Roy, I'm of the opinion that you don't need this guy to sue you to get the ball rolling with your insurance company. If it was me, I'd contact the insurance company today and tell them of the potential loss. They can start investigating before any suit is filed.
Roy I think you have a lot of spirit and Love for Lambo's and that is a good thing. I also think that inadvertently you are on the hook for the full purchase price, taxes etc. I may be wrong but that is what I think. I think you should do the right thing and work with Josh to make him whole and go after the one's who sold you a car with defective title. I agree that this has taken on a life of it's own and that isn't good or fair to anyone. I'm not your enemy. I think your exuberance sometimes takes you down the wrong path but none of us should throw the first stone as we've all made mistakes. Best
Roy I am in no way insuating that you are a "shady dealer". I simply pointed out the fact that as this continues more and more of your potential clients will see it and make their judgements as they may by how you handle this situation. I am still a dealer although I do not have a large retail operation any longer. My situation was similar as I bought a car from a dealer who bought it from a wanted drug dealer. I sold it to a (luckily) friend who was followed and detained while the car was parked at an Orlando area hotel. The US marshall's service impounded the car and let the driver free once he produced ID.I replaced the car the very next day and paid some of the expenses of the driver. I went back to the dealer I bought the car from who refunded my $52k from their bonding company who was ultimately made whole by the insurance company. I agree that there was little Roy could have known when he bought the car. The new procedure I follow is, whenever I buy a car ,unless it is through an auction, I do not accept re-assigned titles. I insist that the selling dealer title the car in their name and then assign it to me. Whenever I keep a car in stock I retitle it my dealership name. Again Roy I don't know you and am not making any judgements, just pointing out how easily a problem like this can follow you . Best
As I am required by my insurance carrier, yes they have already been notified of the potential loss. But of course, which I have no control over, they just make a note of it and OF COURSE do nothing unless a demand is made of them. I CAN NOT make the demand as they have already told me, "if you wish to pay it go, ahead, but you give up all rights for US to deal with the claim" and they are 100% correct. It is THEIR job to deal with this...that is why time after time after time, I HAVE told JOSH, GET A LAWYER and start the ball rolling!! The other thing that HAS been MISSED here, is if JOSH would have gottent a LAWYER the minute this happened AS HE WAS ADVISED TO DO..he more than likely would have had his car back by now...leaving the leasing company to come after him...which of course they have no leg to stand on...the other two buyers did the right thing. GOT A LAWYER same day, marched into court and had the writ reversed and their cars back to them...BUT NOT JOSH..he sits on his but crying and not taking action... AND for THIS I am wrong? I have to fork out $110K for him and PRAY I get my money back? I have done everything I could for JOSH..But NOW as he has psoted on another thread less than 30 minutes ago...HE STILL has NO LAWYER, but he has wasted his time calling the tow company and learned that the car was picked up by the leasing company and on its way back to the East Coast..so now your chances are even slimer.. The leasing company rolled the dice, they lost with two of the cars, but appears they will win with one of them...smart business, may not be ethical, but smart business... Maybe instead of thrashing me that I am the bad guy...we should all MAKE SURE we do not use this leasing company for any reason, in the WHOLE EXOTIC community...why not pressure them, see what happens when they have no more clients wanting to lease cars??
The only party at fault here is the lease company, but buying from a dealer is supposed to give the buyer some peace of mind that is why dealers are usually more expensive than private sellers. I don't know about US law but I can tell you that under british law the dealer is responsible in a situation like this and it is then the dealers responsibility to claim back his money from whoever he bought the car from. I don't know josh or roy but i believe that both are victims of fraud and i hope this will get sorted sooner or later, but in the mean time josh should be sueing roy because roy is the dealer that sold him the car wether the profit roy made was $250000 or $2500 is besides the point he has a responsibility towards his customer. The good point here is that roy is not denying the fact that josh is a victim and should be compensated, but josh should also HELP roy by sueing him. It's hard being a car dealer eventhough it can be fun and the financial gains can be really good, but it's so much hard work. Maybe as a sign of goodwill Roy and josh can work together and Roy could pay for josh's lawyer just to speed up the matter, because the longer this takes the more likely the leasing company, the lv dealer, and roy will benefit, and josh will lose. That car will sooner or later be back at the leasing company and they will auction it off and then the matter will be even more complicated. Josh, Roy has made it clear that he will not give you a refund unless you start legal proceedings against him. SO DO IT! He is asking you to do it. He wants you to do it. If you can't afford it for some reason talk with him, maybe he will help towards your legal costs just to prove that customer satisfaction is above all at his dealership. Either way you will have to sue roy with his help or without because he will not pay you back before you do. Good luck and get a lawyer.
Thanks I appreciate your forwardness and sugestions. I also do title quite a few of the cars I keep in stock into the dealer name as well.. BUT in this case EVEN had the title been in the Las Vegas Dealer name or transfered to my name, we would still be in the same boat, it would just have been 2 more names added to title transfers..it is just a shame this happened...and I am still beating my brains out trying to come up with a way that this could never happen again...short of using the Title Insurance company I found..I can not think of anything else??
What? Are you saying I'm thrashing you? Please clarify........... I only suggested you contact your insurance company, which it appears you already have.
