MEGA THREAD : PORSCHE VS. NISSAN : New GTR : 7:15 around the Nurburgring?

The only reason it's is soooo fast is that the chassis was developed by F Alsonso. (I got this from and inside source an Renault.) HEE HEE.
After all Renault does own Nissan. It may be a last ditch effort to save face in their own back yard before the new Honda is introduced.

Wait, Wait, look up in the sky, I think it's a ringer, yep It is a ringer. I hear it whine from here.

 

The driver of the GTR at the One Lap said the car is horrible in the damp and wet....so why the hell bother with AWD?

Everyday more weird things come about....there is something very fishy about this car if you ask me!

 

That's funny....guess you don't know to much about the corporate world....it's full of lies.

 

Ah yes that's it!

 

Notice below that cheating isnt out of the question when it comes to Nissan. The same publication using professional drivers, the pre production car was able to achieve a time of around 29sec faster than the production car.




7:59* -- 154.82 km/h -- Nissan Skyline R33 GT-R (www.autocar.co.uk)


8:28.1 - 145.98 km/h -- Nissan Skyline GTR (www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/228511/)

 

Despite a few difficulties, in the end the car was praised for its comfort level and ample luggage capacity for the week long journey......lol

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/15/stock-nissan-gt-r-fares-well-in-one-lap/

 

In a world of exotic supercars the GTR simply doesnt have the look, emotion or the light weight. In a world of luxury cars the GTR doesnt have the comfort, the room and the usable features. In a world of utility well the GTR cant really do anything very usefull.

Where it excells at is in the play station generation, the problem is that not many of them can afford a car like the GTR.

 

seems like a good car.

Stock Nissan GT-R fares well in One Lap
Posted May 15th 2008 6:02PM by Merritt Johnson
Filed under: Motorsports, Sports/GTs, Nissan


Photo by Mary Seelhorst

Slightly over shadowed by all the drama surrounding the Vanishing Point Dodge Challenger, Car and Driver competed in the 2008 One Lap of America event behind the wheel of a stock Nissan GT-R. Typically a magazine editor going for an extended joy ride in a pre-production sports car isn't expected to severely push the vehicle's limits, which is why Tony Swan cruised to a decent 11th place overall finish in the event. Not a bad placement, but also apparently not good enough for some, as interested internet anti-fanboys have taken the opportunity to criticize the car based on its performance in the vent. However, the negative commentators neglected to take into account the seriousness of the top vehicles and their veteran drivers.

After spending one-on-one quality time with the GT-R, Mr. Swan also sings a slightly different song than some. He agrees that it is blistering quick, but maybe not as easy to drive as some have lead you to believe. The wide open track at Road America let Nissan's lovechild stretch its legs, but scaling down the venue did not directly translate. The Bridgestone run flat tires and inherent low speed understeer were a handful in wet and tight corner conditions. Perhaps it might have behaved the same way at the autocross venue, but lack of cone dodging experience (or more likely the lack of cones to dodge) led to a DNF for the car in the parking lot event. The drag strip also unveiled the GT-R electrical system's lack of launch control intuitiveness, as quarter mile staging methods interfered with the system's engagement. Despite a few difficulties, in the end the car was praised for its comfort level and ample luggage capacity for the week long journey. Thanks for the tip, Rexhavoc!

 

Performance in the wet is heavily dependent on tire specification. Tire choice can be a much bigger factor than drive layout. The RE070 run-flats on the GT-R are dry road performance tires.

 

Then by your logic, neither does the CTS-V video because at least the GT-R video has a timer, and a constant camera view on the driver instead of rapidly changing angles.

Note, that I'm not saying the CTS-V cheated, but that your hypocrisy is showing again.

 

May be wrong info but I saw this on 6speedonline regarding the GTR.

I have spoken to one of the R&T editors, who was kind enough to take the time to discuss the provenance of the GT-Rs used in testing. That conversation relates to this thread as follows: Nissan provided 3 GT-Rs for testing to the automotive press. A white, a silver, and a Black one. The black one was damaged somehow and was kept in reserve for parts. All three cars are US spec, but are definitely pre-production, and are classified as "engineering test cars", which is the only way they are legal for registration and operation on US roads. Once their lifecycle is done (90 days), they go to the crusher. This explains the caveats by C&D, and MT regarding the performance, and the extraordinary dyno result produced by the silver car.


That SAME silver car, with Michigan plates, is the one now competing in the One Lap. It is therefore NOT a production car, and if the dyno is any indication, is making a lot more power than the production car's certified 480.


