Miura, the original supercar | Page 157 | FerrariChat

Miura, the original supercar

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by joe sackey, Dec 5, 2006.

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  1. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 7, 2004
    16,798
    Toronto
    Full Name:
    Vasco
    Hi Joe. Hope you join us again soon from another one of your hiatis' :)

    Just at the office and was browsing the registry. I was very happy to find that 4 very special Miuras including two record selling Miuras have passed through Toronto at some point. As a Torontonian this brings great pleasure. As i've told you before, here in Canada such cars are extremly rare.

    http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/Miura/MiuraSV/4968.html
    http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/Miura/MiuraS/4401.html
    http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/Miura/Miura/3063.html

    Also, a friend of mine named Edmund who is a collector once had 2 Miuras and I wonder where they went. Not that I am saying any of these are his. He also had a Carb'd 512BB, a rolls and other cars I had on congisnment at my place. Wonder if you'd know the name? It was before the "bubble" and he hates to remember how low he sold the Miuras for :D

    On that Toronto note I also saw that the Miura ILZRO ZN75 Spyder at one point was on display at the Ontario Science center! It would be awesome to see pics of the car at this even.

    http://www.lamborghiniregistry.com/Miura/MiuraSpyder/MiuraSV3498.html
     
  2. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 27, 2005
    535
    east coast
    Full Name:
    Craig
    #3902 P400, May 8, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Joe, Any chance this is enough black and white photo info to ID this particular brand new USA SV?
    NY Guys, How did NY dealer tags work with date stickers? this one shows 12-71, so what period was it good for? 70-71? 71-72? i realize the dealer may be using out of date tags.
    any help is appreciated
    Craig
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  3. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Looks vaguely familiar :)

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  4. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Thanks Ray...


    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  5. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    This car still has the 7" rear wheels that Alfredo Pedretti (of Modena Racing Car Co the official concessionaire of the period) delivered the cars with. On my former 5064's bill of Sale, it noted two 9" rear wheels as if they were supplied extra. Dont ask me why - I dont know.

    This car is a second series USA SV (one of the 13 split sump cars) as those came with the side-marker light bezels finished in chrome-over-plastic and they sat above the recess as opposed to the flush satin-black units in the 8 single-sump cars. Also the 8 single sump cars had the 200mph speedos.

    If knew what color combination the car in your pic is I could definitely tell you the chassis number.

    As for the dealer plate, Im fortunate to still have the one for my car but unless you worked for the NY DMV, how on earth do we know what period the tags cover?? Thats one of your famous question Craig :) I can tell you that mine says 10/71, not that it means anything to me. Personally I think that would mean when it expires..... whatever. This one looks really beaten up even in the period as mine was before I had it restored. Are you sure its not a photoshop? :) Im actually surprised to see one on yet another SV since Pedretti actually used my 4884 as his personal car before selling it and left the plate in 4884 when it went to Robinson. Perhaps he had more that one dealer plate, although he had a partner Alberto Caiti so multiple dealer plates wouldn't surprise.....

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  6. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Very cool!

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  7. P400

    P400 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 27, 2005
    535
    east coast
    Full Name:
    Craig
    Joe, i dont know the color combo yet. yes, it does have a 5 set of 7.5" wheels. what is the list of second series USA SV chassis numbers, please?
    Craig
     
  8. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
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    Joe Sackey
    8 cars were the first series (single sump engines)
    13 car were the second series (split sump engines)

    My list of both cars is with the publisher, but it is well-defined. I shall get to it later. If I had to hazard a guess the car imaged is 5018, blue with blue interior.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  9. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    #3909 joe sackey, May 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Craig here is one for you:

    Here is the emergency triangle kit that my 4884 has. It is embossed by the manufacturer with the depiction of the rear end of a Miura, clearly made exclusively for these cars.

    Were these exclusive to the 21 USA SVs? Did all 21 USA SVs have them in the trunk?

    The owner of another aforementioned SV that also has this rare unit in the trunk can feel free to chime in...

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
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  10. xs10shl

    xs10shl Formula 3

    Dec 17, 2003
    2,037
    San Francisco
    #3910 xs10shl, May 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  11. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    Joe Sackey
    So mine is from 1971 and yours is from 1972?

    Oh the details...

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  12. xraygun

    xraygun Karting

    Feb 5, 2008
    82
    New Orleans, LA
    Full Name:
    Ray Henderson
    Can anyone comment on the major differences the split sump makes in the cars? Is it important enough to upgrade a single sump engine? Is that even doable? What problems do single sump cars suffer from with the sharing of the lubricant? Do some drivers have dual dry sump setups as insurance?


    thanks,
    xraygun
     
  13. xs10shl

    xs10shl Formula 3

    Dec 17, 2003
    2,037
    San Francisco
    Firstly, splitting the sump is totally doable by a competent mechanic, and seems to be a frequently done modification during an overhaul. People appear to want to pay a premium for cars which have had this modification done, so it may pay for itself on resale.