Any word on if 360 has found himself a lawyer ? As some others said...i found it shady that the leasing company sent this guy 3 clean titles...I wouldnt be surprised to find that the accussed wasnt working alone.
...instead of spending 2 days putting it on ANY exotic forum on the world wouldn't not be better to even give a call to an attorney??? i think he would suggest the way to go through this thing
No not at all, came out wrong...that is aimed more at the L-Power thread...starting to get confusing bouncing back and forth between the two.. Sorry again
I can report I just spoke to JOSH. He has STILL not found or retained a Lawyer as of 10 minutes ago. I AGAIN advised him PLEASE PLEASE go find one and have them start the ball rolling to me and my insurance company.. I can not make it any plainer than that!!
Quick question / observation -- and please excuse my ignorance on the matter having never been a dealer -- why isn't there some sort of national "database" of liens / amounts owed which all banks / lenders / lease companies could report to? Something as simple as VIN # and amount owed to such and such bank would seem like a quick and easy way for dealers to verify this information. The title checks, while a necessary part of any transaction, don't appear to be adequate enough as this scenario clearly illustrates. In other words, loan / lien report tied to VIN (and whatever other crucial info. necessary) = no sale until situation is cleared up. Apparently, there are way too many "work-arounds" to titles these days. Just grasping for straws here on how buyers (like myself) and dealers can protect themselves even further from things like this happening. I'd sure hate to be in the middle of this as well -- at any level -- but especially as the buyer...
This is making my head hurt... Why hasnt this dude retained a lawyer ?? Its so hard to imagine that he doesnt have a single family/friend he can ask for a referral ? Thats how I got my first attorney..I asked someone I knew that was successful. Not rocket science. Im wondering if maybe he did blow his wad on the car and doesnt have the financial resources ? That would really suck for him.
To answer your question, there is...AND HAD the leasing company filed a Lien, which is very simple electronicaly in 1 minute..when we did our search, when Las Vegas car delaer did his search..it would have been caught and this deal would never have happened.. BUT the leasing company FAILED to do just that...why I have no idea...
This thread has been very informative. Probably one of the most useful threads ever. There's still something shady about this whole story though.
Wow. Interesting thread here. Can't believe he hasn't found a lawyer yet. He can afford a Gallardo, cash, and doesn't know a lawyer or anyone who knows a lawyer? Yikes. I could pick up the phone and dial tons of people who know lawyers. Hell, if you are an employee of a decent size company, which I would assume you are if you can afford a Gallardo, just have them ask their legal department to recommend something. I don't find it odd that he may have never needed a lawyer before, but I do find it odd that he can't find one. Roy, as odd as it sounds, can't your lawyer just find one for him? Yours obviously deals with this stuff, so I'm sure he knows others.
that was spoken in generality and wasn't directed at you, dave...... . i think roy is a bit fatique at being beaten.....
I do feel horribly bad for this kid as he is undoubtedly a victim; but he seems to enjoy the spectable and the attention it generates. His story has more gaps than a poorly built replica. This hasn't been helpful to his creditability.
It certainly looks that way. It is quite apparent that Josh loves the limelight, but this is getting out of hand. On the other thread, he even asked members what time he should set his alarm clock for today. I can't believe that this is anything more than a means to garner attention. No one can be this clueless. No one.
There is a way to check the titles to see if they have liens and both dealers did that. The title was CLEAR with NO liens
To any "real' judge out there, we need your help on this matter: Individual #1 buys a car from dealer A who bought the car from dealer B who bought the car from individual #2 who was leasing the car from leasing company #1 and did not own the car. Leasing company #1 determines that individual #2, to whom they sent a clear title, apparently has broken his lease, sold the car and, as they say in Las Vegas, "has left the room," in this case the country. Leasing company #1 hires a private detective to find the car, gets a court order and has the police in California take possession of the car from hapless (and clueless) Individual #1. Individual #1 obviously becomes upset, since he has done nothing wrong, and like many other exotic owners before him, takes his case to the court of public opinion, i.e., the interent, to find out what they think of this matter, since most chatters (myself included) are experts on just about everything and are quick to comment on anything, despite a lack of expert witness credentials. Thankfully, judge, this testimony is not taking place in your courtroom, or else you would have had the place cleared immediately. In any event, the Chat Court has apparently made the following rulings: A) Individual #1 is an innocent victim, but needs to direct his energies to finding a lawyer and taking his complaint to the proper court of law and quit getting everybody on the chat room all riled up. We have other, more important things to worry about here, such as carbon fiber, exhaust sounds, CS stripes, market prices, etc. B) Dealer A, who has taken a lot of heat over all of this, and is also an unwitting victim, is having trouble making people understand that in order for him to do right by Individual #1, Individual #1 must begin legal proceedings against Dealer A, who will then begin proceedings against Dealer B, who will........I know, you're not an idiot and you get the picture, but some of us chatters lose sight of what's been said thus far. C) Dealer B so far is silent and may not even be aware of what's been happening in the chat world. Let's keep it that way until this matter gets to court. D) Leasing Company #1 is not too bright to have sent a clear title to Individual #2 and eventually is going to have to face up to this in court. So, your honor, the question is: can we request this matter be put on hold until a proper lawsuit is filed and judgment rendered? Do I hear an Amen on that? Now, to change the subject, Does anyone know of any home foreclosures that can be had without going through escrow? I have cash.
