over, or made a U-turn and got lost some other direction, but no way I would have ever passed any of them. Its one of those situations where being right isnt always the best move.

 

Thanks for the advice so far, I think I posted this because I really didnt want to pass, so I should have just stayed back. Several people have already said A, which was a leading answer but probably the best thing I should have done (and will do next time).

But because of the questions above, let me clarify.
This situation was on a rural 2 lane highway (one lane each way, 2 lanes total, not 4). The 4 bikes were in the normal staggered positions, but the 4th one waving me by slowed down to let me pass, the 2 infront of him seemed to slow as well. The lead bike did not slow down so as I overtook #3 and #2, I started going up hill and the markings turned into a no-passing lane and visibility dropped as I begin climbing the hill. I thought if just trudging on, but if someone had topped the hill, I would have had no time to react, so I had no choice but to "dive right" in front of bike #2 between lead and #2.

And overall, Harley riders here are ok, most obey the speed limits, drive safely, drive in appropriate packs (4 staggered, the space, then 4 more). Occassionally, there are "jerks" on bikes, as there are in cars, but these guys seemed pretty cool, I just didnt like the "revving of the engine" at the stoplight, like I did something wrong.

Hopefully, the last bike told his buddies at a later stop that he waved me thru, so they'll realize I wasn't being a jerk.

James in Denver

 

Some of the hard core Harley riders will raise hell at anyone not driving "American made". When I was a motor cop back in the 80's we were riding Kawasaki KZ1000P police bikes. Everytime I pulled over one of the local "club" riders they would give me hell for not riding an "american bike". My response was always, "it belongs to the city so write a letter to the Mayor"! Would you believe some of them DID! lol Other comments from them was "I can't believe you are riding that Jap Crap"! To which I responded, "This Jap Crap ran YOU down didn't it"! hahaha I miss the good ole days! So anyway...your situation may have just been once they saw you were driving something other than American made they felt it necessary to voice their opinions. Just one other option. Joe

 

i wouldnt have passed....given the mileage of travel for speed, you would have had to do 80 miles an hour and over. Not to keen on that for a public road. Easier to drop the gear and let the revs down as well to do 50, they would have carried on there way, and you avoid a potential hassel. I do the same when i encounter the ricer crowd on the road...no need for any of it....it certainly doesnt benefit you.
Enjoy the ride mate !

 

Ah ah. I got it. My mistake.

 

E. - Don't worry about it.

If I knew I were within a reasonable distance of an intersection, I wouldn't make a pass, as whoever is in front of me might turn off there. (Also don't want to be embarassed sitting at a light and their catching up.)

If someone waves me to pass and I don't want to, then I do a wave or two back kind of in a shaking my hand "no" motion and drop back a little bit.

In the middle of passing a line of vehicles, though -- even if they're together -- if you have to duck back in, then you have to duck back in. It would have been polite for the first rider to make a little extra effort to let you by, or, conversely, it would have been polite for the second rider to let you in. I would have.

 

You should have waved off the pass if it meant you were passing the Speed Limit to complete it..there's no fine print that says "80MPH in the mountains is ok if you are on the wrong side of the road"....LOL!

Ditto everything Paul said...I had a run in with a Bike Gang once and they threatened my new wife on the phone, not knowing she worked for AT&T.......but that's the mindset ..best avoided.

I would have turned and gone another way, too!

 

They probably got pissed cause you made him spill his none fat, no foam, hazelnut latte from starbucks onto his newly pressed armani shirt.

 

They should have written a letter to the mayor. The government has a duty to buy American and support American Industry.

 

Not sure how many there are here but I am a long time Harley rider and 308 owner. Probably a small club around these parts .

I think the WAVE (wave in, wave over, wave on) is one the MOST DANGEROUS of all signs while operating any vehicle. Think about it. How many four-lane situations have you heard about where traffic was stopped and backed up in one lane and some well-meaning clown in the backed up lane waves in a "left-turner"? Then, Mr. Waved In left turner gives it the gas blissfully unaware of "fast lane" dude running wide open and smashes into Mr. Waved In.

The guys riding up front were probably totally clueless about what that guy in the back was doing. Of course, you had to merge in versus hitting someone head on.

Difficult situation. Glad no one was hurt.

Seamus

 

Its your duty as piloto to blow em all away everyday,granted Dino,s cant get to the front against all the competion these days but you must try. As to taking motorbikes like hogs they are done @ 80 areodynamically and you should get nearly 90mph at the top of 3rd. A downshift to 3rd @ 75mph would put you at 7grand and then a quick rip to 8,adios.

 

F. this time you get behind them and run over them instead

 

+2.

 

What do you expect from a bunch of Harley riders? Jeez. If they were smart, they would have been on a real motorcycle.

 

While getting away from the subject of the OP, my Dads 51' panhead would run well over 100 all day long with or without the windshield. While some of the modern 80 cuber cruiser bikes might be done at around 80, something older, especially something with a built S&S could give you a real surprise. They all arent as slow as some might like to think.

As far as being smart and owning a Harley, if you read back in history about motorcycles, the V-twin has been around since the very beginning. All the classic Indians were V-twin. Lawrence of Arabia rode a Brough Superior, a V-twin, arguably one of the finest older motorcycles ever built. The Vincent Black Shadow was a V-twin, the fastest motorcycle built until the modern age. Douglas made a V-twin as well as MotoGuzzi and Ducati, and today we now have Victory making a modern version. And in the engineering field, any opposed engine is also a V, such as the Boxer/TR Ferrari 12 cylinder, its a V-12. So then too are the BMW motorcycle opposed twins. They have tried many designs over the last 130 years, and the V-twin keeps hanging on, simply because its the most intelligent and simplest design. What I laugh at the most, is how Honda and the Jap crowd tried in vain to kill off Harley, and in the end all they can seem to do is make bikes that "look" like Harleys.

 

I think the story is fake!
#1 Harleys around here hog the road and roll below the speed limit.
#2 They sure don't have the good sense to pull to the side or wave you by when they can.

Just kidding, Don't worry about it, the last bike probably told his buddys he brought you around.

 

Side note. Porsche owns 49% of HD stock.
Charles

 

False.