How difficult is it to sell a US car to someone in Europe? | FerrariChat

How difficult is it to sell a US car to someone in Europe?

Discussion in 'Europe' started by noone1, Jun 26, 2008.

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  1. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
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    I know the countries with the most expensive prices, such as Netherlands and Finland, are expensive because of their taxes. Someone I know mentioned that when converted to USD, the R8 cost about $300K. Now, I paid $135K for mine. So, if I sold it in euros, I could sell way cheap, under their market value, and still not take a hit on depreciation due to favorable currency and relative pricing.

    So, say his taxes are 100% or something crazy like that. He's not going to want to buy the car for 100K euros and pay 100K in taxes, but he would have no problem paying 30K euros and paying 30K euros in taxes. Say I offered to sell him it for 30K euros and between him and I, he gives me 40K euros in business (we both own companies.) So in the end, he pays only 100K euros and I take home 70K euros. Would most countries disallow this? Would most say that he must pay tax on a value that they find it to be worth? Is there a law against deals that are too good?

    I know this is broad, as all countries are different, but I'm curious to know, as foreign buyers have huge buying power here and we US people can keep off depreciation better by selling in foreign markets.
     
  2. Simon

    Simon Moderator
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    Aug 29, 2003
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    Yes, this is fraud. Tax is due on the true value of the goods.


     
  3. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
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    True. And also, depending on the Counrty it may not be easy to bring the car in and sell it. In Portugal there is all kinds of red tape (what else is new). A car from Canada to Portugal will have to stay in the persons name for 5 years before you can sell it!!! But knowing prices in Portugal it will probably still be a deal :D:D
     
  4. PoleApart

    PoleApart Formula 3

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    #4 PoleApart, Jun 29, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2008
    A huge number of people in Poland are currently importing all kinds of cars from the US since our currency has been strenghtening against the Euro, and therefore even more so against the dollar. The import duty is 10% and is the same in all of the EU countries. Next you have to pay the local excise and VAT taxes and registration taxes which can vary from 0 for excise and 17% to 25% for VAT depending on country. In Poland for a car above 2 litre capacity the sum of the cumulated taxes, shipping, customs agency rates, etc. ends up at 50% of the car invoice value. In Germany this would be lower because of no excise and a lower VAT rate. Cars being imported are M Class Mercs, Volvo XC90s etc. The R8's here are about $240.000 new and AFAIK this and next years consignments are sold out.
     
  5. Pav

    Pav Formula 3
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    Just came back from Poland and indeed... Overall all the MB model range gets imported in Poland (mainly E, S, ML, CL). I think i never saw so many W163 US MLs before. Local shop down the road had a Q7, Gd Cherokee and Gd Ch SRT8 on display. My friends fiance got a 3.6(?) Q7 imported recently. Many US Touaregs in Warsaw. In some random village near Opole i saw a kind of shop as you see many of them with deadbeat Passats from Germany... and in the middle... a US RS4 in Red, sedan. Regretting the fact i didn't take a pic. Overall Poland and Baltic states are flooded with US imported european-manufactured cars. Didn't see any attempt to resell somewhere else than on these countries markets.
     
  6. marky1

    marky1 Formula 3
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    You have to provide an EU certificate of Conformity for cars too. If you don't have one you have to do a SVA test (I think) and it's a PITA.
     
  7. ameer20

    ameer20 Rookie

    Nov 9, 2005
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    For 100 k EUR you can buy an Audi R8 here too. Some countries have taxes other than VAT. But the 19% VAT is deductable if you are a company. And what you described is illegal.
     
  8. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
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    And where is here? You profile shows absolutly nothing.
     
  9. Pav

    Pav Formula 3
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    EU certificate is easy to get for recent cars (let's say less than 7 years old) given the car is manufactured in Europe. Bas, even sometimes if the car is made in the US but is from an european manufacturer it works too (cf., W163 ML).

    It's illegal indeed and almost impossible. If you're targetting western europe it cannot be done at all. If you're targetting eastern, rebatting by $10k on a "second" bill of sale for a $40k car is not so uncommon actually. But billing a $100k car for $40k would be amazingly fishy to the autorities and both of the seller and the buyer can be charged with fraud.
     
  10. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
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    Ok, well then I guess I'll just move to Europe and bring my cars with me, then sell them a year later. I'm pretty sure all countries allow you to bring your vehicle tax free as long as you owned it outside of the EU for more than a year.
     
  11. Pav

    Pav Formula 3
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    It's 6 months. :)
     
  12. henkie

    henkie La Passione...
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    Here in The Netherlands you could do that, bring your cars as personal luggage. But they must have been listed on your name in the USA for a year as a minimum. After a year here you could sell them and earn your money. People don't care about US cars, as long as they don't have those terrible huge running lights on their sides.

    By the way, an Audi R8 costs USD 247,287 here.
     
  13. ameer20

    ameer20 Rookie

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    #13 ameer20, Jul 10, 2008
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2008

    I was referring to the EU in general.
     
  14. noone1

    noone1 F1 Rookie
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    Sound like I should stock up on cars before I make my move haha.
     
  15. DriveAfterDark

    DriveAfterDark F1 Veteran

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    378,000 USD for R8 in Norway. We win!
     
  16. marky1

    marky1 Formula 3
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    Guys, what about the other way around. How easy is it to get a new car into the US from the EU?
     
  17. Karim

    Karim Rookie
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    Jul 11, 2008
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    why must people post crap like this in an open forum ........................



    generally its about 35-----45% import tax and some other vat................



    98% of the time its not worth the hassel for people in the eu and other parts to import and people have that sort of money will just go local to a dealer and pick one up say for example in france.........

    so unless you want to sell ur r8 for 1 3rd its value stay out of this failed ided ur are trying to plan.... more or less screwed up paper work can result the car being sent back to the usa and each container trip for 1 car is about 4k each way.........................
     

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