I agree with Wanderer Z06 that this has no real bearing on the OneLap since it's a run-what-you-brung race, but the GT-R fanoys have been claiming all along that a production GT-R is outperforming the stock Z06s and that is simply not true.


The R&T editor also said that this car is causing a major ruckus in the auto press and that some mags are rethinking their testing procedures with respect to manufacturer-supplied vehicles. Automobile reportedly declined to test the Nissan at this time because the cars supplied were not production cars. Expect that trend to be followed by others henceforward, he said.


also


Turns out Nissan was sneaking (cheating) around a tech to all the various events to make sure the car didnt break, and when the driver screwed up the launch a the drags, the tech magically showed up to make sure he didnt screw it up again. They are some sneaky little buggers. They've been having problems with the tranny sending the car into limp mode and it's pretty bad in Japan to where they are making changes prior to releasing to the US. Leh said he SAW (not heard lol) black smoke coming from the rear of the car at the strip and the car was covered in soot on the back (enter japanese technician).

#1 That's cheating #2 It didnt help.

 

Guess your a little slow? I never said the Caddy vid "proved" anything.

 

If you want to throw insults around, then you're one to talk. It would be "you're", not "your".

 

Problem is that FA doesn't stick around long enough to do any worthwhile projects for the corporate. Too bad because he contributed .5 seconds to last years' McLaren with his superior development work... I am sure his input on the V-Spec would be priceless...

 

Whine whine whine. Since it's a Nissan it can't do anything... You people need to get a life.

 

An automotive journalist doesn't know the difference between his ass and a hole in the ground, particularly Tony Swan who endangered numerous spectators in 'his' GT-R:

http://blog.cardomain.com/blog/2008/05/this-is-why-we.html

For those too lazy to click:

Tony Swan of Car and Driver, who ran the Nissan GT-R in this year's One Lap of America, has apparently gotten a lot of static about finishing "only" 11th in the overall standings and feels understandably prevailed upon to justify the much-hyped supercar's performance. But oddly, the article that appears for this purpose on the Car and Driver website mostly just comes across as a load of whiny diapers. Though he blames everything from tires to computer technology, much of the apologia centers on the "fateful" autocross challenge at BeaveRun, where Tony got confused and went off course, resulting in a DNF and a minor tantrum by the driver, who reportedly stormed off in a huff, gunning the GT-R through a paddock populated by spectators. Probably not his proudest moment, but in the ensuing drama, it nonetheless became the spearhead for a movement to award a bunch of "bonus points" to those who failed to negotiate the autocross course successfully. Fortunately, common sense eventually prevailed, with the organizers confirming that a DNF is a DNF and that it wasn't in the spirit of the event to compensate teams for poor performance. Seems perfectly reasonable, though Tony apparently has a different sense of how it all went down. It's clear that he's endeavoring to be candid and honest about what happened, but having a GT-R fall on its face in multiple events turns out to be not the easiest thing to explain away. Read Tony's article here to decide for yourself if he gives a satisfactory defense of the GT-R's finish.

At the end of the day, the question remains: does the GT-R suck or is it just automotive journalists who suck?

 

Both!

 

The Truth About the Nissan GT-R and the Nürburgring Lap Record

By James Ansell
May 21, 2008

I agree with TTAC reviewer Stephan Wilkinson : the new Nissan GT-R is the old Honda NSX. Once people actually start driving Nissan’s “everyday supercar”– as opposed to simply jumping on the hype bandwagon and bench racing numbers supplied by Nissan– they’ll appreciate the parallel. Although I'm still looking forward to my first hands-on experience with the GT-R, the reality of the car’s true nature and importance in automotive history is right under the fan-boys’ noses.

The GT-R allegedly 'outperforms' thoroughbred supercars at a fraction of the price. Yes, but what price? The sticker price, or the in-your-garage price? Considering the hype surrounding the car and the limited production numbers, it will be years before a single new $70k GT-R will be sold for under $100k. At the moment, comparing the Nissan to say, a Corvette Z06, obfuscates the truth. But what the [Green] Hell…

No small part of the current GT-R lovefest can be attributed to the car’s 7:38 Nürburgring lap time. As TTAC has pointed out, there are real questions about the Green Hellmobile’s qualifications for the title “second fastest production car around the ‘Ring.” The car’s suspension was modified from the current Japanese production model, supposedly to reflect the American and European spec. Supposedly. Will anyone get a chance to compare the fabled ‘Ring runner and a final production car? Somehow I doubt it.

Meanwhile, the YouTube video of the Nissan’s “historic run” clearly shows that the GT-R had a flying start. All other manufacturers testing at the ‘Ring use standing starts for published lap times. The video also proves that the car's lap time was not measured at the exact same location (start and stop). Take these two factors into account, and the 7:40 claim seems highly dubious.