    I for one think that it is really only necessary if you're planning on adding a limited slip differential, but I'm sure you'll get others with stories of gearbox shavings and the like in the fluid (some of these stories may be from owners who mistook broken starter gear pieces for gearbox pieces). But if you use a magnetic drain plug and change the oil frequently, you'll probably be fine. In fact, there was a discussion earlier which suggested that since most people wont drive the car for a long enough period of time to even warm the gearbox oil up, you might even be better off leaving it a common sump.

    It has not been my experience that a split sump car shifts any faster, which would be nice if it did.
     
  14. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    I agree with your sentiments. In fact, if you're not driving it on the track you don't need it.

    But if you'd like to pay a premium for one, please don't let me stop you.

    Regular oil changes should be the mantra of every single Miura owner. Essential.

    Having owned a few of both, I will say that in my experience single sump gearboxes appear to warm up quicker and shift more fluidly. Either that or my current originally single sump (unmodified) Miura SV has a really good gearbox...

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  15. xraygun

    xraygun Karting

    Feb 5, 2008
    82
    New Orleans, LA
    Full Name:
    Ray Henderson
    Thanks to both of you for the excellent replies. Is there any issue on oil starvation on hard cornering with either setup? What's the oil pump setup/pickup on the engine?
    xraygun
     
  16. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    Joe Sackey
    There can be starvation issues under sustained hard cornering in any Miura, but, if one is overly concerned there is a deeper sump application that Bob Wallace has often added, with additional baffles to combat oil migration under cornering and ensure constant oil pickup - to a degree.

    If you're Mario Andretti on the other hand, you could always opt for Wallace's dry sump kit that uses modified components supplied by Weaver Brothers Dry Sump Pumps in Nevada. Then you can run your Miura at Le Mans in confidence!

    But down here on god's green earth where the rubber hits the road, some of us have done just fine for years & years using the cars just as they were built save the addition of a magnetic drain plug. The proviso is that you shift gears properly, change the oil frequently, and for heaven's sake its not a racing car :)

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  17. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
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    Joe Sackey
    By the way let me add that I have been made to understand by men who actually worked at the factory in Miura production that engineer Stanzani mandated splitting the sump on the last 96 cars partially as a means of insulating the factory from the liability of replacing engines damaged due to oil starvation. The original Miura engine concept of a single sump was deviated from because it was thought that customers would want to drive the cars really hard - and some did, judging by the number of units that the factory replaced in the glory days! But that was in the era of non-existent speed limits in many places when young owners were eager to impress their girlfriends with top speed achievements... with what you can do to a Miura today (and not risk lives or flout the law) a well-maintained single sump unit is just fine, and we are seeing Miuras routinely running in rallies such as the Tour Auto and other events without any issues.

    Also my prior comments about the gearbox in a single sump car are obvious: the shared lubrication will warm up doubly quick due to the engine's activity as the 'box is not insulated (isolated), and I find that engine oil makes for a nice slick lubrication in a gearbox of this type :)

    A funny story: A good friend/client of mine was about to spend a million bucks on a nice SV. He said he was rather impressed by the fact that it had factory split sump unit. I asked what he thought the benefits of it were to him. He calmly replied: "Joe, I have no idea, but I know I WANT IT"

    :)

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  18. xraygun

    xraygun Karting

    Feb 5, 2008
    82
    New Orleans, LA
    Full Name:
    Ray Henderson
    That's kind of what I thought was going on. Hilarious story Joe.

    Thanks for the detailed info. I'm clear on the concept now.

    xraygun
     
  19. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Hey, you came to the right place...


    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  20. bax

    bax Karting

    Dec 23, 2006
    118
    Anyone know (& willing to share) the results for the 3 miura & 1 urraco listed.

    Did they sell?

    Mbax.
     
  21. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
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    Joe Sackey
    #3921 joe sackey, May 11, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I know they had this P400S (lime green) 3922, and a P400 3645 but don't know what they went for... anybody? Im sure Coys will post it on their site later in the week.


    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
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  22. hammermfg

    hammermfg Karting

    Apr 10, 2006
    60
    Those mirrors don't really suit the car. Besides, doesn't look like they'd offer much rear visibility anyhow...
     
  23. Carsleuth

    Carsleuth F1 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2006
    4,331
    Chicago/NYC
    Full Name:
    Dan C.
    The miura was ahead of it's time in so many ways.
     
  24. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
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    Joe Sackey
    These are interesting aftermarket items that Ive never seen before and I have to agree they don't help the car' appearance - the Sebring units as used by the factory almost look designed for the car IMHO.


    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  25. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Please elaborate...


    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     

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