The icing on the cake: GT-R chief engineer Kazutoshi Mizuno’s subsequent admission from that "We used cut slick tyres." If that doesn’t cancel their claim, nothing does.

In fact, a regular Corvette Z06 would probably beat the GT-R on the Nürburgring. When Road & Track tested the GT-R against the Z06 on a track much smaller than the ‘Ring, they concluded that the GT-R was fast in the corners, but they didn't shed a whole lot of light on how the GT-R performed on the straights. Although the ‘Ring has an enormous amount of corners, it also has some of the longest straight-aways in the world.

In Road & Track’s technical comparo, the GT-R was just as fast to 60mph as the Z06 (despite being less powerful). What many have over-looked is the trap speed at the end of the 1/4 mile. The Z06 is about seven mph faster than the GT-R. When you look at the graph that accompanies these numbers, the GT-R’s AWD system gave it a clear advantage– but only at the start. Applied to the Green Hell, the Z06 would outpace the GT-R on the straights.

The Z06’s fastest recorded lap time at the Nürburgring is 7:42.9 This lap was driven in 2005 by Jan Magnussen in 'muggy' conditions. Last year, Chevy revised the suspension on all Corvette models including the Z06. In theory, the new suspension and better weather conditions should be enough for a Z06 to equal or even better the Nissan GT-R's true time of +7:40. When you consider that the Z06 can achieve this time with a GM-standard standing start and production tires, it seems obvious that the GT-R is no match for the Z06 around the ring.

But what does it all mean? Well, not much actually. Every racetrack is different and some cars are suited to some tracks while others are not. The GT-R is suited to smaller tracks like the one R&T used, and the Z06 is suited to longer and faster ones like the ‘Ring.

So why did I bother ranting about this? Nissan has chosen to flaunt its Nürburgring lap times to show the world that their new, high-tech Nissan GT-R is the new bang-for-the-buck Alpha. But it’s not true. The cheaper Corvette Z06 is still the worlds best [unmodified] performance car bargain. What’s more, if the GT-R cannot handle a stock Z06, then how will it fare against the upcoming ZR1? Never mind the 'almighty' spec V model.

Given the GT-R’s looks and oft-reported lack of driving feel, there’s only one reason anyone would buy the uber-Nissan: to own the fastest thing on the road. In the corners, maybe. If you were committed enough to drive at 10/10ths (never mind how “easy” it is), you could probably blow-off a 911 or similar. Down the straights (the great American pastime), there are faster and cheaper choices– and that’s without exploring relatively inexpensive modifications.

In short, the GT-R is an awesome achievement, but Wilkinson’s right: it’s not all that.

 

So the Kool-Aid had something in it ?
This will not go well with those drinking, swimming, and bathing in it.
From the very beginning I said the numbers did not add up. Horsepower to weight didn't make sense for these times.
I said times were on slicks, Turbo-boost was bumped, and weight was down. Gut feeling.
All questions answered with "Just because its a Nissan you look down your nose at it."
Seems Nissan is wearing the Pinocchio nose.

This car is great but please do not compare it to the milestone NSX.

 

Here come the fanboys lol!

 

Ugly as hell and sold at a huge markup... no thanks. Gimme an NSX any day over this techo nightmare.

 

Gimme a Z06 and I'm happy. It's not like there are too many decresing radius turns in everyday driving. Long starights however...

 

At least he compares the car to another awesome automobile, the Z06. It's good to see that car finally getting the praise it deserves; it seems it took a manufacturer below the status of Chevrolet to take away all the Corvette-haters' attention.

The fact that the guy says "spec V" and never refers to coming into contact with an actual car gives me the impression that he really doesn't know what he's talking about.

Also he states "it will be years before a single new $70k GT-R will be sold for under $100k." This also leads me to believe the guy doesn't know what he's talking about. This is a car that will go into full production for as long as they can sell it. It might sell over list for a period of time, but compared to similar cars (e.g. the Corvette Z06) it will come down to MSRP, and then perhaps with rebates and the usual after that. A year would be a large estimate; "years" is a gross exaggeration. Even suggesting it will sell for over $100,000 is a fairly large estimate (besides the initial couple months it goes on sale).

In fact, just about every bit of his information is third-hand and internet-sourced, or simply made up in his own mind at some exaggerated rate.

This comes across as a published article from a reliable, newsworthy source but upon reading it one discovers that the guy is full of hot air and speculation.

 

The closest track to my house has a big decreasing radius turn at each end (well, one is increasing and one decreasing depending on which way you're going)

 

So he's the internet?